An Introduction, my plans and some questoins

[Ebbo98]

Hi,

I am 31 years old, English, and currently working in IT which I have been doing so for over 8 years now. My current job is ending in roughly 18 months due to the company I work for being bought by a larger group. It is very complicated and boring so I will not go into any details.

Once I am redundant, I am planning to move my family to China. My wife is 29 and my children are 8 and 5 years old.

I want to move to China for the experience and to teach. I have always wanted to be a teacher and I have always believed that living abroad is something everyone should try but due to circumstances, neither has been an option for me. Now with my job coming to an end and my kids growing up, I think it is the perfect time. Money has never been important to me; as long as I have enough to keep a roof over our heads, I am happy. I have been lucky in that I have a job that is pretty well paid but I know that coming to China is certainly not going to make me rich. In fact, I am expecting the opposite to happen.

By the time we are ready to leave, I should have at least £10K saved not including my redundancy. Will this be enough for a family of four?

While in China, I hope to be studying to become a qualified teacher in the UK so that when I do return, I will be able to carry on what I have started. Would this be possible with work commitments?

Does anyone have any experience of taking youngish children? I have read a couple of threads but the children involved have been a bit older than my pair. If possible, I would like to send them to a local school but I would imagine that the language barrier would stop that. I intend to learn Mandarin with them before we go but I very much doubt they could learn enough in 18 months to be able get along. Would I have to live near a large city to get them into an international school, as I would prefer not to if I could help it?

Would it be difficult for us both to get jobs teaching in the same school? My wife has been a housewife since the children came along but before that she used to work as a teaching assistant at a local school and was actually planning on going to uni to become a teacher before the children came along.

What is the likelihood of an employer offering accommodation for the four of us?

Finally, neither of us have degrees. I have IT certifications that I know will not be of much use practically but would these be of much value when applying for jobs? We will be doing a TESL course later this year but I do not even know if that will count for much.

I have waffled on long enough now, so thanks for taking the time to read this. Any replies will be gratefully received. I know that no one can give definitive answers to these questions but any thoughts will be most useful.

[kdavid]

Aside from your family, your individual qualifications are more than enough to land you a job anywhere in the country (outside of the better-paying large international schools--with a few years of experience and some ESL-related qualificaitons, however, you'd be able to qualify later on). Finding work out here isn't difficult. However, find *good* work can sometimes be a task.

Your only obstacle, I forsee, lies with your family. Here are some things to look into:

1. Housing. While the money you've saved should be a good amount put towards buying a house / apartment out here, whether or not foreigners can legally own property out here might be a problem for you. While I don't have any direct experience with this, I have read on these forums that we can't *own* our own houses, and instead have to go through a middle-man to buy property.

2. Schooling for your children. Unless you're children enroll in an international school (private, expensive, and most likely filled more so with Asians than westerners), your children will have a very difficult time assimilating to the school system here. It's nothing like what we are used to as westerners. Add in the language barrier, and the initial difficultyin learning spoken Mandarin (and the long-term investment needed to master writing and reading), I'd fear that your kids wouldn't be able to keep up with their peers back home.

If you were coming alone, I'd say go for it. However, bringing your family sounds like quite a task, and while I'm sure it's far from impossible, I wouldn't expect the transition to be easy to cope with, especially since your children are at a very young (and important) age for learning and developing their own identity.

[muyongshi]

1. Housing. While the money you've saved should be a good amount put towards buying a house / apartment out here, whether or not foreigners can legally own property out here might be a problem for you. While I don't have any direct experience with this, I have read on these forums that we can't *own* our own houses, and instead have to go through a middle-man to buy property.

I hope this isn't true because that means my friends didn't just buy their house and will be very disappointed when I tell them. But from what it sounds like in your case is renting will be a better option as you plan to go back to your home country eventually. Right?

No problem getting a job. I know so many people that have moved here with their families and even at similar ages to your own children. There is an adjustment and a stretching but you can all do it!

Just consider cities carefully as you look at where to live and what type of your can't do without things that city will or will not have. Especially for the kids.

I would also suggest being very prepared as a family. Talk about it a lot and let the kids really process out their feelings too.

[Ebbo98]

Thanks for the quick responses.

My children are obviously my number one concern in all this. If I do not think they will be happy and able to settle in, then we will not be going. It is as simple as that.

I think that I have enough time before we plan to go, to get them ready and to make sure they are happy going. I just know that when I was their age, I would have loved to live somewhere completely different. It would have been a huge adventure for me.

muyongshi - I don’t suppose you could put me in touch with anyone you know with children who have gone to live in China. It would be useful to get an insight on how they started and how they are getting on now.

Thanks

[gato]

Are you sure your wife and kids want to come to live in China as much as you do? It may be particularly difficult for them if they are not mentally prepared to living in a third world country.

[imron]

Check out this episode of the "Up Close" program run on CCTV (click on the little icon to play, or follow this link). It's an interview with Charlotte MacInnis, an American who moved to China with her family when her and her sister were about the same age as your children.

[simonlaing]

Hi Ebbo,

Teaching English might be one thing to do , but you may want to consider teaching some IT reslated courses at some of the Tech universities.

My friend Thomas from Canada teachs computer game graphic design and programming. He seems to enjoy it and can keep up with some the industry changes.

You should apply to the large unviersities that have science and technologies as part of their curriculum.

If you can afford to get a teaching degree before you come to China you will earn 4 times normal ESL teachers by working in International schools. They pay upwards of 25k RMB a month where as you're looking at 5 -10K for normal ESL jobs.

You wife may be able to get work as well as a teacher, the cost of nannies and babysitters here are low.

Suzhou and Nanjing both have decent international schools. Plus other mid sized cities will have them aswell. I did know of a swiss family that had their child in grade 1 or grade 2. But into Highschool CHinese local kids have no life outside of school and you may want to take that into account. Elementary and Middle school, they are still stressed with music lessons and tutoring at night but they can still occassionally go out to play.

Good luck,

Simon:)

[Ebbo98]

Thanks for the responses so far.

My wife is as excited as me about moving to China but we have so far only mentioned it in passing to the kids. I am popping into our local bookshop on the way home from work tonight to hopefully find a guide that the they will understand. After that then it is plenty of TV and websites to try to get them to understand what is going to happen. I don't know how much my 5 year old will take in but we will see.

I have had a look at a few international schools. Looking at the fee's that is certainly out of the question. There is no way I can afford £7K each a year, so it's back to the drawing board there.

I hadn't thought about teaching IT. Is that something that is in demand? I assumed the language barrier would prohibit me from teaching anything other than English. When I do return to the England, I intend on becoming an IT teacher anyway because it really is in demand here now so that sounds very interesting.

Unfortunately, I don’t think I would be able to get a degree in 18 months. I was looking at the life degrees that certain places advertise now. I know it’s not worth much here but does anyone think it may be worthwhile getting in this situation or would a company take a few IT certifications in place of a degree.

Thanks for the TV link. I will certainly watch it this evening.

[imron]

I think at that age your kids will find it to be one big adventure. I spent a period of time in Indonesia when I was around that age and it was great. Personally, I also think that at that age, sending them to a local school will be fine. Yes there will be a language barrier to begin with, but by the end of the first year, they'll be speaking Mandarin like natives

[roddy]

Few thoughts.

In your circumstances, I would recommend looking at a university teaching post rather than a private school job. They don't pay so well, but you're likely to get decent accommodation on campus, which will remove one of your major headaches. Those jobs also tend to be more stable, and at a guess would be more open to the idea of taking on a family - although I'd imagine they won't be too keen unless both you and your wife are taking on jobs. There are often schools attached to the universities and you should be able to get your kids in there, if you decide that's the way you want to go, at little or no cost.

Not having a degree could well be a problem - most places will ask for one and in some (all?) areas you can have trouble getting all your documentation without one. The situation is unlikely to be any more relaxed in 18 months time. Emphasize what you've got in terms of certificates / experience and see what happens. I'd start looking now - it is early, but it might take time to find something you are happy with and knowledge gained now will stand you in good stead later.

[simonlaing]

Since money is not your main object I agree with Roddy that looking at a University job would be best for you as it will give you stability.

You could teach IT and your wife English if she wants. Most school ask for an Undergraduate degree but will take other certificates if you don't have that.

Bigger city schools in Beijing and Shanghai will pay more, but the cost of living will be more aswell.

My friend the Games design professor teaches with an interpretor and all code is written in English.

In looking for Chinese schools for your kids I would look for some of the experimental schools that are attached to Unversities for teachers (also called normal universities) . These use different techniques and might be more interesting than the usual chinese school which has more pressure. Either way until the kids get to high school it is more relaxed.

The Nanjing normal Univeristy experiment school had some exchange students for Europe who told me about experimental schools. Plus the school are usually right on campus or next to it so it makes for easy pickups.

Good luck,

Simon:)