爬中文山

@suMMit

 

I see that you were not always so focused on speaking as you are currently. I plan on reading a lot of graded readers soon and was wondering how that path has been for you since you seem to have read a lot of the ones I plan to.

 

For myself I tried reading the HSK4 textbook and it felt like a wall of text. After 15 graded readers the HSK4 textbook felt quite manageable. I still had to look up a lot of words, my vocabulary still needs more improvement. So have you noticed any improvements based on your investments in reading specifically graded readers? 
 

Tbh I feel like most things, including graded readers, the improvement is too slow to notice and too hard to quantify. I definitely think those Chinese Breezes were worth doing. They provided character practice, vocabulary review, grammar pattern review, some Chinese culture knowledge, entertainment, listening(mp3s), etc. When I started the Hsk 4 textbook there were new words in every text. Now I don't think there is a single word in Hsk 4 Standard course that I don't know. That comes from a combination of all kinds of different reading and listening materials. I don't always correctly use that vocabulary or always employ the correct grammar in my sentences.

I worked through this series myself (along with Mandarin Companion, SinoLingua, and Rainbow Bridge), and one of the most memorable readers was the "I Really Want to Find Her" book, included in one of your pictures above. If I remember correctly, it's about a group of men who find a picture of a random girl, conclude that she looks cute, and then decide to stalk her down and find her. It was the craziest story I've ever read in my life. I can't even begin to imagine what the author was thinking. Ha!

@Woodford@suMMit

I am willing to read them all-every graded reader 500-5000. I have read 15 of the Mandarin Companion's about 4x each, 3 more to go. I can be disciplined however I don't get a lot of "interest" in my language studies. Finishing a textbook,chapter and understanding a passage can be motivational. However, it is not the same kind of interest as being lost in a story and wanting to find out what happens next. That interest can push you and is a type of joy. 

 

I read a graded reader 4 times by reading each chapter 4x and then moving on to the next. The first time is extensive, trying to read fluidly. The second time more words emerge in my head. By the third and fourth I am actively trying to write down or remember every word to read fluently/fluidly. 

 

I really enjoy reading in my native language and I don't actively think, "oh I can learn so many vocabulary words by reading this", or "I will read the entire series to improve my vocabulary". Graded reading is kinda a grey area for me. Sure it could work and provide good results but it is not the same feeling of reading as I have when reading in my 1st language.

 

If a non English speaking person wanted to learn English, I wouldn't advise them to read 60-100 English graded readers, I'd tell them to read IDK 4 simple books* and then read something that they are truly interested in. It is just a little hard to apply that advice to myself.  I am reading something IN ORDER TO learn the language instead of reading interesting content in the language.  Can someone liberate me from graded readers? I am willing to stack 70 or so on the corner of my desk and read each one 4x, but do I have to?

 

*Roald Dahl, C.S Lewis： Perhaps not "simple" but that is all that comes to mind. 

On 2/1/2024 at 11:57 AM, Ledu said:

I can be disciplined

If that's true then no, you don't have to do graded readers. You can keep working on your grammar/textbooks (if you need to) and then read anything else you like for extensive reading. That's provided you're disciplined enough, as you say you are, to not be discouraged by time spent digging around for the right material or by frequent dictionary lookups. 

 

There's many ways to scaffold that process, too:

- You could read interesting material you've already read in English;

- You could ask AI to simplify the texts you want to read;

- And/or you could save texts you've already read 'intensively' into a personal library of extensive-reading material that you can read and re-read to your heart's content.

 

If it's material you like and have chosen yourself - stuff you find enticing, interesting, funny or otherwise inspiring (be it spiritual, poetic, mundane or plain smutty) - then it won't be as much of a chore at all to do that. Yes, that implies setting aside extra time to read those texts intensively first, but it's not like you can get away from any and all vocabulary study if learning vocabulary is your goal. (Plus, it'll be fun, and arguably more effective, to learn words and sentence patterns in their natural environment, rather than in one that's been somehow 'graded' down.)

 

That's if you want liberated from graded readers, as you say. Mind you, there's nothing wrong with them. If anything, it sounds like you should keep one of those around at all times. You ought to aim for as varied a reading diet as you can, especially when motivation flags.

Some good things about graded reading:

* Foundational level, step by step.
* Daily use phrases/ Spoken language 
* Can help me build my ability to read native texts

 

一口吃个胖子
I am impatient to succeed. And I can't get fat by just eating one mouthful. I will keep to the path of graded reading, one "series“ at a time. My Chinese friend says graded reading is beneficial and builds a foundation. Essentially in school a child is reading graded readers each year. I haven't been studying Chinese 10-12 years in a formal school setting. So my analogy about advice for an English learner doesn't apply to me in studying Chinese. I have only studied independently for a few years consistently. I don't have a background knowledge of Chinese that goes back 12 years. 

 

I'm anxious to remove the graded reader step but it might not be best. I have 4 books about Chinese culture which are not graded readers on my shelf. I can try to read those intensely and still stick to the graded reader path. But thanks to anyone with advice pro or against using graded reading. A graded reader is essentially a textbook to me, no difference.  

@Ledu Reading each graded reader 4 times seems like a bit of overkill. I definitely couldn't do that. I read once and listen a couple of times as background listening.

 

Since I enjoy non-fiction somewhat more than fiction and have been really making use of the Chairman's Bao lately. I especially like them since they are genuine news stories. 

 

I like the training wheels of graded material, and don't like being inundated with too much new vocabulary at one time. I do watch native videos and TV pretty often, but it don't "study" it all. Just let it wash over me and catch what I catch. For reading though, five years in, I will stick with graded and textbook for now. 

@suMMit  

 

Yeah it is a lot. Mainly I have read them so much because I was inspired by some post somewhere that Woodforest did the same--read each 4x. I could be wrong though. To one day be able to read native content sounds cool to me. That is where I want to be one day.

 

Also I have read some research article that people really don't make use of their graded readers by reading them enough times. So somewhere I settled on 4x. I don't re-read textbooks though. 

 

After the 2nd time it is a little boring but a few more times and I can read fluidly. Textbooks and graded readers seem like the way forward. If you are interested in another series you can try Ledu, published in 2021. It is the coursebook I currently am working through. I find the passages much more relevant than the official Hanban HSK course which was published in 2014. Maybe I should read graded readers 2x considering I will be reading many. Working through textbooks is not too bad, just some are more relevant and interesting than others. 

@Ledu I can read shorter texts several times, and usually that's because there's a task to complete, where you are forced to read it again and again, like is the case with textbooks or Chairman's Bao. But just reading a a whole book 4 times, I'd lose motivation. I guess Chinese Breeze also has some comprehension questions on each chapter.

 

One thing you could consider is discussing the book, maybe by chapter, with a teacher on italki. That way you have need to read several times so that you can properly discuss your point of view. I currently do this once a week with a Chairmans Bao article, we get through 1 or 2 in an hour and it leads to all sorts of discussion.

 

I've seen the Ledu books on Taobao, and they look interesting, I read them at some point. So many resources, so little time.

 

I am not bothered at all by when something was published. I've learned as much from Kubler(1990s?) as I have from Chairmans Bao(2024). Both are relevant to my daily life.

@sanchuan

 

On 2/2/2024 at 1:57 AM, sanchuan said:

That's provided you're disciplined enough, as you say you are, to not be discouraged by time spent digging around for the right material or by frequent dictionary lookups. 

Thanks for your advice. I appreciate you helping me with this challenge. I think the 17 graded readers I have may be the last I buy.

 

Since posting my last comment here I have worked more In my textbook I am following. There I do "extensive readings" and "intensive readings". In the intensive ones they are full of advanced idioms and HSK 7-9 vocabulary. So since I am basically already reading intensively I might as well go all the way. I will start with Roald Dahl or C.S Lewis first. After HSK 4, the textbooks just all feel advanced (one level). They no longer seem graded. 

 

And for the graded readers I do have, I will re-read them again intensively. I just want to get every word. Not many are giving me advice or challenging my assumptions. By challenging my ideas, I can also benefit. I can even learn new things.  So I appreciate your good ideas.