First-stage IUP decisions have gone out

[derekws]

This is for anyone applying to IUP or interested in the program.

I received an email today saying I qualified for the 10-minute language interview. It also said that I didn't qualify for tuition reduction based on my paper application score. IUP comes with a high sticker price, so when I read this, I saw my whole bank account flash before my eyes. I'm praying that one of the outside fellowships I applied for will come through.

But first things first - I have to pass the interivew. On that subject, the email didn't say much about requirements or expecations. It had more or less the same language about deposits and refunds that you can find on IUP's website. http://ieas.berkeley.edu/iup/admissions_language.html

As for me, if IUP doesn't work out for whatever reason, I'll still go to China. Harbin or Dalian seem like good possibilities.

Anyway, I just wanted to share. And while you're here - does anyone have thoughts about whether IUP is worth it, if you don't get funding?

best,

d

[doumeizhen]

There are two threads on the Interview-process here already: This and this.

As for whether or not its worth it.... Tricky question. It depends on the kind of student you are and what you want to do. I am paying myself, and if I had to do it again I might only have done a half a year. That is when I learned the most, including the discipline to actually do things on my own. I can read, I can write, now its just a matter of moving up to being graceful in public and under fire. The advanced classes work on this, plus you get the opportunity to study your own materials or work on fixing serious problems. If you don't need that, it seems that people who do a half year also do very well after they leave.

So I think its good. It forces you to sit down and work. You'll get a good foundation. You can also learn a lot from just being in China, especially if you have studied before. Just think through what your needs and goals are, and decide from there.

[derekws]

Doumeizhen - thanks for telling me about your time at IUP, it's very useful to hear from someone who's actually done it. I also found the posts about the phone interview, and it doesn't seem so daunting.

Can I ask, had you studied in China before, and if so how did IUP rate against that experience? For instance, how much more did you get out of the class hours, class size, etc., or anything else you might add.

The reason I ask is, if I decide not to do IUP (or if i fail the interview), I'm planning to go somewhere up north (e.g., HIT or Harbin U. of Science and Technology) to study for an academic year. I know nothing's really as intensive as IUP, but I still think I can get a ton out of something else. I foresee myself being disciplined in Harbin.

Thanks in advance. I hope you see this and get the chance to reply.

[derekws]

I had my interview and passed it. From the time I answered the phone I could tell it was supposed to be pretty low pressure, but that didn't detract from my nervousness in the slightest. What a wreck I was. But I passed.

So, with one self-imagined ordeal overcome, I now have the tough analysis of whether I can afford IUP. I'm still hanging on for one last fellowship decision, and if I get that, I'm good. If not, though, IUP might be a real scrape. Still, I really really want to go, so I might just bite it.

But here's a question to all: how much more would I learn at IUP vs. a school like Heilongjiang or HIT (i.e., a school in a Mandarin-speaking area where there are few distractions and fewer English speakers). Can anyone comment on the rigor of the courses in those Harbin schools, or elsewhere in Dongbei?

Last little idea: I'm considering applying to ICLP and to the MOE enrichment fellowship (taiwan gov fellowship). ICLP tuition is still pricey - $11,100 - but with the enrichment stipend of $700/month, I could take care of almost all my other Taipei expenses. Does anyone have experience with the enrichment fellowship? Any idea of selectivity?

Anyway, I wanted to update the board with my results, since I've gotten a lot of use from the information others have shared here with me.

Best

[gato]

But here's a question to all: how much more would I learn at IUP vs. a school like Heilongjiang or HIT (i.e., a school in a Mandarin-speaking area where there are few distractions and fewer English speakers).

I think it would depend on your background. What level is your Chinese (reading, writing, and speaking)? How disciplined of a student are you?

[derekws]

"What level is your Chinese (reading, writing, and speaking)? How disciplined of a student are you?"

Took three years in college, but in the three years since I graduated I've no classroom instruction. Spent the summer of 2005 working in Beijing, which was a nice chance to practice, and in the last few months I've hired a tutor - however, for the most part, I've let Chinese fall by the way.

As for specifics, like words or characters known, I have no clue. I know I can't read a newspaper, at least not without heavy reliance on a dictionary.

My track record doesn't necessarily mean I won't be disciplined next year (and I *have* worked hard in the few months in the runup to the interview), but I could also see myself benefitting from the forced discipline of IUP.

My goal is to get as proficient as I can in the next year. I'll start a career as a lawyer in the US in Fall 2008, and ultimately I would like to be able to use Chinese professionally. I might not get there with just one year at IUP or anywhere, but I'd like to be on my way. If that means going to IUP, ok. If it means going to HIT and working my fingers to the bone and hiring extra tutors, that's ok, too.

[gato]

I think those who can already read a newspaper comfortably or those who are already fluent in spoken Mandarin due to a family background (e.g. overseas Chinese) can for the most part study on their own to raise their Chinese level even higher.

But I think in your case you would benefit from IUP, and since you may use Chinese for work, I think a year of IUP is worth the investment. Once you can read Chinese newspapers without a dictionary, you should be able to read most Chinese legal documents if you've also learned the necessary legal terms. Chinese legal documents, I would say, are easier to read than Chinese novels because the vocabulary used is much limited (no four-character Chengyus, for instance).

[derekws]

Thanks, gato. You seem to know your stuff. I think you're right.

[xianu]

Having gone to ICLP, I can tell you that the instruction is EXCELLENT and living in Taiwan was very pleasant, in ways that mainland never was. The teachers at ICLP actually trained the IUB/IUP teachers years ago when IUP decided to move their center to mainland. Kind of like you, I studied 3 yrs in the states, plus 1 yr in Beijing (Beida), but no language training persay between 1993 and 1998, when I went to ICLP. They are EXCELLENT at getting someone from that comfortable state of intermediate functional fluency and teaching/drilling you with new vocab until you can actually speak like a real person on more topics that just "I am ... my major is ...." Many of the ICLP teachers have been with them for 10+ years, and are very good at what they do. ICLP also offers some partial scholarships. I ended up paying only about $7,000 for the academic year there. IUP is more recognized by US institutions (Chinese language folks all know about both) but people like financial aid and the US dept of ed tended to not want to recognize ICLP for loan deferments (at least not in 1998-99). However, on the plus side, the ICLP curriculum is not subject to certain gov't restrictions on content that IUP needs to follow. If IUB and funding fall through, consider ICLP.

[derekws]

Xianu,

Thanks for your post. You make ICLP sound very appealing, and in fact I'm planning to put in an application, at the very least to give myself more options. And who knows, if I get in and the money is better, it might be the better choice. I'm also applying for the Taiwan MOE Mandarin enrichment scholarship, which if I received would cover a lot of my living expenses in Taipei.

Can I ask, are all the ICLP textbooks in traditional characters? I know it'd be simple enough to go from simplified (which is what I've studied so far) to traditional and back again, but I was just wondering.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

D