Learning Mandarin - how to get beyond survival chinese??

[yong27]

I'd be interested to know how many people out there learning Mandarin actually broke thru the intermediate level to become fluent in it.

There seem to be a lot of people in China who have been studying for say 2 years, but can only speak survival chinese (ie restaurants, taxis, buying things, conversations in broken chinese with friends).

But to actually become fluent where you can talk about any topic without problems and read the newspaper seems almost pretty bloody impossible! I don't think it's ever going to end!

What have other people in the same shoes done? Is my choice really only between getting a chinese girlfriend/boyfriend or going home???

[muyongshi]

Well first of all you are missing an entire level in the process here which is being conversational. This is the true intermediate level and survival Chinese is more what you described but that is not an intermediate level. Maybe a low intermediate. There is no way to really get what is intermediate, beginner, advanced through. Hey, maybe I'm wrong and it is intermediate that is what you described and what I described is advanced and then you have fluency.

Not trying to argue terminology but from what you describe there is a whole other level that you have to get to before you can really even begin to think of fluency.

I myself am trying to figure out the fluency question as it seems to be the hardest part....

Where I am at now is what I call a conversational level.... I can watch, listen or read almost anything and understand 90% of what I am reading. Recognize around 3000+ characters (this is based on the books I read/study from), can carry on a conversation with friends for hours on any majority of topic but in many topics still lack the specific vocab. I have also "taught" classes using Chinese and only Chinese. I probably speak clearly 85% of the time but takes me a good more time to explain than a native speaker and I get grammar right probably around 90% of the time. I am still not content and really have no clue where to go from here and maybe it's just a time issue as 80% of my life is lived in Chinese....

[Lu]

Muyongshi, I'm at about that level too... Sometimes I am fooled into believing I'm actually seriously good at Chinese. But then I realize how far I got with English, and moreover how far some Taiwanese I know got with English, and then I know I'm nowhere near really good.

But to actually become fluent where you can talk about any topic without problems and read the newspaper seems almost pretty bloody impossible!

It's not. It takes time and dedication, but it can be done. The trick is just to learn all those words, and practice them, and learn them again after forgetting. And then one day, after years of hard work, you pick up a newspaper and realize that you can read it. (And a bit later you realise that most newspapers in Chinese are rubbish.)

Listening and talking a lot helps too, and this is where the Chinese GF comes in, but honestly a good friend, or just generally someone you are happy to spend a lot of time with, works just as well.

I don't think it's ever going to end!

Well that's true.

Good luck!

[yong27]

Thanks for your comments. Maybe it is just a matter of time and bitter hard work. No magic tricks, not short cuts. Dammit!

I probably know about 2,500+ characters, and can converse (although not well) on a variety of topics. It's good to have some goal posts I guess, and be motivated by others in the same boat. It's amazing how much you can pick up when you've just started learning, but it's the journey between basic communications and understanding what's going on around you - to actually being fluent (whatever that means) that is long!!

Seriously though this is one of the hardest things I've ever attempted. Good to know it can be possible to get there.