Why not Tianjin?

[mitch]

Hello,

I'm a Dutch undergraduate planning on studying Chinese in China for at least a year. I've been reading through a lot of threads on this forum, and many of my questions were answered, but one important new one arose.

While doing my research on where in China to go, one of my choices was the city of Tianjin. However, despite its proximity to Beijing, I never see the city being mentioned in threads by people asking for good locations to study. How come there's no Tianjin in the frequently mentioned list of Harbin, Dalian, Qingdao, etc.?

Moreover, in most cases where people have questions about Tianjin, they're being referred to tianjinexpats.net. This however is probably not where I will find an answer.

Any information on Tianjin would be very much appreciated. Specifically information on whether it's a good place to study Mandarin Chinese for a year, or not at all.

Thanks in advance.

[studentyoung]

However, despite its proximity to Beijing, I never see the city being mentioned in threads by people asking for good locations to study. How come there's no Tianjin in the frequently mentioned list of Harbin, Dalian, Qingdao, etc.?

Well, in my opinion, those who like cooler weather in summer would prefer Harbin; and those who like clean air, sunlight, beaches, scenic spots and historic sites would prefer Dalian, Qingdao. Dalian and Qingdao are traveling cities, which are quite suitable for those who want to go traveling while studying, need clear air and leisure atmosphere, but don't want to suffer from the high consumption level and fast-pace city life in Beijing.

Any information on Tianjin would be very much appreciated. Specifically information on whether it's a good place to study Mandarin Chinese for a year, or not at all.

Oh, check the links below, please!

http://www.enorth.com.cn/news/link/english/tianjin/education/english/tianda.htm

http://www.tjqwbgs.gov.cn/news/shownews.asp?id=589

http://www.tjfsu.edu.cn/en/

Thanks!

[djwebb2004]

I studied in Tianjin for one year. The accent is less standard than Beijing, although not a problem either. It is close enough to Beijing to go on day trips by train and come back the same day (87 miles away). But there is absolutely nothing to see in Tianjin, no tourist sites at all. The best things are: the Ancient Culture Street, selling paintings and what-not, the Goubuli Baozi shop, which is famous throughout China, and the Jianbingguozi which are a Tianjin speciality for breakfast and are also sold widely elsewhere in China. When I was there there were very few foreigners in Tianjin, mostly at Nankai University (a famous institution that all Chinese will tell you Zhou Enlai attended). If the tuition fee and accommodation fee (I lived in the dormitory in 1992/93) are cheaper than Beijing, Tianjin might be a good choice if you don't mind lack of foreigners, lack of tourist sites. When I was there there were no clubs in Tianjin, but it was a long time ago, and probably the place has a good nightlife scene, but probably inferior to Beijing all the same.

[HashiriKata]

However, despite its proximity to Beijing[/b'], I never see the city being mentioned in threads by people asking for good locations to study.

I'd say that is because of its proximity to Beijing.

[trevelyan]

Well... at risk of launching a flamewar I'll point out that (1) Tianjin has a pretty distinctive accent which a lot of people consider quaint but bird-like -- places like Harbin have a much more standard dialect, (2) Tianjin is a massive city but has a pretty underwhelming assortment of things to do, unless you plan on making weekly tours of the Zhou Enlai memorial museum.

A lot less English-language distractions though.

[skylee]

But there is absolutely nothing to see in Tianjin

So it is true. I went there on a day trip from Beijing a few years ago and this is exactly what I felt.

[HashiriKata]

But there is absolutely nothing to see in Tianjin

What about Travelan's weekly tours of the Zhou Enlai memorial museum ???

[mitch]

Thanks a lot for all of your answers, this is definitely the best place I could've come for good answers.

1. So there isn't much to see in Tianjin. But Beijing is only one or two hours away, right? So for sightseeing trips I could go there just as easy, so overall I'd have easier access to more sightseeing spots/places than if living in Harban or Dalian, ie where I'd be much more restricted to one city. Or am I mistaken/thinking too naively? Please correct me if I'm wrong.

2. As for language, how much will the local dialect inhibit my learning? When I was in Japan I learned most of my Japanese from hanging with Japanese friends (mostly guys and girls in their twenties, both educated and uneducated). Will their Tianjin counterparts all speak with a heavy accent/dialect, or just the 'uneducated' ones? I like having friends of different social backgrounds (ie not only university students), will this be a problem?

[Yang Rui]

If you're planning on studying for "at least a year" then i'm not sure you should worry about there being interesting tourist sites. It's true there's not much to see in Tianjin as a tourist, but i think it's an ok place to live. I was there for a year and had a thoroughly jolly time.

It's big, dirty and polluted, but then most Chinese cities are. In Tianjin you're probably getting a more typical Chinese experience than you would studying in Dalian, Qingdao, Xiamen etc.

I think the reason it is not mentioned very much is that there is nothing that particularly stands out about the city. It is overshadowed by Beijing. But basically, a place is only as good as the people you meet there. I went there and made a few good friends and look back on my time there fondly. However, i have also spent time in Qingdao and i think that this is a much pleasanter place because it's by the sea and less polluted.

I studied at Tianjin Normal University and found the teachers very good and very kind. I would recommend it to anyone looking to study Chinese, particularly at a higher level. The intermediate classes tend to be oversubscribed and huge though. Pm me if you want more specific info.

[HashiriKata]

As a place for studying, I'd say go for it. It's nearly as good/ bad as Beijing but less distractions.

[djwebb2004]

2. As for language, how much will the local dialect inhibit my learning? When I was in Japan I learned most of my Japanese from hanging with Japanese friends (mostly guys and girls in their twenties, both educated and uneducated). Will their Tianjin counterparts all speak with a heavy accent/dialect, or just the 'uneducated' ones? I like having friends of different social backgrounds (ie not only university students), will this be a problem?

Realistically speaking, your friends are likely to be in the main either university students or graduates, people who can speak good Mandarin, but, yes, younger people in Tianjin can speak putonghua, and the local accent is not that far from standard Mandarin anyway (nothing like the Sichuan dialect, for example). I think this issue is way, way overblown. Tianjin hua is distinctive, but **I doubt you will even notice that there is such a thing** as Tianjin dialect.

[Crivens200]

It depends where you will study in beijing. If you plan to study at one of the universities in a class of 30 other foreigners and hang out in that crap bar on campus with all the other saddo's and speak english every night then maybe Tianjin is a better option.

If you think you'll spend a lot of time in Beijing just cos it's close, I would doubt that one.

I suspect that if you did live in Tianjin for a while and went to Beijing often you would begin to regret living in tianjin. Beijing is a better city to live in than tianjin - that's a fact.

[Crivens200]

. . . . and all this talk of local dialect's affecting your learning is a red herring. Nearly 100% of people you hang out with will be youngsters who speak perfectly good mando.

[梅克立]

I wouldn't really recommend living in Tianjin. It is pretty dull. I lived there for a while and had a fun time (studied at Nankai) but the following year moved to Beijing. Beijing was SO much better. Tianjin, for a city of 6+ million people, actually seems kind of dead. Stuff closes up early and most of the people I met were hell bent on studying (not a bad thing, but not what I wanted to do).

Don't kid yourself thinking Beijing is just a hop, skip, and a jump away from Tianjin either. The mileage looks short but it's kind of a pain. If you study at tianjin daxue or nankai it is probably a 30 min cab ride to the train station (give or take with traffic). From there you have to horse around and buy your ticket (always a battle), hop the train (hope it doesn't break down) for about 90 minutes, get off in Beijing and be amazed by the sheer amount of people at the train station, and hop a cab to wherever you are going in Beijing (I recommend walking two blocks away from the train station so you don't wait in that long line). If you bus it, factor in even MORE time. Plus if you are making a day trip the last train to return from Beijing leaves way too early, I think 7:30 pm. Ridiculous.

I vote Beijing or Qingdao.

[anonymoose]

I spent over a year in Dalian. It certainly is a pleasant city, and quite scenic in some places. However, there is very little of a traditional Chinese flavour, or much historical significance. I've not been to Tianjin so I can't compare, but if you are planning on staying for a year I think you'd be better of considering what you would be doing on a day-to-day basis rather that what sights there are in the city. The sights of Dalian, nice though they are, are not as important as the clean environment and the relatively temperate climate that the city offers.

[babygodzilla]

well actually, i was reading an issue of TIME magazine the other day, about Asia's pollution, and well I thought Beijing was pretty dirty, but lo and behold good ol Beijing didnt make it to the top 10 filthiest city in Asia. but guess what, to my surprise, TIANJIN took number 3!!!

so that may be something you can reflect on...

[djwebb2004]

It *may* be true that Tianjin is more polluted than Peking; as far as I know some polluting factories are being moved out of the capital. But I would hesitate to make anything out of a Time article. Did Time journalists go and measure the pollution themselves? Or are they relying on official statistics? Of course, the latter, andd the official statistics count for nothing. In both Peking and Tientsin, to give them their proper names, you are subject to dust and sand blown in from the Mongolian desert...

[babygodzilla]

ummm lets see, Sources: World Resources Institute, World Health Organization, World Bank, United Nations Convention to Combat Desertification, International Uninon for the Conservation of Nature and Natural resources...etc...

why would official statistics count for nothing? theyre not done by Chinese officials, if thats what you're hinting at. theyre done by international, non-profit organizations, so most likely no propaganda involved.

besides, the chart is for ASIA'S MOST POLLUTED CITIES (micrograms of particulate matter per cu m), so you're probably right, it may not cover dust blowin from the north and stuff like that. just pollution.

besides, i think it makes a whole lotta sense that Beijing is much cleaner than Tianjin, or most other cities, with the coming Olympics and all.

[djwebb2004]

ummm lets see, Sources: World Resources Institute, World Health Organization, World Bank, United Nations Convention to Combat Desertification, International Uninon for the Conservation of Nature and Natural resources...etc...

These bodies get their information from national governments; they do not collect primary statistics. The WHO, the World Bank etc do not have a presence in each Chinese county; the Chinese government does. Chinese companies do not report statistics to international bodies; they do report statistics to the Chinese government. None of these international organisations has any statistics on China besides what the Chinese government supplies them.

I said myself that Beijing is being cleaned up. But I made the point that the official statistics in and of themselves don't mean anything.