China and USA observations from a foreigner

[MartinF]

I posted this on my blog but since many of you can't read that without some internet trickery, I thought you might find it interesting here if I posted it here. It's intended to be little bit humorous and entertaining, so don't take me too seriously:

Observations on City Life in China versus America

I'm almost a lifelong ex-pat. That means I've been a foreigner living in other peoples countries ever since I graduated from college. So, I think I can offer some interesting observations about life in America and China. From a foreigners point of view obviously. I spent many years in the USA, mostly in Los Angeles. I spent about 2 months in China, mostly Hong Kong and Beijing with some other Chinese east coast cities for short stays.

Crime: it seems to be almost non-existent in China in any part of the city. I felt very safe there. Walking the streets at night, leaving the apartment door unlocked etc. I understand the punishments are very severe and this may be a huge deterrent.

In the USA, crime can be either almost non-existent in the rich suburbs or extremely bad in the ghettos. It depends on the neighbourhood. Sometimes, when I felt like testing my bravery, I would go to one of the worst areas to see if I can handle it. It usually didn't seem as bad as people said, but the statistics suggest otherwise. Fortunately, people usually kill people they know, so as a stranger the odds are with me.

Traffic: crime might not kill you in China but traffic can be murder, especially in Beijing. Shanghai was more disciplined and Hong Kong was the most safe and disciplined by comparison. You don't look left and right when you cross a road in Beijing. You look front/back, left/right, above/below. Traffic of many kinds can and will come at your from every direction. It seemed like cars and buses would play a game of chicken with pedestrians to see who would lose their nerve, give up and yield. I kind of enjoyed this and made it into a bit of a sport.

Yes, I like a bit of danger. I ride a motorcycle in LA. This is about the most dangerous thing you can do on the LA roads. Cars will hit you because they just didn't see you whilst talking on their phone and drinking their Starbucks latte. Unlike Beijing, pedestrians get the right of way in LA by law and in actuality too. Cars have to stop. Most do, but they drive much faster in LA so it's still important to be cautious. If a car cannot stop in time, who is going to lose? Bicycles are almost non-existent on LA streets. The speed of traffic usually makes it too dangerous for them and they are supposed to share the road. Not such a good idea. The ones you do see often ride on the sidewalks, which is illegal but better safe than dead.

Employment: In China, it seemed like there was always way too many people doing a job than was necessary. At a restaurant I was often greeted by 2 or 3 girls at the door. I often had 3 or 4 waiters/waitresses. Often, there was 5 or 6 cooks standing around the kitchen with nothing to do. At an upscale "foot massage" business my female friend and I must have seen about 200 people working there or learning the business in a huge building. We were personally attended by about 8 people, greeting us, showing us the room, bringing tea, massaging us, showing us the bathrooms, taking our money. I only saw about 3 other customers in the entire business. I can't imagine how anybody makes any money in these businesses. Unless the people work for free and the rent is low. Maybe that's the trick.

Another interesting thing in China was it seems to be OK to go to sleep at work. Perhaps, this is just OK and accepted, perhaps it's the very long hours which makes it necessary to have a nap. But even in international hotels I would sometimes return to my room and want to talk to the reception. I thought nobody was there, but when I looked over the counter there was several people fast asleep, somewhat uncomfortably perched on chairs. They didn't seem to mind being woken up but I felt bad about it.

OK, in the States it's the opposite. You can go to a large retail store or cafe and find that only one person actually works there. Covering everything. So you may have to wait a long time to get served, but people seem patient enough. This seems necessary to allow businesses to be profitable because wages are relatively high in LA. However, it's become a big joke even in the media where you go to a massive store and can never find help or the way out, even. Especially mega home improvement stores. Also, I think taking a nap at work is considered a firing offence in any job I have ever heard of. Even if you work long hours. If you need to sleep, go home or drink a lot of coffee. Fall asleep on the job and your out, dude!!

The Police: in China the police I saw seemed quite polite and didn't seem to throw their authority around too much. I really didn't have much dealings with them. I just saw them on the street dealing with traffic accidents mainly. Or trying to enforce traffic rules. They didn't look very intimidating either.

In the USA the police, in my experience, are rude, macho and arrogant. Many of them look like body builders and try to intimidate everyone they come into contact with. You do not want to get on the wrong side of them. This is not a sport I would want to play. They have guns and they love to use them at the earliest opportunity. Even in a rich neighborhood where I used to live, they shot hundreds of times at a man who had a gun. It may have been justified but the force was excessive. It's quite common.

The Military: I saw quite a lot of police or army guarding things in Beijing. Mainly embassies, I think. The soldiers on guard seemed like the skinniest most underfed people I had ever seen. They looked like starvation victims. I don't know what kind of rations they get to live off, but I wish they would give them some more protein. Part of being a guard is looking intimidating, I suppose. There is nothing much intimidating about an unarmed, walking skeleton.

Well, we've all seen what the US military is like. I don't know if I can bring anything new to that subject. But compared to what I saw in China they US military is excessively funded and excessively aggressive. Itching for a fight whenever, wherever. They will use overwhelming firepower to crush any resistance but they utterly fail the part about winning hearts and minds.

Dating: I have had quite a lot of experience dating in the USA and a little bit in China. I think I can make some comparisons in this area. First of all, it is a very different situation. Many Chinese girls consider themselves traditional, even in the big cities. The ones from the rural areas who moved to big cities often maintain most of their traditions. There seems like a big rush for Chinese girls to find a marriage partner by age 25. Love doesn't seem important, it's more important that he will bring financial security and treat her well. Meaning he spends a lot of money on her and doesn't sleep around. So I found the subject of marriage came up too quickly, before the "love" thing, and this will scare most western guys off very quickly. Chinese girls seem to be very naive, inexperienced and have little knowledge of romance, love, and sex. Especially western style, where sexual competence is judged in comparison to the massive amounts of porno watched here. These things are highly valued in both the USA and my home, England. Chinese girls wear quite conservative clothing, boring underwear and very little makeup. Fortunately for them, they have good genes on their side and many of them look absolutely stunning to me without any need for any extras. Generally very thin, they are naturally elegant and feminine for many years. Generally they seem quiet, demure and chaste. At least superficially.

In the west, especially places like Hollywood where I live, being ridiculously good looking and physically toned is an obsession. Every day I see impossibly good looking people. They come here daily from all over the world for the entertainment industry. Trying to get a job as an actor but usually working in Starbucks. I am also obsessed with fitness but so are my parents so I brought that with me from England and my family. Westerners are all searching for our soul mate, the love of our life, the stunningly beautiful yet challenging person who helps us grow as a person and fulfills our every sexual fantasy. It's a tough act. That's why people rarely get married or get married several times. Nobody can measure up to our requirements and needs. Many women don't think about getting married or just think about having kids (marriage optional) until their late 30's or early 40's. Careers come first and having a family last or never. Single girls in LA exercise all the time, wear lots of makeup, provactive clothing and exciting underwear. They are outspoken and brazen, especially about sexual matters. But sometimes the rich food and the Starbucks Venti Frappucinos are too much and they gain weight at an increasing pace. Well, that's what cosmetic surgeons are for, right? You can always get a nip and a tuck and charge it on your credit card.

I see good and bad points with both cultures. I want to experience them all. My hope is to move to Asia -- I don't know exactly where and when -- but, just like in America, I will accept the parts of the culture I like and be outspoken about the parts I don't. Comments are welcome.

[gato]

I think HK would be a good place for you, though very expensive. I heard women outnumber men by a tantalizingly wide margin there.

[Senzhi]

Complaining about the Beijing traffic? Come and pay a visit to Shantou: you'll never complain about Beijing traffic again!

When I was in Beijing, I felt very safe about the traffic compared to where I live. As for here: cars don't make a distincion between road and pavement. Neither do they about driving left or right side of the road.

In fact, they don't make a distinction about anything ... except the rule of priority: "I'm here, I have priority!"

[rootfool]

Crime:go to more smaller citys or towns you'll find it's not safe enough as you thought,even the it's more safe than USA in my opinion.After all the strict control of gun and knife tool is a bit useful.The whole country worries about the more and more lower social conduct.That's why The Party advocated "八荣八耻" last year.And I hope one day the parents will not teach their children "it's not your business" any more when they see robbery or stealling on tv.

Traffic:Seems huge quantity of population is the root cause many problems.Traffic,disquene(I make this word!),hard to get a job,or something else.It's because of the speech "人多力量大-by Chairman Mao".I heard that NY is also a traffic city:mrgreen:.The same reason,isn't it?Thanks God!He gave the bus/taxi driver a simply heart---there's only "Rush!Rush" is his head---so we can enjoy the speed that we can only get in F1. Can't image that?No problem,just need to come here!

[tony1343]

Interesting comparison. I'd like to note that Hollywood is pretty unique in the U.S., especially for your analysis of dating. In the middle of the country and the south, marriage occurs at a much younger age than on the coasts.

Also, I think your description of American police and military is quite over exaggerated. There are times when police go overboard, but typically they are friendly if you aren't breaking the law. Of course they are real assholes when it comes to giving speeding tickets and underage drinking (when I think back to my teenage years).

As for the military, well I'm guessing you are quite liberal (you are from Hollywood). I wouldn't say they are excessively over-funded. Maybe, we don't need the large military we have, but we have it and from what I've heard many soldiers often don't have the correct gear which makes their job even more dangerous than it needs to be. No matter what our politics are, if we send young men into dangerous situations, they should have what they need to be as safe as possible. No whether they should be there is another question.

Also, it's important to note that you don't see military within the U.S. all that often. There are military bases of course, but they rarely act as law enforcement within the U.S., because of the Posse Comitatus Act. I remember seeing military type people quite often in China. It is probably more difficult for me to distinguish military from police, etc in China since I don't know the uniforms though. It wasn't ridiculous like some countries (Italy I believe) where there are paramilitary with machine guns and the such all over the place.

Chinese driving and traffic is ridiculous. It is very dangerous to be a pedestrian in Shanghai. Of course a big problem in Shanghai is everyone has their crap on the sidewalks. So you can't walk on the sidewalks; you have to walk in the street, which people do without thinking and cars honk their horns like crazy.

I would like to deactivate horns in China. In the U.S. horns are typically used for emergency situations (to get someone's attention so they don't back into you, etc) and by assholes wanting people to go or speed up. In Shanghai, it is just non-stop horn honking. It almost drove me insane.

Also, there is another difference. If a Chinese person comes to the U.S. nobody will really care or notice, since there is so much diversity and so many Chinese people already. When I went to China, I was constantly stared at (to an extent that would be rude in the U.S.) in the cities, and in the more rural part I went to, people constantly wanted to have their picture taken with me. It is very odd that a man would want his girlfriend to have her picture taken with another man (even if they don't see non-Chinese very often).

[native chinese]

Well, we chinese always regard foreigners as guests(not including Japanese), so we treat guest really well, even much better than native chinese. In my opinion, there are two different worlds in china, one is for ordinary chinese, another is designed for foreingers.

So just do in china as chinese do, you'll find a real china.

[MartinF]

Hey Tony,

thanks for your comments. Like I said, everybody is going to have their own response to a place based on their own upbringing, life experiences, politics etc. Yes, I am rather liberal by US standards, but probably quite conservative by European standards. It's a different benchmark.

"Interesting comparison. I'd like to note that Hollywood is pretty unique in the U.S., especially for your analysis of dating. In the middle of the country and the south, marriage occurs at a much younger age than on the coasts."

True enough. Something I also noticed is how rude or polite people tended to be in America varies a lot. I think New Yorkers are the most rude, LA is somewhere in the middle, and Texas seemed to have the most polite people in America. People in Texas almost seemed to be as polite as English people. Again, this is my experience but anecdotal accounts by others will probably bear this out.

"Also, I think your description of American police and military is quite over exaggerated. There are times when police go overboard, but typically they are friendly if you aren't breaking the law."

I have personally witnessed several incidents of police brutality and excess force. To other people, not to me. Of course, this is my opinion because I am comparing it to British police. For example, in England they didn't put handcuffs on somebody unless they have been violent. But in the USA they put handcuffs on people any time they arrest somebody even if non-violent. I think that's very humiliating.

"As for the military, well I'm guessing you are quite liberal (you are from Hollywood). I wouldn't say they are excessively over-funded."

Over funded or under funded is an opinion but a fact is the US spends the most on its military in the world. I think the USA spends more in a month than China spends in a year on the military for a population 1/5th the size.

"Chinese driving and traffic is ridiculous. It is very dangerous to be a pedestrian in Shanghai. Of course a big problem in Shanghai is everyone has their crap on the sidewalks."

I remember that situation in Shanghai too. However, it still seemed safer than Beijing to me. Other folks are saying Beijing is better than other cities. So the driving conditions are very varied in China, obviously. They are really cracking down in Beijing now, I think to prepare for the olympics.

"Also, there is another difference. If a Chinese person comes to the U.S. nobody will really care or notice, since there is so much diversity and so many Chinese people already. When I went to China, I was constantly stared at (to an extent that would be rude in the U.S.) in the cities, and in the more rural part I went to, people constantly wanted to have their picture taken with me."

that is so true. However, I didn't mind the stares. I would often smile and wave. Or start a conversation. People were mostly friendly and curious, not hostile. However, when I was walking around with asian girls, they would get very intimidated by it and upset by the stares. I was used to it, but they weren't. I also had my photo taken a lot with families, even in big cities. Not so much in Beijing. I didn't mind at all. Sometimes I would ask if I could take their photo too. I love the friendliness and hospitality of the chinese. I had few negative experiences my whole time there. Can't wait to go back.

I also love the diversity of big cities in the states, mostly LA. We have a huge Korean community here. You definitely feel like you are in another country when you go to Korea town in LA. I am hoping that London is going to be a wonderful melting pot of cultures too.

Martin

[helenlee]

it's really an interesting post. I got to know more details about both of them . Thanks

[heifeng]

So, I'm from the US, but here are some of my observations/comments on the two:

I ride a motorcycle in LA.

I have also lived in LA for a few years and...oh....I hope I never cut you off...it happens cuz you guys spead down the lane dividers while we are all backed up at rush hour.

In the west, especially places like Hollywood where I live, being ridiculously good looking and physically toned is an obsession

hmmm body building and hollywood, be honest are you sure you weren't in WEHO aka west hollywood?

I was constantly stared at (to an extent that would be rude in the U.S.)

haha, not just rude, but in my home town I think people would get their a&& whooped if they stared anyone down for as long as people stare at foreigners out here.

Driving:

US (aside from LA) driving defensively. LA: When in doubt, just go faster.

China: go go go and wait for no one.

Fashion:

No one mentioned it but in my observation fashion in BOTH the US and CHINA is really bad. In LA it's all about cleavage, but at least people are somewhat in shape and can carry off more fashion forward clothing, in other US cities it can just be downright grungy casual all the time or people trying to show off curves no one really wants to see. In China it's playing the game of how many patterns and poofy objects you can wear at once. Korean and Japanese fashion is slightly better, but I think that Europe takes the cake for fashion. (Ok, and maybe some South American countries know how to mix it up nicely too, oh and apparently Russia has some strange (or just hoochie-ish) fashion trends but I haven't witnessed this first hand...anyho back to about the US and China)

Police:

Luckily I haven't really had much interaction with either, but each time they all just seemed disgruntled and overworked no matter what country it was.

Crime:

So, I'm guessing you guys don't really classify the oldest profession as illegal, is that what you are saying? In any case think China wins in this category, but only because there are more poor girls from the countryside looking for a way to make a quick buck (or yuan hehe) than there are crackheads, runaways, and other people in the US who most likely fall into such careers...but there's the reason it's the oldest profession, right...I think this type of illegal activity, along with other things just get 'overlooked' here in China.

On the other hand, drugs definitely very much exist in the US, most likely more than in China. Many violent crimes can also be related to drugs, so in the US I think that the drugs and crime definitely go hand in hand...

[MartinF]

thanks for you interesting comments.

"I have also lived in LA for a few years and...oh....I hope I never cut you off...it happens cuz you guys spead down the lane dividers while we are all backed up at rush hour."

Yes, that's the main reason for riding a bike. To be able to cut through traffic. You get an adrenaline rush from it too, which makes getting to work exciting instead of frustrating. I'm getting my motorcycle shipped to London, so I may try commuting here too.

"In the west, especially places like Hollywood where I live, being ridiculously good looking and physically toned is an obsession

hmmm body building and hollywood, be honest are you sure you weren't in WEHO aka west hollywood?"

No, I was talking about central Hollywood. But you are right about West Hollywood where physical tone would be even more important. It still is extremely important in central Hollywood if you are dating actively. "Abs" seem to be one of the biggest obsessions lately. Especially amongst women. Having well defined abdominal muscles seems like a goal for many in LA/Hollywood.

"Fashion:

No one mentioned it but in my observation fashion in BOTH the US and CHINA is really bad. In LA it's all about cleavage, but at least people are somewhat in shape and can carry off more fashion forward clothing, in other US cities it can just be downright grungy casual all the time or people trying to show off curves no one really wants to see. In China it's playing the game of how many patterns and poofy objects you can wear at once. Korean and Japanese fashion is slightly better, but I think that Europe takes the cake for fashion. (Ok, and maybe some South American countries know how to mix it up nicely too, oh and apparently Russia has some strange (or just hoochie-ish) fashion trends but I haven't witnessed this first hand...anyho back to about the US and China)"

Good points. That's pretty funny. I'm in London now, and if you aren't showing major cleavage, as a woman, then you are just not fashionable. This is often physically unlikely for many Asian women so they don't go for the cleavage showing fashions. My Mongolian girlfriend is staying with me at the moment and she actually can (and likes to) show cleavage, so all of her clothes are low-cut.

"Crime:

So, I'm guessing you guys don't really classify the oldest profession as illegal, is that what you are saying? "

I don't, because it's not illegal in many countries. Not in much of Europe and not really in China. Or not enforced anyway. I don't think it should be a crime.

great comments. Thanks for adding your observations.

Martin.

[Wufnu]

Never in my 26 years on Earth have I seen someone arrested in the US. I have seen shoplifters being detained at stores. Of course, the largest city I've lived in was Atlanta and only for two years. Crime in the large cities seems to be much worse than rural USA. It's odd that I never thought about it but I can see how you would view someone being shot many times as excessive. From my standpoint, the police are justified in shooting anyone that tries to shoot at the police or hostage. Whether it's 1 bullet or 100, the result is the same. I'm not sure how death from 100 bullets is more excessively forceful than death by 1. You don't get much more forceful than death and police are trained to only use the gun as a last resort and if it is used it is used to kill (not maim, wound, etc). Of course, the mentality of cops in the large city would naturally be somewhat different than the rest of the country. Naturally, there are those that feel the need to abuse what authority they (think they) have over the general populace. Then there are some, undoubtedly, that are jaded from years of dealing with horrible people.

Congeniality is a big thing for me. I'm not sure why. I've lived in Indiana, Texas, Georgia, Kentucky, North Carolina, and Tennessee. I also lived in Schweinfurt, Germany for three years. My father was in the military I had a good theory going that the "less rich" or "more rural" someone was the more polite they would be (or the more likely they would be to stop what they're doing to help you if you had a broken car, busted tire, etc). This theory held up well until I moved to Knoxville, Tennessee. Here it is backwards: the rural natives are generally ill tempered and rude while the non-native transplants tend to be more polite and nice. I can't explain it. My theory on why the lower the income or the more rural someone was the more polite they would be was based on the hypothesis that lower income and rural communities are MUCH more community based as opposed to the rich. My only experience with big cities would be when I lived in Atlanta. People there weren't rude but I would definitely say that they were much more indifferent to you. I also made a trip to NY but I was a tourist with a southern accent. I was treated VERY well and they were all very polite but perhaps that's because they knew I wasn't from there? Especially the shop keepers, they loved my accent.

The spending on the military is justified (and considering my dad's profession I'm naturally biased). I can only say, "don't use dollar amounts to compare countries spending on their military: use percentages of GDP." We generally keep our military segregated from the communities at large such as bases, while on duty. Off duty, they're just normal people and look it. They don't really have any authority over local civilians. I understand this is somewhat different in China? I'm not surprised that they seem aggressive: you don't want an army full of pushover weaklings. Their job is to fight wars and kill, not your typical profession, and aggression is just part of the job. Regarding them itching for a fight, I saw a documentary on Navy Seals that touched on the subject of "itching for a fight" and aggressiveness. The seals described it as not so much wanting to kill someone for the sake of it but more of, and I'm paraphrasing, "We've done nothing but train to do our jobs for 10 to 20 years and we would like the opportunity to perform our duties." I can understand this mentality. It would be like going to college to be a doctor for 20 years but never being able to help anyone medically.

And for anyone not from the US that's visiting I would suggest getting out of the cities (at least for a small tour or something). The big cities are fun but they're only half (or less) of what the US "is."

Gotta go, sis is sick.

[myrhlyn]

you have written an interesting post. and i would share just a few thoughts. china has a great many traditions that i hope will never go away. while the chinese govt gets blamed for many things , one should step back first to see what they try to preserve. i believe there has been a good job all things considered to maintain the core of what is china. the values, ideals, beliefs that are taught in china are the same that here in america has been legislated out of existence.

my wife is a teacher in china and wanted to embrace american ways. but as we talked in detail and started looking at the quality of education here she has agreed that maybe they are doing it better there.

there is not a single day i leave my house where i do not see homeless people on the corner bumming money, hookers, drug addicts, drug sellers, gang members, crime of all sorts. it was so nice in china that i never saw any of it. in 21 days only saw one accident in china.

i would never want to see the moral right gain power in the usa, but we do need a healthy does of respect, integrity, honor.

i speak almost no mandarin. yet when i was in china i treated everyone with respect and honor. the restraunts i went to went out of their way to treat me well, seating me where they could show me the food as it came out so i could decide what to order. you will not find that here.

in nanning we went to a park by the river. there was an old man sit on a bench playing a two stringed instrument. he invited us to sit. he played what he could remember. my wife knew the songs and sang as he played. as she sang you could see him start to remember who and what he was. she gave him honor and respect. and for the 2 or 3 hours we sat with him it was wonderful. here he would be mugged then arrested. sad

i can only hope that as china emerges to a new day she carries her past with her. it is the past that makes china great. otherwise it will be another western culture lacking anything of the human being

america may be the land of opportunity, but it comes with a price. maybe if america had stricter laws and less social welfare things would be different. so now i work here and send my money to china so that soon i can stay in my new home

[simonlaing]

Dear Myrhlyn,

I am sorry to say in your 21 day tourist trip of China, you have seen the China , the government wants to show you.

"there is not a single day i leave my house where i do not see homeless people on the corner bumming money, hookers, drug addicts, drug sellers, gang members, crime of all sorts. it was so nice in china that i never saw any of it."

I just go back from Shanghai, and there were beggars in many places. (Espicially Nanjing Lu where most tourist go) . I give money to the arhu players occasionally as I think they are providing a service of music in the Subway stations. You could also see many people sleeping in the Subway stations there.

It is true that you do feel safe in China. The absence of guns and violent crime is pretty good. There are instances of small organized crime around prostitiution (see previous posts) and each city has places to get drugs.

Chinese do have serious in group vs out of group issues. Therefore a fight going on in a public place or even a mother beating her child will be ignored, or watched in vicarious interest. If they don't know the people, Only a small percentage will call the police , and even fewer will intervine. I think children and women are more protected in the US.

The other issue , (which came from the Cultural revolution and lots of famines) is short soghted issues. THe new york times today has a great article on the devatatastion of the environment. Quality issues, and Risky products are also due to this desire to make a short-term profit at any cost, even long term viability.

China has lots of things going for it, but to say we should emulate their old fashioned values (Some which included concubinage, foot binding, and persecuting people because their relatives were in the KMT.)

America has lots of issues, no doubt. But usually minorites are protected more and we face up to problems instead of keeping face.

So I respectfully disagree.

have fun,

Simon:)

[myrhlyn]

your response is good. your points on the face of it are valid. yes i was enchanted with china. and i did have my mind occupied with finally meeting and marring after two years the woman who is now my wife.

that being said, i did not have blinders on. my new extended family drove me around from nanning to san jiang, and i saw through very clear eyes the way of life and hardship so many live with.

what i did not see was a single person with the expectation they are owed anything. people do not have extra children by different fathers so they can get more money. i met people without any formal education who can do basic things like read to a point, count. i met children who actually know something that they learned. its a sad commentary on us that we import most of our technical workers or farm it out to china.

i will never say beating a woman or child is good, however some disipline to a child is a good thing. here you will get arrested for it. every morning i arose early to take a walk before the humidity set in. every morning an army of people appeared and cleaned, everything.

you beleive women, children, minorities are protected here. sadly that is only an illusion. the truth is that racism is as alive and well here as ever. and while there are many types of assistence to women and children, everyday the papers tell the sad stories of what really happens to them. we burry them by the thousands. it is worse for the illegals who come here by the millions.

china is no better or worse than any other country. the difference is that they can draw on the wealth of history from us, england, europe and hopefully not repaet our mistakes.

one last thought. a society that can produce a person that will touch anothers life so well, so fundamentally as my wife did to the old man does have something to offer. it is to those qualities we should look. preserve. in 35 years i have never seen that here.

tend well the tree of weeds and pests. trim as needed, water and feed. always the fruit is abundant.