Sophisticated Cursing

[daxia]

I though that I would be cool to have a thread where we could write down some good ways to curse people in Chinese.

I dont mean the usual, lowlife "操你妈的屄" etc. bullshit that makes you sound like a uneducated fool, but some more sophisticated ways.

I hope this is ok with the admin....

[roddy]

I hope this is ok with the admin....

Got to love the way people can take the time to say that, but not the common courtesy of a message to ask in advance. Why even bother saying it?

[daxia]

Got to love the way people can take the time to say that, but not the common courtesy of a message to ask in advance. Why even bother saying it?

Basically, its kind of an insurance to not look surprised or stupid.

Let me explain: I am pretty sure that this thread is ok with you, *BUT* if it wouldn't be and the thread still would be deleted/whatever, by writing "I hope this is ok with the admin" I prove that I wasn't 100% sure and with other words I "knew" it might happen. I was not taken by surprise.

[mind_wander]

Yeah, I understand what your talking about, another form of sophisticated cursing is more negative sarcastic slurs. The more sarcastic slurs are elaborated, then this could be another form of cursing out. I don't know too many examples, plus it is in appropriate.

[HashiriKata]

I dont mean the usual, lowlife "操你妈的屄" etc. bullshit that makes you sound like a uneducated fool

How could a refined, educated person like you utter such "bullshit that makes you sound like a uneducated fool" ???

(My question is an example of "sophiticated cursing" you're asking for, by the way.)

[daxia]

(My question is an example of "sophiticated cursing" you're asking for, by the way.)

Well, the reason I started the thread was that I dont know that many ways. Although, some extremely easy ones that everyone probably know is for example:

衣冠禽兽 - a "brute" in fine clothes (westerners ?)

东亚病夫 - The "Sick Chinese" (I dont know how to translate this one good)

一个耳朵大,一个耳朵小 -son of a pig and a dog

瞎子拉琴 - pointless chatter

打得你屁眼开花-To beat the shit out of someone

操你十八代祖宗-Fvck your ancestors (not to sophisticated, but useful)

As you can see, I dont know allot, but I would really like to learn more. Anyone who has some good ones ?

[againstwind]

I think you may consider your so-called Sophisticated Cursing as some language taboo.

Any language has lots of taboo. So does Chinese.

[daxia]

I think you may consider your so-called Sophisticated Cursing as some language taboo.

Any language has lots of taboo. So does Chinese.

Actually, I dont undestand what you mean. Are you saying that cursing in Chinese is Taboo ? And if it is taboo, does that mean that you can't learn it ?

Whats your point ?

[yonitabonita]

I can't think of any examples in any language where cursing can sound 'sophisticated'. If you're wanting to convey some sort of insult without sounding like "an uneducated fool", you might resort to wit. (which a previous poster has already done) The difficulty with wit is that there are no stock standard witty phrases. Now there's a dilemma...

A little off topic, but related anyhow. I think that using swear words and curses in foreign languages often make the speaker sound like a bit of a 'try hard' for want of a better term. No problem learning how to understand swear words, but swearing is a different matter. It's hard to judge the context correctly. And when playing around with insults, I think you'd want to know you can master your weapon before you go firing away.

Swearing might get you a few chuckles from certain audiences, but I bet the novelty wears off pretty soon. Listening to non-native English speakers misuse 'fuck' makes my skin crawl sometimes. My honest opinion is that they're trying really hard to show off, but in the absence of better language skills, they pull out the dirty language skills. I'll bet the same goes for all languages.

Yonitabonita

[roddy]

Basically, its kind of an insurance to not look surprised or stupid.

Let me explain: I am pretty sure that this thread is ok with you, *BUT* if it wouldn't be and the thread still would be deleted/whatever, by writing "I hope this is ok with the admin" I prove that I wasn't 100% sure and with other words I "knew" it might happen. I was not taken by surprise.

And you manage to do all that thinking without coming up with the idea of 'Hey, why don't I just send him a message to ask before I go ahead and post it.' Genius.

I pretty much agree with yonitabonita - by all means learn them if it's the kind of thing you hear a lot (although I have no idea how you would manage to do that. Dubbed South Park reruns?) but learning stuff like this for actual use is borderline pointless. Used to work with an English guy who started his Chinese off with swearwords, and he was funny for about a week. After that nobody wanted to sit with him at dinner.

The difficulty with wit is that there are no stock standard witty phrases. Now there's a dilemma...

Unless you are from Britain, in which case you get to quote Blackadder. . .

[daxia]

I can't think of any examples in any language where cursing can sound 'sophisticated'. If you're wanting to convey some sort of insult without sounding like "an uneducated fool", you might resort to wit. (which a previous poster has already done) The difficulty with wit is that there are no stock standard witty phrases. Now there's a dilemma...

A little off topic, but related anyhow. I think that using swear words and curses in foreign languages often make the speaker sound like a bit of a 'try hard' for want of a better term. No problem learning how to understand swear words, but swearing is a different matter. It's hard to judge the context correctly. And when playing around with insults, I think you'd want to know you can master your weapon before you go firing away.

Swearing might get you a few chuckles from certain audiences, but I bet the novelty wears off pretty soon. Listening to non-native English speakers misuse 'fuck' makes my skin crawl sometimes. My honest opinion is that they're trying really hard to show off, but in the absence of better language skills, they pull out the dirty language skills. I'll bet the same goes for all languages.

Although I don't consider myself to be a expert in Chinese, I have been living here for 5 years soon, and I think that I can judge when and when not to use that kind of language.

Still, cursing and swearing is a part of the language and it can be very hard to learn it, especially for a foreigner, since you are kind of treated differently. And it's not like I can ask my teachers to teach me how to curse people.

[roddy]

Why not? I fail to see how you can ask us, but not them.

[adrianlondon]

I though that I would be cool to have a thread where we could write down some good ways to curse people in Chinese.

你爸爸是一只仓鼠，你妈妈也闻起来像接骨木。

I hope it's appreciated. The last 3 characters were a bitch to translate.

[skylee]

I like elderflower sweets. I think it smells good.

I think insulting someone's parents or family is unbearable. A simple 沒教養 is enough for a fight, so comparing someone's father to a hamster is quite unacceptable.

[nephridium]

I can't think of any examples in any language where cursing can sound 'sophisticated'.

I'd disagree. For example in English, just take a nice quote from Shakespeare and you'll always sound (though not necessarily be) sophisticated, even when cursing. Just a few of my favorite:

"False face must hide what the false heart doth know." - from Macbeth

"Thou loathed issue of thy father's loins!" - from Richard III

"[Thou art] the veriest varlet that ever chewed with a tooth." - from King Henry IV

More can be found at http://www.pangloss.com/seidel/Shaker/index.html - the "Shakespearean Insulter".

I doubt there is an equivalent Chinese version of, say, 孔夫子 on the web ;), but maybe there are some curses in Chinese classical works such as 三國演義 or 水滸傳 to be found. I don't know, they are still to hard for me to read.

In general though, sophisticated people in China, Korea, Japan etc. usually don't curse other people directly, because it is highly disrespectful given the cultural background. (But honestly in certain situations I personally might resort to something indirect along the lines of the Macbeth quote up there.) The thing is, what is there to gain through cursing? Does is help the situation at all? I'd rather just be done with it and find my 'balance' through some other less aggravating means.

That being said, some clever lines by 孔夫子 if uttered accent-free by a laowai might really make for some baffled looks in certain situations. E.g. "君子喻於義，小人喻於利" (the mind of a great man is centered on righteousness, that of a small man on personal gain) or "君子泰而不驕，小人驕而不泰" (a great man stands firm but is not arrogant, a small man does not stand firm but behaves arrogantly - 泰 is hard to translate here) - and always remember: "He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

[adrianlondon]

comparing someone's father to a hamster is quite unacceptable

You're not a Monty Python fan, then.

[djwebb2004]

I pretty much agree with yonitabonita - by all means learn them if it's the kind of thing you hear a lot (although I have no idea how you would manage to do that. Dubbed South Park reruns?) but learning stuff like this for actual use is borderline pointless. Used to work with an English guy who started his Chinese off with swearwords, and he was funny for about a week. After that nobody wanted to sit with him at dinner.

In reply to Roddy and others: yes, it is difficult to think of a situation where quality chinese people (素质高一点的) would want to hear swearwords. It is a bit of a cross-cultural thing, as the guy Roddy referred to might just be directly translating his English into Chinese - and his English, replete with expletives, might sound perfectly normal, as we do use them more than the Chinese do.

This whole subject was brought home to me recently when watching Little Britain - 小小英国人 - a set of 8 CDs that I bought recently in China. Although in the UK context the humour in those CDs is hilarious, I have found that Chinese friends often find the whole thing distasteful - particularly the sketch where an adult man insists on his mother breastfeeding him in public. I tried to explain that the over-the-top nature of some of the sketches was why they were funny, but some of the sketches just seem puerile and unnecessary from a Chinese point of view.

[in_lab]

Here's some good ones in English.

http://reluctantnomad.blogspot.com/2006/09/insults-they-just-dont-make-them-as.html

Samples:

"He can compress the most words into the smallest idea of any man I know."

Abraham Lincoln

"He has no enemies, but is intensely disliked by his friends."

Oscar Wilde

"He is a self-made man and worships his creator."

John Bright

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."

Oscar Wilde

[Ncao]

"He is a self-made man and worships his creator."

John Bright

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."

Oscar Wilde

I don't understand these 2 insults.

[in_lab]

"He is a self-made man and worships his creator."

Explanation: He is self-made, therefore he is his creator and he worships himself.

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."

Explanation: They cause happiness when they go [away] because you are glad they are gone.