North Korea from China / Dandong

[aussie_mate]

Pravit-

I went in on my Australian passport which states my nationalily as Australian. However, I am 100% asian in blood....lol so I travelled (as the sole 'foreigner') with a Chinese group.

As far as getting a vsia goes, just email your details to Mr Zhang and wait for his reply. He seems to have had a lot of experience with the DPRK complications.

I left some luggage and my mobile phone with the travel agency. They keep it in one of their offices which has 2 full-time women. They have a safe too if you have say a laptop.

[pandaxiongmao]

Speaking of rules, I'd be interested to know if North Korea is still making people sign a document that says they will not publish anything (including blog entries) about the content of their visit without first getting explicit approval. They were doing that in 2005.

[koreth]

If that rule is still around, it seems to be a widely-ignored one judging by the number of NK travel blogs around the net. (Or maybe those people all got approval.)

aussie_mate - Thanks for the trip report. Do you know if that travel agency has any English speakers on staff?

[aussie_mate]

I don't see how they would be enable to enforce that rule really.

koreth- I'm not sure, I only ever spoke Chinese

[xmorejon]

Hi,

Yes, they are still asking to sign such a Document. By the way, you must also sign you are not a Journalist or that you don't work in any Newspaper.

Luckily none of us is a Journalist, we are 7 Catalan (from Barcelona) and 1 American girl travelling there on August. No problem for Americans this year!

Maybe you can help. We will assist to Mass Games and we must decide which seats to buy. There is 65€, 120€ to 300€.

I heard somewhere you pay what you pay, all foreigners are placed in same area. Is that true? I doubt it.

Are the 65€ seats good enough? They say it is an absolute MUST see but 120€ is a lot.

What should we do?

Thank you.

Xavier

[adrianlondon]

A journalist from the BBC went to N Korea and wrote a short blog on the BBC news site.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6561427.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6564517.stm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6567701.stm

(3 pages)

[koreth]

xmorejon - The travelogues I've read that touch on that subject say the cheapest seats are perfectly fine. One of them even speculates that paying the extra money would land you the same exact seat, just with less money in your pocket. As far as I know nobody has gone twice and paid both amounts to see the difference, so it's all speculation.

When are you guys going? Which company are you arranging the tour through? Maybe it would make sense to merge your group and the one that's trying to form here, since it sounds like you have plenty of people to knock the price down to reasonable levels.

[xmorejon]

Thank you koreth. We will take the "cheap" ones.

We are going from 21 August to 25 August. We the tour with "Viatjes Pujol" a Catalan Company with large experience in Korea (I guess their have a contact in Xina) We allready paid so I don't think we can knock the price down

[Jesaya]

Hey.

I want to go to North Korea around the 20th of July this year. Are there any tour groups being organized by that time?

[koreth]

Has anyone done anything more with this lately? I tried sending some email to aussie_mate's travel agency (in Chinese, of course) but never heard back from them.

[london82]

Not sure if this is the best place to write this, but here is my quick tuppence worth on the company I went with from Dandong.

I went with the company I mentioned in post 13 of this thread. The trip was adjusted to 5 days instead of 4 and against what you would imagine prices are negotiable. Bargain to get around 5500 Rmb for 5 days including the Arirang ticket. I'm not exactly sure where the bottom limit of the price is on this trip but if I went again I would try alot lower as I didnt realise it was negotiable.

I stongly recommend this company as the prices are alot cheaper than the western companies and I am strongly under the impression that once we got to North Korea everything was the same as Koryo tours for example. People say that the big companies have more swaying power with the Korean government and I can't see how this could be true. There are a list of things you are allowed to do and a list of things you are not allowed to do and it seems quite simple when you get there. They are not going to let a travel company do things they are not comfortable with. We saw the big expensive tour groups everywhere we went, doing exactly the same things as us, in fact we had a nicer bus. I was therefore under the impression that when you are handed over to the Koreans on the other side of the border you are all the same to them. The hotel you stay in is different though I think. But ours was too nice anyway, complete with revolving restaurant.

I am not getting paid for this (probably hence why I have written it so quickly) so that's my tuppence worth. Oh and I did send my passport to this 'random' company in Dandong for the visa and it arrived safely and they were completely reputable. I sent it less than 2 weeks ahead.

Arirang ticket - I had the cheapest and I could tell it was the cheapest as I imagine other seats would have been better but it was still absolutely amazing and I don't think the higher price would have been worth it.

On reflection I think the only thing our trip missed was a trip around a dept store that apparently you can arrange in advance. But this was only because before we went we didn't know what to request but I have looked at other companies iteniaries since getting back and I think this is the only thing I would have liked to have done.

I really think 5 days enough. For me, the best part was the subway and seeing North Koreans and asking questions. The longer trips seem to involve more building and monument trips and I already feel that we did enough of that.

If you do go, make sure you bring, writing books, pens, pencils or anything you can give as presents for the children in the childrens performance that I think every group has to go to. Additionally, and I didn't think about this, I would bring nice food for the guides and their children. Maybe chocolate bars or even western alcohol or anything you think they might like.

And dietary wise, the food is ok but I recommend you bring lots of fruits, as there is vegetables but almost no fruits and some of us had digestion problems.

I can't think of anything else right now but I'd be happy to answer any questions. Hope this is helpful.

emma

[koreth]

I emailed london82's agent and found out a couple new things.

• They've moved the start time of the fall Arirang to August 1. End time is still mid-October.
  
• The price for US citizens is higher than for people from elsewhere: 9500RMB, plus 400RMB for the Arirang ticket. I have not tried to negotiate that down yet. I don't know if the travel agent or North Korea is responsible for that price.
  

That's a bit steep, honestly, but if it's negotiable (and if others are still interested in going at the same time to get a group discount) I might be able to swing it.

Anyone else still up for this? I'm happy to do it a couple days earlier than originally suggested (say, August 13) if that helps.

[london82]

If you can get the group to around 10 people then the price will become negotiable. I reckon to around the 5000 kuai mark including arirang ticket. I don't know what the korean government takes but the Chinese pay alot less than 5000. My group reached the 10 people mark only 6 weeks ish before leaving so maybe just register now and agree on a price nearer the time. I agreed on the price even after I had sent them my passport. I realise that's not a very strong bargaining tactic however, that's why I settled higher than I think was necessary.

[Pravit]

Thanks for the info London82 and welcome back!

It's very tempting, esp. with that new Aug. 1 date, but for now I think me + yonglin have opted out. We've only got about two weeks and a half in August to travel around China, and there are still so many places we haven't seen. It just seems like the NK trip would take more than 5 days - consider the travel time to/from Dandong, getting there a few days in advance to handle visa, etc.

Aussiemate's guy may be more receptive if you call him. If you can get a hold of him, it certainly sounds like a cheaper option.

[koreth]

By happy coincidence, I just heard back from aussie_mate's agent. And his prices are much better! He says...

您好！很高兴收到您的邮件，您可以安排在八月份前往朝鲜旅游，最新消息是朝鲜在8月1日开始今年第二阶段的阿里郎表演，如果没有特殊的情况，在8月1日到 9月15日期间美国公民可以去朝鲜旅游，我们可以为您办理旅游的手续。关于在朝鲜期间的导游问题，我可以帮您解决，为您找一位英语导游（guid），从费用便宜的角度考虑建议您到时候和中国游客一起去朝鲜，如果再有一名英语导游能够和您单独沟通就会很顺利了，同时也建议您如果能和朋友一起去，我们英语导游服务就是免费的了。

朝鲜三晚四天的旅游，可以到平壤、妙香山、开城、板门店，美国人的费用是5000元人民币，如果您自己去需要单独有一名英语导游，您需要另付英语导游费用500元，如果您有三个以上可以说英语的非中国籍朋友一起，那么就不格外另收导游费用了。大连离丹东很近，是相邻的城市，从大连到丹东乘坐汽车需要三个半小时。

如果您有什么问题可以随时联系我，愿意为您服务。

张晓枫

My attempt at a translation for those who are even less fluent in Chinese than I am (someone please tell me if I'm getting this wrong; I'm doing this with the aid of a dictionary and might be missing out on figures of speech, etc.)

Hello! Very glad to get your letter. You can arrange a trip to North Korea in August. The latest news is that North Korea's second Arirang show of the year starts August 1; if nothing unusual happens, American citizens will be able to travel there from August 1 to September 15. We can take care of the arrangements. As for your question about tour guides, I can help you with that. I can find an English-speaking guide. As far as costs go, to keep it cheap you might consider going with a Chinese tour group. If you have an English-speaking guide all to yourself, though, communication will be easier; if you can get together a group of friends to go together, we won't charge you extra for the English guide.

The 4-day, 3-night trip to North Korea goes to Pyongyang, Mt. Myohang, Kaesong, and Panmunjom. For Americans it's 5000RMB. If you go by yourself, an English tour guide will be an extra 500RMB. For three or more English-speaking non-Chinese, there is no extra charge. Dandong is close to Dalian; it's a neighboring city and you can get there by car in three and a half hours.

If you have questions, please follow up with me and I'll help you.

Zhang Xiaofeng

I assume that 5000RMB quote doesn't include the Arirang fee. That sounds like a much better option, especially since presumably with a few people one could negotiate the price down even lower. Does that spur anyone's interest?

[kaifaqu crue]

I'm very interested in setting up a group, especially at the 5000 kuai rate (I'm an American). I'll be arriving in Shenyang or Dalian around the 12th of August, so a departure date of the 15th or later would be best for me. However, if it means getting a better price or going with a group, I can be flexible.

[Pravit]

I think the 5000RMB rate should include the Arirang fee; when I communicated with him previously, he gave a quote of 4500 and mentioned the tickets would be around 500. Guess you should ask him again for more details. Only an extra 500 for an English guide sounds like really good deal, though.

Good luck and tell us how it went when you come back!

[london82]

Hey,

I strongly recommend you try and extend that trip to 5 days. 4 days means an entire day travelling there and an entire day travelling back with no time to do anything else on those 2 days. That's not flexible as there is only one train. That only gives you 2 days in North Korea and the journey times are long inside North Korea too. Mine was only 5 days but all 3 days were incredibly interesting and I wouldn't have wanted to miss any of the things we did. It was 5000-5500 price range including everything for 5 days so I suggest you try negotiate an extra day with your company.

Emma

[Steve_659]

kaifa qu crew-

I am really interested in a N.Korea trip as well. I just got to China and am doing a summer Chinese language in Beijing, but it ends the end of July. Please keep me updated on any plans to form a group, I'd love to go!

[koreth]

Thanks for the advice, Emma. I just wrote back and asked whether they can do a 5-day tour; will let people know. Given the extra day, what did you do in addition to visiting the places he listed in his reply to me (Pyongyang, Mt. Myohang, Kaesong, and Panmunjom)?