suffix 住

[wrbt]

I'm looking thru NPCR 3 and in chapter 7 or 8 they have all these drills using 住 in a way I'm not really familiar with. Actually I guess I've seen/heard/used 记住 but have never given much thought to the how/why of it.

It's explained as indicating stabiilization so I guess I get that part but would appreciate some of the more advanced types that wander this fine forum offering further enlightenment.

迷住

停住

找住

It almost seems similar to 着 but ain't.

Comments appreciated, and thanks in advance.

[skylee]

迷住 is ok. I don´t think 停住/找住 are used.

[wrbt]

I looked up 迷住 definition it has "fascinate" which I guess seems related to 迷

Some of the others they had in the pattern drills were:

拿住

站住

停住

爬住

止住

关住

They also did 'em with:

拿得住, 拿不住

站得住, 站不住

etc.

[Quest]

to maintain a state. Not all verbs can be 住ed.

[wrbt]

Thanks again for the help.

So what exactly would 爬住 mean? To continuously climb?

[jonaspony]

looks like you still have the wrong idea with this one. 住 does not continue the action, it indicates that the action is locked on. The process of remembering something is indicated by 记，but the successful locking down of that information is indicated in the phrase 记住。Unable to remember: 记不住. It indicates a grasping. Hence 接住，to catch, 站住, to stand firmly, hold one's ground. It is closer to the verb compliment 好indicating the action is successful. Hope that helps

[roddy]

爬住 would be something like 'cling on' or 'grasp' - couple of Googled examples:

小王子翻船落水后慌忙爬住一块从船上落下的木板 - After the boat overturned and sank the Little Prince hurriedly grasped a plank of wood that had fallen from the boat.

让孩子面对椅背坐好，两腿从椅背下面的空档伸出，双手爬住椅背两边。

Have your child sit facing the back of the chair, put their legs through the gap under the back and grasp each side of the back with their hands.

As said above, the point isn't that it's continual (although that's implied I guess, and I can see how it would be confused) - it's that it's a firm, stable state.

[skylee]

I would think that 抓住 is better for the examples that roddy quoted. I wonder if 爬 is a typo.

[roddy]

Could well be - I think I've seen it before but can't remember where, and even if I have that doesn't mean it isn't a typo. Is that what the NPCR actually has? Certainly sounded plausible to me (sh)

[HashiriKata]

I don't think it's a typo, but I think 抓住 and 爬住 may be quite close in meaning. I've found this example:

爬住我手别放，我帮你出来。

Keep a firm hold on me,I'll help you out.

[wrbt]

Ah shyte you're right, good call.

I saw "zhua" without really digesting it, so read it wrong... it was just lists of pattern drills so no context to assist on skimming over the page.

Zhua zhu makes a hell of a lot more sense.

Thanks for the help.

[againstwind]

It almost seems similar to 着 but ain't

ain't.

here 住 should play the rule we call 动结式第二成分，which means 住 and the anterior verb form a perfect. (i am sure perfect shouldn't equal 动结式, but anyway it means finished actions)

there are three kinds of usages.

1)means to pause or to stop actions going on. 得 and 不 can be inserted.

e.g.

停住

挡住去路

拖住后腿

遮住了眼睛

你拿得住这袋子东西吗？

我站不住了

2）means fastness and fixedness. 得 and 不 can be inserted.

e.g.

拿住，别松手！

我捉住了一只蝴蝶。

她的琴声把我吸引住了。

你记得住他的电话号码吗？

他恐怕支持不住了！

3) with some verbs and 得 or 不， forming phrases, some of which have been become words.

e.g.

伊阿古(Iago) 这个人靠不住。

他对得住你，是你对不住他。

我实在忍不住了，笑了出来。

So what exactly would 爬住 mean?

i can't say 爬住 is wrong arbitrarily, but it's really foreign, in my opinion. context is needed.

as for roddy's example from google, i am inclind that it should have been 扒住 (ba1 zhu4)， which means cling to or hold to.

and skylee's explanation on 抓住 is reasonable.

[roddy]

Well, I still think you should be able to say 爬住, makes perfect sense to me

[HashiriKata]

Well, I still think you should be able to say 爬住, makes perfect sense to me

Roddy, did you see my previous post?

By the way, concerning the insertion of 得 and 不: to make the phrase in question "potential": can or cannot (do).

[roddy]

Yeah, clearly a typo

Where'd the example come from? To be honest I'd like to see something not on the Internet, I've got in trouble for trusting Google far too often.

That said, a perfectly plausible (to me) usage of 爬住 is here - long page, so CTRL-F and search for 爬住. However, when you're dredging the bottom of the Internet for examples the usage is probably either non-standard (ie wrong) or so rare you'll hardly ever even see it.

[HashiriKata]

Where'd the example come from? To be honest I'd like to see something not on the Internet, I've got in trouble for trusting Google far too often.

I got it from iciba.com. I simply copied & pasted the example including the English translation, without changing a single thing but you may not believe this: with your question, I went back to the page I got the example from to give you the link but found that the example was simply gone, leaving no trace!!!!

Anyway, here's the page I got the example from:

http://dj.iciba.com/search?s=%E7%88%AC%E4%BD%8F

[Quest]

戈兰高地上的以军M3半履带车，地上爬住的是叙军战俘

I agree 爬住 is non-standard (I would refrain from saying it's wrong, but it is). The sentence above should be 爬着的。

趴住, however, is okay.

[adrianlondon]

One of the teachers at BNU yesterday used the words 叫住 when discussing what's likely to happen when you haggle with market traders. As you walk away and the trader wants to get you back, offering you a cheaper price, he'll "jiao zhu". I asked her what it meant, and she explained that the trader would stand still and call you back, rather than come out to get you.

"remember" and "stand still" are the only other times I've used this construction. However, I think it's cool and might try to use it more. I seem to have an ability to make all my Chinese friends laugh at me with my special made-up-grammar Mandarin skills. Unfortunately, that just encourages me.