geek_frappa Posted April 1, 2004 at 03:06 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 03:06 PM ??? is this a tongue twister? what does it mean exactly? 說曹操曹操到 shuo1 cao2 cao1 cao2 cao1 dao4 Quote
39degN Posted April 1, 2004 at 03:25 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 03:25 PM check this site: http://ic.tngs.tn.edu.tw/teaching/english/chinaproverb.htm#14劃 說曹操到曹操就到 Talk of the devil and the devil comes. BTW, some of them are not so matchable though. they had some mistakes too. e.g. 一將功名萬古枯 What millions died that Caesar might be great. SB 一將功名萬骨枯 but anyway it can help a bit. Quote
skylee Posted April 1, 2004 at 04:27 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 04:27 PM It means, 說起誰, 誰就出現在你附近. That's why there is a Cantonese saying, "日頭唔好講人, 夜晚唔好講鬼". BTW, I thought it was 一將功成萬骨枯. Quote
Quest Posted April 1, 2004 at 05:29 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 05:29 PM I thought it was 一將功城萬骨枯 too. Quote
Ian_Lee Posted April 1, 2004 at 06:50 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 06:50 PM 說曹操到曹操就到 Talk of the devil and the devil comes. This phrase doesn't have any relationship with devil. (Historically Cao Cao was not a devil judged by any criteria.) When do we usually use this phrase? Waiting anxiously for someone you anticipate to show up. For instance, you have told your friend to play mahjongg at 6 p.m., but by 7 p.m. he still has not showed up. So you and the other two mahjongg partners grumbled where the hell he is. In the midst of conversation, he suddenly showed up. Then you would tease at him: 說曹操到曹操就到 Quote
nnt Posted April 1, 2004 at 08:39 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 08:39 PM "Talk of the devil and the devil appears" s an English proverb. The French equivalent is: "Quand on parle du loup, il sort du bois" (when we talk of the wolf, it appears) Cao Cao is no devil nor wolf, and a devil is not really a wolf, but you shouldn't stick to word-by-word translation... Quote
hparade Posted April 1, 2004 at 11:53 PM Report Posted April 1, 2004 at 11:53 PM "Talk of the devil and the devil appears" s an English proverb. The French equivalent is: "Quand on parle du loup, il sort du bois" (when we talk of the wolf, it appears) Cao Cao is no devil nor wolf, and a devil is not really a wolf, but you shouldn't stick to word-by-word translation... yes right~~ Quote
39degN Posted April 2, 2004 at 09:52 AM Report Posted April 2, 2004 at 09:52 AM skylee wrote BTW, I thought it was 一將功成萬骨枯. yeah, that's the official version, i have been taught that way. but i think the 一將功名萬骨枯shouldnt be considered as a mistake. Q wrote I thought it was 一將功城萬骨枯 too. hehe, i'm sorry, but i m afraid i cant agree with this version. nnt wrote "Talk of the devil and the devil appears" s an English proverb. The French equivalent is: "Quand on parle du loup, il sort du bois" (when we talk of the wolf, it appears) Cao Cao is no devil nor wolf, and a devil is not really a wolf, but you shouldn't stick to word-by-word translation... yes, couldnt agree any more... Quote
劍帥文佩然 Posted April 11, 2004 at 05:54 PM Report Posted April 11, 2004 at 05:54 PM It's "一將功成萬骨枯." Because it's from this poem. 己亥歲二首 唐 曹松 澤國江山入戰圖，生民何計樂樵蘇。 憑君莫話封侯事，一將功成萬骨枯。 We can say "一將功成萬骨枯" is "a general's success is built on thounds deaths of his soldiers." Quote
back Posted April 22, 2004 at 05:03 AM Report Posted April 22, 2004 at 05:03 AM 说曹操曹操到的意思是：刚谈到某个人，他／她刚巧就出现了。 就是这么简单，也许在中国历史名著中，有这样的典故吧。 这个成语／习语和“一将功名万骨枯”没有什么联系。 曹操，我们习惯把他叫做“奸雄”，也就是说他既是个英雄，也很阴险狡诈。大意是这样。 但是客观的历史评价，曹操是个伟大的英雄和诗人。 这是我的想法。just my two cents。：） Quote
back Posted April 22, 2004 at 05:05 AM Report Posted April 22, 2004 at 05:05 AM btw:我看到39degN兄在这里很活跃，水平很高，中英文皆棒，以后请多指导。 Quote
shandongcn Posted May 3, 2004 at 03:07 PM Report Posted May 3, 2004 at 03:07 PM Talk of the devil and the devil comes. 说曹操曹操到=巧了=at this moment,somebody... It has nothing to do with devil.Maybe at this time,a good guy is coming. Quote
wiley Posted May 3, 2004 at 03:44 PM Report Posted May 3, 2004 at 03:44 PM I'm pretty sure that in english the best translation of this idiom is: "speak of the devil!" Obviously this is not a literal translation, but the usage is exactly the same. Wiley Quote
shandongcn Posted May 3, 2004 at 11:46 PM Report Posted May 3, 2004 at 11:46 PM I'm pretty sure that in english the best translation of this idiom is: "speak of the devil!" This phrase is from "评书(Ping2 shu2, one of Chinese entertainment )",means,when a person speaks somebody,somebody is coming."speak of the devil"is not correct.You can use this phrase with anybody, including bad guys or good guys. Quote
wiley Posted May 4, 2004 at 01:46 AM Report Posted May 4, 2004 at 01:46 AM I'm a native english speaker, "speak of the devil" carries neither a good or a bad meaning, if anything it carries sort of a joking tone of voice. If I am talking about my sister to my friend and suddenly my sister walks in the door, I say, "well speak of the devil." Obviously I don't think my sister is "the devil" or a bad person. You use this phrase when you talk about anyone, good or bad, and they show up unexpectedly. The mistake you are making is that you are translating the idiom "speak of the devil " literally (生硬). It would be like me getting confused about "shuo cao cao cao cao dao" referring only to generals or military figures. Quote
nnt Posted May 4, 2004 at 04:06 AM Report Posted May 4, 2004 at 04:06 AM I'm pretty sure that in english the best translation of this idiom is: "speak of the devil!" Obviously this is not a literal translation' date=' but the usage is exactly the same. [/quote'] ... and I pretty much agree with you, although I've seen "Talk (or speak) of the devil and the devil appears", which is the longer form. "speak of the devil!" is just the shortened form. The French do the same, and in conversations, they mostly use the first part: "Quand on parle du loup...", the second part cas vary according to the mood of the speakers. transformation is easy (dịch giả dị dã 易者易也) translation is easy (dịch giả dị dã 译者易也) translation is tranformation Quote
ever00t Posted May 4, 2004 at 11:47 AM Report Posted May 4, 2004 at 11:47 AM What does '说曹操，曹操到' mean exactly? It's hard to explain literally,how about we set up a dialog it should be much more easy to understand ---> Dialog A: Geek_frappa and ever00t sit together in the campus. ever00t " When your friend Tom is coming here today ?" Geek_frappa " Not sure,but he told me he will get here asap" ever00t "That's okay,never mind i am just curious ,well wait ....Look ! is that guy your firend Tom over there ?" Geek_frappa "Where ?" ever00t " Don't you see that tall guy wears red T-shirt is walking toward to us ?" Geek_frappa "Oh,that's him,shuo1 cao2cao1,cao2cao1 dao4,hehe" Dialog B. Geek_frappa is driving to NYC in the highway in a very low speeds. He mutters "This old Ford really cracks me out i'd think even a 2nd hand Toyota made in the 70's should be better ... ..." All of a sudden something is happening to the car with no suspected before his lecture is going to be finished. "Oh great! i broke it again ! it's really the 'shuo1 cao2cao1,cao2cao1 dao4" Basically ,this Chinese aphorism refers to many different things,you may say that Chinese aphorism whenever/wherever that an outcome have just been proved in your earlier thinking,something like that. Sorry,you maybe hasn't grasped what i mean over here and my English expressions have already confused you Quote
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