Moving to BJ in Oct

[david1978]

Hi, guys!

First of all, I want to thank the Chinese Forum members for creating such a wonderful resource! I've been lurking here for a few weeks and learned tons of valuable information.

Having said that, I'd like to take this opportunity to ask a few questions pertaining to my intended move to Beijing. My situation is as follows:

I am a 29 years old film industry professional. This May, I graduated college with a political science degree specializing in East Asian politics. In the fall of 2008 I will begin law school. This leaves me with almost a year off. So, because I'm infinitely interested in, and fascinated with, China, and because I would like to become fluent in Mandarin (I'm currently at an intermediate level), I've made up my mind to move to China from Oct 2007 till approximately Aug of 2008.

With the above said, I have several questions. 1) How does one go about finding a job in Beijing with an American company? Are there any resources on American companies looking to hire nationals in Beijing? 2) I understand that apartment prices for foreigners are wildly expensive, while apartments for natives tend to be very cheap (relative to Western prices). How does one go about finding a cheaply priced apartment. A friend of mine has a great apartment in Shanghai for $200 USD a month, can I find something comparable in Beijing? 3) From researching online it appears as if the majority of the English teaching jobs are scams with people reporting terrible experiences. Is this so? Are there any reputable programs in Beijing that I may apply to? 4) Finally, if I don't secure a job or an apartment from the U.S. is it a good idea to just show up and take my chances?

BTW, I apologize if any of my questions have previously been addressed. Because every person's situation is unique, I felt as though I should ask my questions directly rather than abide by advice given to someone else.

I thank you all in advance!

David

[icebear]

I share many of Dave's concerns and questions regarding a year in Beijing to learn Chinese. So *bump*.

[david1978]

Hi, Icebear, thanks for bumping my thread.

I was wondering if you can give me some advice about finding a job in BJ. I've been reading so many horror stories about the English teacher programs that I don't know what to think anymore. Are you familiar with any reputable schools I ought to be looking into. Also, have you any idea about how I can procure a "real" job with an American corporation stationed in BJ?

I greatly appreciate any experience you can share with me. It seems you have about 7 months or so experience teaching in China.

Thanks!

[icebear]

Are you familiar with any reputable schools I ought to be looking into. Also, have you any idea about how I can procure a "real" job with an American corporation stationed in BJ?

No to both. Getting a ESL job anywhere in China, from my one year experience, is essentially a roll of the dice. Many people do fine with it and many others get burned. Making any sense of it all is pretty much impossible, given the huge disparity in experiences - everyone is on a wide variety of visas, in different locations, receiving a wide range of pay. In Beijing you should be getting around 10,000 a month if you're not receiving housing... that's the most solid bit of info I've been able to glean so far.

And regarding finding a 'real' job, with a big American corporation... well, you're probably as likely to stumble into one out here as you are back home. My impressions are that China was once a Big Easy... but is quickly becoming saturated with folks that heard that story as well. The boat has sailed and your chances of catching it are shirking quickly. These days you'll need a specific skill set, amazing Chinese, or a job back home already that is prepared to send you out here for their own reasons. From what I've heard...

I greatly appreciate any experience you can share with me. It seems you have about 7 months or so experience teaching in China.

7 months is a drop in a bucket or a ocean of experience compared to the two halfs of the teaching population here - most of what I know is from the older heads. Come into it expecting fun times, dodgy guarantees, and willing to be as flexible as possible and you should do alright.

[david1978]

Thanks, Icebear. I appreciate your advice.

Can you speak on how you went about securing housing and a job in China? What steps did you take? Was it arranged from the states or did you take your chances in China?

Thanks!

[downunder]

Hi Dave,

Hopefully this referral link will help.

http://www.thatsbj.com/forum/

[cdn_in_bj]

I'd like to start off by saying that I can relate to your excitement for coming here, but I'm a bit confused - is your main objective in coming here to learn chinese or to find a job? Or both? Or neither?

To start, let's have a quick look at the types of jobs here that are available to you:

1) The type of job that you are hired for because of the fact that you look and are foreign. This is probably not the type of job that you had in mind. However, if by chance you make it big as a TV personality, then it could really pay off.

2) ESL teacher. Given your situation, I think this is actually not a bad way to go. There are so many foreigners teaching English here that I can't believe they're all being scammed. Maybe it's not as easy as they expected but it can't be all that bad. And yes there are schools that will hire you just because of the fact that you look foreign, so this does overlap slightly with #1. Also, you can consider the private tutor route which would give you more freedom/flexibility, but then the question becomes, how do you find students?

3) Get a job writing for an English-language publication. There was a thread on this topic recently, try doing a search.

4) Make a documentary. You did mention that you worked in the film industry. This can't be counted on to support you but I sure bet it would be a lot of fun!

5) Working for a multinational firm. This is what you were asking about originally. I don't mean to discourage you, but I think this is the most difficult job to get. Especially since you will be leaving in a year to start school. But I'm not saying that it's impossible. There are basically two ways to get a job with a multinational firm:

A) Get transferred over from your home country, however, your situation precludes this. As for applying from the US, I don't know of any resources where you can find these types of job postings.

B) Apply when you get to China. Not only will you be competing against locals (everyone here knows that multinational firms offer better salaries and benefits), but you will also be competing against returning Chinese nationals who were educated overseas, have a good amount of overseas working experience, good English language skills, and much better Chinese language skills than you.

So I would ask yourself what special skills/work experience do you have which would give you the upper hand, and start from there. And at the same time, try to focus on an industry (business consultancy, law, IT, etc.) - that will make it easier when you start researching about the companies that have offices in China.

Regarding housing, yes there are high-end serviced apartments that are focussed towards expats and wealthy Chinese nationals but you are not limited to those. If your Chinese language skills are halfway decent, then you shouldn't have too much trouble finding a reasonably priced apartment. I remember someone posted the link to a Chinese site with apartment ads, again try doing a search. In Beijing for $200 USD/mo it is possible to find a very basic one-bedroom apartment for that price, but in a location far from where I'm guessing you'll want to be. Upping your budget to $300 or $400 really opens up a lot more choices. You can also consider sharing a larger apartment with roommates.

Regarding your last point, if you are really set on coming here regardless, then sure, why not. You can check yourself into a hostel (temporarily) which I understand are quite cheap until you find a place to settle down. Since you have a great interest in the country, if the job thing doesn't work out you could always take the opportunity to go travelling. But in that case maybe you should consider delaying your arrival by a few months - use that time to get a short-term job in the US and save up some more cash before you come here...

Anyways, these are just my random thoughts. Hope you found them somewhat useful...

[david1978]

Thanks a lot of the link, Downunder, I found it very useful indeed.

Cdn_in_bj, my deepest thanks to you for taking the time to write a detailed response. Let me make the intended purpose of my move to Beijing clearer: I want to become a proficient Mandarin speaker and learn more about China. I am not at all averse to teaching because I'm not coming to China seeking wealth. A salary that covers my basic expenses and allows for a bit of recreation is perfectly fine. If teaching is all I can find, so be it. I'm only planning to stay for a year until I begin law school anyway. With that said, China is something that figures into my long term career plans. As soon as I begin law school I'm going to look for a summer internship that places me in China. Also, achieving fluency in Chinese is something I'm absolutely determined to reach. I've already stuck with it for a year and a half as a supplement to my East Asian politics curriculum and I've no intentions on stopping now. I feel it is important that I get to China as soon as possible to not lose momentum. Perhaps,since my interest is primarily scholarly, that my best course of action is to enroll in a university for a semester, live in a dorm, and study. I've been doing some research on this and if I have my numbers right, it appears that tuition and board for a semester would only run about 2 grand or so. Does anyone have experience with, or advice on, Beijing Universities?

An aside: Last year I spent 2 months traveling in China on a scholarship as part of my thesis research. Admittedly, the topic I worked on had little to do with my travels - my paper dealt with Sino-U.S. relations - but I was hooked. Imagine spending four years studying China on an academic level and then finally arriving in China and seeing all those things you've studied in the flesh! It was incredible. I'm definitely coming to China and I look forward to meeting more China geeks for conversations and exploration.

Cheers, guys!

[imron]

If you study at a university in Beijing, just tuition and accommodation will probably cost you around US$3000 for a semester. You will then have other general living costs on top of that, which would probably add at least $1000 for the semester, but depending on how you live maybe double or even triple that amount.

[cdn_in_bj]

Hi David, I agree that given your objectives your time would probably be better spent enrolling in some courses here rather than teaching English at a school. Meeting friends/language exchange partners would probably do a lot to help you improve your Mandarin skills as well. And I'm sure that in a university setting you should be able to find people who would be willing to hire you for English tutoring, if you find the need to improve your cash flow.

I think that taking a semester of school when you get here would be a great way to help you get settled down, meet new friends, and get you focussed on your objectives... after you finish the first semester you can then decide if you want to continue taking more courses or do something else.

[gato]

You might consider going to a less expensive northern city like Xi'an, Dalian, or Qingdao to keep expenses down if you are going to study full-time. There are also fewer foreigners in these other cities, which might force you to speak Chinese more. I agree that taking a year to study full-time is a better route for you, considering your goal is to attain professional-level Chinese. The extra expense incurred will be small compared to your eventual law school loans.

[yonitabonita]

David

A cheaper alternative to studying at a university is to enrol at a private language school like Diqiucun which costs 12 yuan an hour. Generally speaking, the classes move at a higher pace than university taught classes. The flipside to this is that classes are less thorough. You'll be surrounded by mainly Korean students who, in my classes at least, study like maniacs. Do a search on this site for this school. There's a ton of info on the classes available, the pros and cons of the private school vs going to universities etc.

There's also a thread on housing in China under the 'Living in China' topic. It recently got bumped and will give you a fair idea of the range of accommodation and prices. That's bj is where I found my apartment (described in the thread mentioned).

Jobs - After wasting my time with headhunters, I found a part time job with a multinational company that advertised through zhaopin.com. There are loads of job ads there - some advertisers are dodgy, others ok - so no better or worse than anything else you'd find on the net. My job arrangement is 4 hours a day every day, which still leaves me some time to study. The money is good and the conditions aren't bad either. There's also a job section on That's beijing.

Good luck.

Y

[david1978]

Yonitabonita, thank you so much for that! That was really helpful. I wasn't even aware of these dirt cheap schools. Indeed this is an alternative to a pricey university. May I ask if you arranged for your housing and employment from the states (or whatever you mother country might be) or upon arrival? The reason I'm a bit antsy about all this is because I have no one in BJ to help me adjust. It's a bit scary to be dropped in a foreign country with no base.

[yonitabonita]

David,

I belong to couchsurfing.com (a global network for free accommodation for travellers) and just organised to stay with someone based in Beijing through that site. I stayed with host - now my friend, for 5 days and in this period frantically checked out accommodation.

If this isn't for you, there are hostels in Wudaokou you can check into. There are threads on this on this site.

You could also just go to thatsbj.com and just organise to take a room advertised. I'd not do this because I'm fussy about all sorts of things, but if you're not, it's a possibility - you're here for a year though, so it's probably better you take your time to check places out before you commit.

Employment I found after getting here. There were interviews and other such shenanigans I had to attend to before they'd hire me.

Good luck.

Y

[david1978]

Yonitabonita,

Once again, THANK YOU! I wasn't aware of couchsurfing.com, can you pm me your profile?

[wenhao888]

YanitaBonita,

How to get from the airport to Wudaokou? What is the rate per night for hostels at Wudaokou?

Could you recommend a good and not so expensive long-term accommodation in BJ?

Could you recommend a good accommodation near Diqiucun (the language school)?

Thanx.

[cdn_in_bj]

How to get from the airport to Wudaokou?

You could take a taxi, but that will cost you over 100 RMB with toll charge.

An alternative is to take the #5 route of the Airport Shuttle and get off at Xueyuanqiao, then take a taxi from there to Wudaokou. See:

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/9277-from-airport-to-blcu

You can find also more info about the shuttle bus here:

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/2-favourite-chinese-musician0156

What is the rate per night for hostels at Wudaokou?

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/6463-hostel-or-cheap-hotel-near-blcu

Could you recommend a good and not so expensive long-term accommodation in BJ?

Long term (if we're talking over 6 months) it is best to rent an apartment. However, you should do this after you get here, not before. In the meantime, you could look into the Foreign Students Activity Center. See here:

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/10-is-chinese-grammar-easy-dont-you-just-love-chinese-words934