Don_Horhe Posted April 1, 2009 at 02:44 PM Report Posted April 1, 2009 at 02:44 PM Hi! I want to ask about changing the university you're in. I know they say that in principle you can't, but then again it's not impossible. I'm on a full 4-year scholarship for a bachelor's degree in contemporary Chinese in Huazhong Normal University (Wuhan), but the bachelor program for foreigners sucks big time - they claim to have subjects like ancient Chinese, translation courses, newspaper reading (报刊) etc., while in fact none of them actually exist. So, since I want to study something more than just practical Chinese, I started thinking of changing to Wuhan University. The only thing is that I have absolutely no idea where to start or who to contact for information about the entire process.
benhadad Posted April 1, 2009 at 09:21 PM Report Posted April 1, 2009 at 09:21 PM Dear Don, Just helped a freind here in china thru a nightmare of sorts with her Scholarship. He had a scholarship to a a MBA. He took Year and half of chinese, which wasn't enough and began failing once transfered to the MBA. He wanted to switch to Beijing - BLCU and change to chinese only for a BA in Language. The school said it couldn't be done, but he had a freind that claimed it could be. Anyway tried it but CSC couldn't even help because this individual didn't fill out annual review correctly and say that 1.5 years of chinese is not enough. Instead said things were going ok. When he was failing class instead of working things out, left the country then returned while being suspended. Ran out of money and could not get home. Finanly had to borrow money as CSC, School, Embassy couldn't help because they violated terms of agreement. Anyway bad situation, almost ended in Jail. SO if you do get a scholarship beware, especailly if you need the money to get home! Remember it's a 5000 fine (500Yuan) per day for violating your visa here! You can also be asked to return the money for the scholarship if you fail to pass (for goofing off and not going to class). I know others here on scholarship (several from Africa or Middle east, and India) that agree 1 year for masters or phd is suicied and should not be attempted without planning to kick and scream that you need another year of chinese. It seems applying for language is a safer bet and be glad if it isn't too hard . Since your in the program I would love to know if these are just idle threats from the CSC, and School about getting fined for not attending school or failing class. Ben
lizzie86 Posted April 1, 2009 at 10:49 PM Report Posted April 1, 2009 at 10:49 PM Hi Extra Pages, I've got a little worried from reading some of the posts on here, im applying for the Chinese Language scholorship through the EU window im sending it off this week, the website says it closes the end of april but the forum says end of March. Also, Im really confused over the medical examination, do i need to get one done? do i need to send off chest x rays ect? and if i dont could you point me to where it says not too on the website, Im getting so confused as sometimes it says only needed for stays in china up to 6 months? Thanks so much, reading this forum has been so so helpful, xx
Bedan Adjuster Posted April 1, 2009 at 11:13 PM Report Posted April 1, 2009 at 11:13 PM Ben, I am really confused. Is your friend a girl or a guy? You're switching pronouns. Anyways, do you mean that 1 year of language training in preparation for masters or phd is not enough? Through your experience, how many years do you think a foreigner completely without knowledge of chinese should take the language training before going to masters or phd? I badly need the information because I applied for masters degree. Thanks.
menyawga Posted April 2, 2009 at 01:31 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 01:31 AM This issue is also a concern for me. Most language programs that these universities offer for people to learn Chinese before starting degree study go for at least 2 years. In addition, HSK 6 is officially required to transfer into a humanities degree program. In my opinion, 1 year of Chinese is DEFITINELY not enough for this, especially for people starting in Chinese from scratch. The regular "CHINESE GOVERNMENT SCHOLARSHIP" allows for up to 2 years of language study. But, The "CHINESE GOVERNMENT SCHOLARSHIP-UNIVERSITY POSTGRADUATE STUDY PROGRAM", (which is exactly what you're applying for if you go directly through universities and not the Chinese embassy in your country) specifically allows for only 1 year of language study. How do they expect us to thrive in Masters/PhD level classes with only 1 year? I applied to both - 1 through Xiamen University, and 1 through the Chinese Embassy in DC. I'm praying I get the Embassy one so I can have 2 years. -Menyawga
menyawga Posted April 2, 2009 at 01:44 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 01:44 AM Bedan Adjuster, to offer some thoughts: Xiamen's language program goes for up to 2 years before you have to transfer into something else. The course descriptions on their site give HSK approximations as to what level the courses will bring you to or require from you. The most advanced classes say they are at HSK level 7. Because Chinese universities require a minimum of HSK 6 to transfer into Humanities-related degree study, I believe that 2 years of full-time study (no slacking off) will bring you to a level where you can thrive. One year of study will probably get you to HSK 3 at least. I taught English in Japan for 2 years. I also studied Japanese independently while I was there, but I wasn't as disciplined as I should have been. Consider it part-time study. At the end of the 2 years I was nearly at the Japanese equivalent of an HSK 5 or 6. Compare that to studying full-time in China while interacting daily in the language environment. It's definitely doable if we're ready to work. -Menyawga
Bedan Adjuster Posted April 2, 2009 at 02:24 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 02:24 AM Thank you very much for the information. I think I have no choice but to learn the language in just 1 year since the embassy here cannot help me with my application. At least now I know that I have to exert effort four-folds to learn Chinese in one year and eventually finish the Master's degree. As for you, I hope you get the scholarship through the embassy.
eloper Posted April 2, 2009 at 04:22 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 04:22 AM Hey everyone! I've got a questioning regarding question four: "language proficiency". I've got a language proficiency roughly at "fair" after three years of university Chinese studies. However, i dont have any real proof of my abilities cause i've never taken the HSK. I was wondering if anyone had been in this situation, or if anyone had any practical advice as to how i could effectively demonstrate that i have several years of chinese training. my two ideas so far (and what i'll probably do) are: submit copies of my university handbook, with its expectations and achievements get a a letter from my chinese department demonstrating i've passed the subjects i'm being referred by my university so both my grade transcripts and reccomendations reflect the fact that i've passed the courses as well. does anyone have any advice for me?
benhadad Posted April 2, 2009 at 05:02 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 05:02 AM Sorry about the switching of the he/she. Seems everytime I come to china my english goes down hill really quick. I personally think it would be a very dedicated and gifted person to learn enough chinese in 1 Year to beable to handle a master program. My freind already knew 2 Languages before coming so they understood what it takes to learn another language. Now I had an 18 year freind who learned in about 1.5 years quite well. I studied at BLCU for 1.5 years (in 2000) and now have been studing at a small school for another Half year. At this point I think I am back to where i was when I left last time. I would say I would get around 4 or 5 on the HSK if I studied for it really good for 1 month. That being said I would be hitting the books now before you come, as it seems 2 years is required. I find if you are not using the language before you get her that the first 6months are wasted if you are not already use to the sound and tones. I would not normally be applying for the Phd program, but due to my age and education background It might be my only option. As far as someone proving their level, I would say first take some of the sample HSK test first. Then sign up for the HSK, they do offer the test in the US. In china they offer it a few times a year, like in the middle of April.
extrapages Posted April 2, 2009 at 06:15 AM Author Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 06:15 AM (edited) Lots of posts! --- I was wondering whether or not I need to send transcripts from my university courses along with my high school transcripts since I'm applying for an undergraduate program mandanata, Welcome! Glad you decided to post. You don't send your high school transcripts. You send what you have so far for your undergraduate studies - even if you didn't graduate yet. If you send just your high school information, they probably will realize that there is a lot of missing information that is required. You can send both if you want, but the minimum would be to send your undergrad scores... and the high school stuff would be optional. Sorry. --- I started thinking of changing to Wuhan University. The only thing is that I have absolutely no idea where to start or who to contact for information about the entire process. Don_Horhe, It IS impossible to change schools. They just don't allow it... and I have never heard of it happening. The only option I could think of is contacting CSC to tell them that you cannot fulfill the rest of the scholarship, and to try to apply again. I don't really know what else you can do. I don't even know how you'd go about telling them you can't finish under your current circumstances. There must be someone who is willing to help you - if you find someone who will listen and you tell them your situation... and how you were essentially lied to... or unintentionally misinformed. I don't know what else to say. I wish I could help. Hopefully, one day in the future, I'll be able to find someone actually from CSC who we can go to for special cases like this. You should definitely try to push your way through to someone at CSC. --- SO if you do get a scholarship beware, especailly if you need the money to get home! Remember it's a 5000 fine (500Yuan) per day for violating your visa here! You can also be asked to return the money for the scholarship if you fail to pass (for goofing off and not going to class). I know others here on scholarship (several from Africa or Middle east, and India) that agree 1 year for masters or phd is suicied and should not be attempted without planning to kick and scream that you need another year of chinese. It seems applying for language is a safer bet and be glad if it isn't too hard . Since your in the program I would love to know if these are just idle threats from the CSC, and School about getting fined for not attending school or failing class. benhadad, The visa violation fine thing is on an individual basis - if you can get lucky and/or get friendly with the official you got in trouble with, they might let you go with a warning. It all depends. That is independent of the CSC scholarship. As for "returning" the money if you fail to pass - that depends on which specific country you came from and the contract your country has with the CSC. I know some people who came from Romania, and if they fail, they will have to pay it back. But that's not the case for everyone - it really boils down to the people from your country and how involved they are with the scholarship students and tracking their progress. I'm a great example for the other end of the spectrum - I haven't been to class after the first semester (I started working), but I'm still on the two year scholarship. I am automatically registered each semester even though I am obviously not attending and not taking any examinations. But I still go every month to pick up my cash stipend, and no one has said anything. I have successfully slipped through the cracks. I only have two more months left in the two year scholarship, and once it's over, how are they going to track me down when they have failed to do so over the past year? I am not proud of how I have taken advantage of the scholarship, nor am I encouraging others to do the same - but I feel that I have given back to them in other ways (this forum, for instance), and that the Chinese government ulimately got what they wanted by giving me the scholarship. As for the language part - it's a pretty similar answer. I already wrote about my South African friend who busted his ass to study and successfully started taking his Master's classes after one year. But he was speaking and practicing Chinese 24/7. Even after he started taking the Master's classes, he was struggling, but he tape recorded and reviewed each lecture - asking his professors and all his classmates and his language partners lots of questions. He works hard at it, and it works, and CSC expects everyone to be like him. But not everyone is - and that is sometimes managed by people from your country. For example, there is another person I know on the scholarship for a Master's. She is from Cape Verde. Her Chinese wasn't improving, even though she was retaking lower level classes, and after a year, people from her embassy told CSC that they won't let her start taking degree classes - and forced her to complete another year of Chinese. What happens after that, we'll just have to see. Also, if you ask for more Chinese during the Annual Review, more often than not, they will give it to you. --- im applying for the Chinese Language scholorship through the EU window im sending it off this week, the website says it closes the end of april but the forum says end of March. Also, Im really confused over the medical examination, do i need to get one done? do i need to send off chest x rays ect? and if i dont could you point me to where it says not too on the website, Im getting so confused as sometimes it says only needed for stays in china up to 6 months? The website is probably updated. Deadlines listed on this site are from last year unless someone has specifically told me that it's changed. I don't go around researching this. Follow the procedure listed for EU applicants. You need to get one - depending on where you are from, you can get it done after you get accepted or be required to complete it and send it in as part of your application. Do your due diligence. Also, you don't send the chest x-rays. This has been discussed before. And it's valid only for 6 months, not only needed for stays up to 6 months. I think it's actually required for stays longer than 6 months. --- The "CHINESE GOVERNMENT SCHOLARSHIP-UNIVERSITY POSTGRADUATE STUDY PROGRAM", (which is exactly what you're applying for if you go directly through universities and not the Chinese embassy in your country) specifically allows for only 1 year of language study. How do they expect us to thrive in Masters/PhD level classes with only 1 year? menyawga, As I said, you can probably get another year if you tell them on the Annual Review that you really need another year. You should also make sure that during your time learning Chinese, you build a really strong relationship with the CSC representative at the university. It will help you in ways that you can never imagine. --- I've got a questioning regarding question four: "language proficiency". eloper, The only recognized way to prove your language proficiency in China is with your HSK score. Are you applying for a degree? If not, you don't need to prove your language proficiency to take Chinese classes. You will just take a test before classes start and be placed in the class that most fits your Chinese level. Edited April 2, 2009 at 06:31 AM by extrapages typos
roddy Posted April 2, 2009 at 06:41 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 06:41 AM I'm on a full 4-year scholarship for a bachelor's degree in contemporary Chinese in Huazhong Normal University (Wuhan), but the bachelor program for foreigners sucks big time - they claim to have subjects like ancient Chinese, translation courses, newspaper reading (报刊) etc., while in fact none of them actually exist. Not sure how much help this is, but I'm pretty sure universities can't go messing with the content of degree courses - these are fixed by the education authorities. The university can't just decide to offer a degree in something, or change the content as they see fit. There are publications such as this which '指导' the courses.
eloper Posted April 2, 2009 at 07:04 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 07:04 AM Thanks extrapages, I am just applying for Chinese Language classes, so your advice is spot on I'll just tick "fair" and say that i need to take a university placement test to gauge my level Thanks again!
Don_Horhe Posted April 2, 2009 at 07:57 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 07:57 AM Roddy and extrapages, thank you guys. I talked to one of my teachers, who raised the question with the administration. They said that what I see on the course description is what they are planning on setting up, it's not ready yet (which is odd, because how much does it take to find a teacher?). I guess I just have to wait and hope that they keep their word that these classes will become available soon.
lizzie86 Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:09 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:09 AM Guys Help! Im really scared the website for the EU window says its open from Jan to April 30th but this feed is saying March 30th! Also do i need to send a physical exam with this application as the feed says no but i havnt seen this info on the website, Loads of Thanks and best wishes
extrapages Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:34 AM Author Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:34 AM lizzie86, I've already addressed your issues in the big post I just put up. Do your due diligence. Read the first post. Share with us what you do know.
lizzie86 Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:43 AM Report Posted April 2, 2009 at 09:43 AM Thanks Extrapages I've read the first post, thats what has got me confused as the CSC website ive been using http://en.csc.edu.cn/Lianhua/ae15c3a91fc6416daaf2c787518619f2.shtml states the closing date is 30th April and dosnt mention being exempt of the medical exam until being awarded a scholorship. Many thanks for all your help
evasiege Posted April 3, 2009 at 01:43 AM Report Posted April 3, 2009 at 01:43 AM (edited) Can anyone confirm the deadline for the the embassy in D.C.? It's virtually impossible to get in contact with anyone there or in my current location next to Chicago, and their websites give no information either. I'm assuming its the 15th, in which case I should have everything done and sent by then. And another thing... The paper that I plan on submitting along with the app has a couple mildly controversial topics regarding some of China's past (Cultural Revolution, issues with poverty etc.), and am somewhat hesitant to leave it on, but is central to the paper as a whole. Think it would be an issue? I know I brought this up before, but would they even bother to read 12 pages about China's economic growth when I'm applying as a language student? Edited April 3, 2009 at 01:59 AM by evasiege
menyawga Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:05 AM Report Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:05 AM Hey guys, Before I said that I couldn't find anything official saying the medical examination had to be notarized. However, i did find one thing on CSC website under "Notice to International Students Studying in China under Chinese Government Scholarship Programmer". It says: 2. Scholarship Application - Applicants should meet the basic qualifications prescribed in the Application Procedures, and fill in the application forms strictly in accordance with requirements. They also need to provide relevant application materials including notarized photocopies of diplomas, transcripts, study plan, health certificate and recommendation letters. I don't think "notarized photocopies" applies to everything in that sentence. For example, why would we have to notarize our own study plan essay? It doesn't make sense. However, if the health certificate might be required, then I'm not taking any chances. I bit the bullet and had 4 notarized copies made - 2 for each of the applications I'm sending in (I decided to apply through the US Embassy and through Xiamen University). It was the equivalent of almost $120 in Korean won, but you can't put a price on peace of mind can you? Many thanks to extrapages and everyone else who's contributed to this forum. You guys have made THE difference in this process. I'll let you know how everything turns out in July. I'm looking forward to hearing good news from you all too. Blessings, -Menyawga
menyawga Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:11 AM Report Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:11 AM Evasiege, The scholarship application says (on the 3rd page checklist) that each complete set of application documents shouldn't exceed 20 pages. My personal essay/study plan was a little over 1500 words and 1.5 spaced to be easy to read. With this and a couple extra letters of recommendation, my application came out to 23 pages. I also had an 8 page essay on the development of elementary English education in Japan, but I decided it was just too much to put in. I wish they could be more clear when they say things like "don't exceed 20 pages" and explain, if it's the case, that they mean "not including extra essays, etc". I just made a judgment call. You'll have to do the same since no one who knows anything for sure is available to speak about it to us. -Menyawga
Bedan Adjuster Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:17 AM Report Posted April 3, 2009 at 02:17 AM evasiege, I would suggest that you should not include the negative things China had in the past or in the present. And do not make a 12 page statement on how China progressed economically during the past recent years. Consider these things: 1. If you are one of the CSC Board reading a negative statement about your country, what would you feel? 2. A 12 page statement is too long, overkill and would make the reader lost interest in what you are saying regardless of the content.
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