Healthy eating/sport nutrition in China

[Colossus]

How tough is it finding brown rice? Does anyone know?

[onebir]

Broccoli, for example, is very high in protein (at around 40%).

I think that's the % of calories from protein. But broccolli has a very low calorie density - 34kcal/100g & <3% protein (according to this).

So for example, if MartinF wanted to get his 150g of protein from broccoli, he'd have to eat 5kg. To digest that much fibre, you'd need to have the four stomachs of a cow.

How tough is it finding brown rice? Does anyone know?

I think I saw it in the organic foods section of Carrefour/Walmart. Normal shops don't have it. They do have millet though, which makes nice zhou (porridge) in about 15mins. It's 11% protein cf 8% for rice (from memory) & someone told me pregnant women used to get special millet rations, so Chinese seem to consider it nutrionally superior to rice...

There are other weird Chinese grains/seeds that might be worth checking out - foxnuts (euryale), job's tears, sorghum, lotus seeds, bai guo & probably quite a few more.

[wushijiao]

think that's the % of calories from protein. But broccolli has a very low calorie density - 34kcal/100g & <3% protein (according to this).

So for example, if MartinF wanted to get his 150g of protein from broccoli, he'd have to eat 5kg. To digest that much fibre, you'd need to have the four stomachs of a cow

Onebir, I realize that, but thanks for making it clear in case anybody would get confused. (By the way, most people don't know that you should calculate protein, fat, and carbs as a % of total calories, certainly not by weight, which is just a huge scam. "2%" milk is actually over 30% fat. ) Perhaps seeing what the percentage is as it compares to your recommended daily value would be more practical for regular people, but for people who are into lifting, I'm sure they have the knowledge of how to read a label.

You would indeed need to eat an insane volume of broccoli to get to 150 grams of protein, and I wasn't advocating that. I'm just saying that, if you look at a lot of the beans, grains, and vegtables that you eat per day from a protein-percentage point of view, you can make useful tweaks that might end up making a fairly large difference. For example, like onebir said, trading millet (11%) for rice (8%) is exactally the type of thing that I meant to say. Over the course of a day, small little changes like that could add up to an additional 10 grams of protein per day, which isn't too insignificant.

[Colossus]

You would indeed need to eat an insane volume of broccoli to get to 150 grams of protein, and I wasn't advocating that. I'm just saying that, if you look at a lot of the beans, grains, and vegtables that you eat per day from a protein-percentage point of view, you can make useful tweaks that might end up making a fairly large difference. For example, like onebir said, trading millet (11%) for rice (8%) is exactally the type of thing that I meant to say. Over the course of a day, small little changes like that could add up to an additional 10 grams of protein per day, which isn't too insignificant.

Of course, it is worth noting for all the lay people, that you need to get a full profile of the eight essential amino acids--isoleucine, leucine, lysine, threonine, tryptophan, methionine, histidine, valine and phenylalanine. Animal sources, as well as eggs and dairy, have all eight. If you are looking at vegetable sources they are always lacking in one or another, although all eight can be obtained via vegetable sources. Just something to keep in mind--so if you're not getting any (or much) protein in your diet, you might consider looking at the protein available in your source.

A good website is http://www.nutritiondata.com/.

[onebir]

Onebir, I realize that, but thanks for making it clear in case anybody would get confused.

I thought you did, but wanted to nip the 'brocolli mass gaining diet' in the sprout!

[onebir]

I just found some wholegrain buckwheat noodles in Carrefour (qiao2mai4 荞麦) - very like 'soba'. Tasty just boiled & with something thrown on top (eg sesame paste).

Apparently "The proteins in buckwheat are the best known source of high biological value proteins in the plant kingdom. Buckwheat contains all essential amino acids (eight proteins that the body cannot manufacture) in good proportions, making it closer to being a "complete" protein than any other plant source, even soybeans." See link

Higher protein % than wheat, millet and rice, low GI, & with cholesterol lowering properties according to my googling... In short a hell of a lot better for you than the ubiquitious over-refined noodles you can get all over the place. About RMB8 for 500g.

[cdn_in_bj]

Apparently "The proteins in buckwheat are the best known source of high biological value proteins in the plant kingdom. Buckwheat contains all essential amino acids (eight proteins that the body cannot manufacture) in good proportions, making it closer to being a "complete" protein than any other plant source, even soybeans."

I didn't know this - that's good to know!

However, I don't quite get why they said "making it closer" to being a complete protein? By the description above, it sounds like it *is* a complete protein.

[wushijiao]

If you are a weightlifter (or something like that), I think it is one thing to be interested in the protein of your post-workout protein, but I don't think it is something that you need to be too concerned with in general. See below:

Protein is an important nutrient required for the building, maintenance, and repair of tissues in the body. Amino acids, the building blocks of protein, can be synthesized by the body or ingested from food. There are 20 different amino acids in the food we eat, but our body can only make 11 of them. The 9 essential amino acids, which cannot be produced by the body, must be obtained from the diet. A variety of grains, legumes, and vegetables can also provide all of the essential amino acids our bodies require. It was once thought that various plant foods had to be eaten together to get their full protein value, otherwise known as protein combining or protein complementing. We now know that intentional combining is not necessary to obtain all of the essential amino acids.1 As long as the diet contains a variety of grains, legumes, and vegetables, protein needs are easily met.

http://www.pcrm.org/health/veginfo/protein.html

Animal protein, in particular, has been linked with various forms of cancer, and the average person only needs to consume 5-8% protein (as a percentage of calories). So, generally speaking protein is not something that one needs to worry about. In fact, most people should be concerned that they get too much.

I've been eating a big old bowl of oats, with soy milk, flax seeds with cranberries (or raisns) and bananas for breakfast most days. I think that's a pretty good combo, with lots of protein, low GI, good for the heart, lots of anti-oxidants, good Omega 3 and 6...etc, and fairly cheap. You should be able to get that type of breakfast anywhere in China, although I am not sure about the availability of flax seeds.

Info about:

Oats:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=54

Flax:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=81

[onebir]

although I am not sure about the availability of flax seeds.

Would pumpkin/sunflower seeds do? They're easy enough to get hold of... Not sure about their omega3/6 ratio. Or indeed why it matters...

[wushijiao]

Not sure about their omega3/6 ratio. Or indeed why it matters...

From what I've read, it seems that omega oils are essential for are cell development, heart function, brain function, and it can decrease odds of diabetes and can help weight loss.

Most people are told to get their omega oils from fish, like salmon, but it is dangerous to eat too much fish because of high mercury levels (there is a thread about this somewhere), and I would speculate that most Chinese seafood would have increased levels of metals due to industrial waste and the burning of coal. So, flax can be a great substitute for people would don't want to eat fish a regular basis.

I went out to look for flax seeds (or oils) in Hong Kong, and I found quite a few options, including local producers.

Pumpkin seeds are great, and also nutritious though.

Flax is 亚麻. Might be worth seeing if stores carry it.

[Colossus]

I know this site will probably turn you off immediately because it has a very "meat-head" look to it, but I am a Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist through the NSCA, and I can tell you, this is definitely one of the more more legit magazines. Most of their stuff is in line with physiological and medical texts I'm familiar with, so I take most of what they say as well researched (unless they're pushing a product--at which point I get a little skeptical).

But here is a pretty good article on the benefits of FFAs

http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=952894

[Colossus]

Hey wushi--

I'm trying to find some sources of low fat-high protein foods, but I'm having some trouble. As you mentioned--the fish (especially around here) can be a little high in the mercury department--and I'd like to avoid cancer if I could.

I just don't know of any butchers that carry specifically "lean meat" around here.

Soy, I have been reading (both on the website I posted above and ironically several others just before I stumbled across that one), is not as useful as frequently argued. I am considering cutting it out of my diet completely. However, I need something to fall back on as soy is currently my primary source of protein.

Dangers of Soy:

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=body_87prote

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459861

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=461709

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=459516

[wushijiao]

I know this site will probably turn you off immediately because it has a very "meat-head" look to it, but I am a Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist through the NSCA, and I can tell you, this is definitely one of the more more legit magazines

Hehe...no problem. I used to read a ton of "Flex" magazines and things like that, although at some point they just recycle all their articles with new pictures.

Gyms have a lot of dumb big guys on roids, but there are also a lot of smart people too. After a while, you really have to research about training and nutrition in order to break through plataeus.

Dr. McDougall, a vegan doctor and politically incorrect independent scholar, shares some of the concerns about soy. He recomends eating small amounts of soy every now and again.

http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/pdf/pdf050400nl.pdf

I think chicken without skin is one of the best meats, but it still clocks in at 23% fat. Other meats, like pork, are certainly fattier.

Personally, I've been eating a quite a lot of oats, Quinoa, beans (black beans, chick peas, black eyed peas), peanut butter, almonds, sunflower seeds, and so on. All these foods are nutrient dense, and high in fairly high in protein. Plus I eat a ton of veggies and fruits per day, especially spinach and broccoli. I also still have my bucket of whey, but after that I am going to go back to veganism.

I figure I probably only am getting 70-100 grams per day of protein, but I'm not really sure I need that much. I'm still making quite a bit of progress in my lifting, but then again, I just re-started after a few years of not lifting.

[wushijiao]

Colossus:

You might be interested to know, I just happened to download a bunch of podcasts from Max Out Nutrition and Fitness Radio, and I just so happened to listen to an interview with one of the founders of T-Nation: TC Luoma. I really agree with his positive, up-beat philosophy about life. That same podcast series has an interview with Zach Even-Esh, a guy who has invented an unorthodox way of gaining strength and endurance (especially useful for wrestlers, or people who want strength, stamina, and speed). The idea seems to be to use lots of old school, low tech things that will work all sorts of muscles, much like compound exercises. He talks about work with sandbags, rope pulls, push ups, running with sleds, deadlifts, Olympic lifts....etc. All with little rest.

[Colossus]

Very cool. Especially interesting for me, as I used to wrestle and do amateur mixed martial arts (may do san shou while I'm in China).

By the way--I decided on a diet that might actually work out, in case you are interested in my well-being.

I'm trying out the Anabolic Diet by DiPasquale. It's come highly recommended to me from various sources, but it was particularly recommended to me from a guy I know on T-Nation who is has been teaching in China for several years. I'd offer it to you, but it is basically impossible to be a vegetarian, much less a vegan, on it. If you're interested, shoot me a PM though and I could email it to you.

Out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian for health or moral reasons? If it is for health reasons, this guy presents a fairly compelling case for meat consumption.

[wushijiao]

Well, going back to veganism for:

1) Environmental reasons 2) Health 3) Animal rights. In that order.

I was a vegan for two years, and felt great doing so. It is especially good if you are into endurance athletics (and it may even be good for strength training as well, as counter-intuitive as that may seem. Kenneth Williams, for example, has won body building competitions as a vegan. Part of the problem, perhaps, is that many vegans, personality-wise, tend to be disinclined to be into the sports that would require strength. So there is not a huge sample size). With that said, you can still eat a horrible diet as a vegan, if you just drink soda, eat chips, white flours, and processed foods. Eating a diet based on whole foods is the best, no matter what.

Right now, I'm lifting four times a week and running four times a week. I've signed up for the Hong Kong half-marathon (did the full in2005). The two sports kind of conflict with each other, both both give a decent base for doing other sports that I like: skiing, basketball, tennis, hiking, soccer, swimming.

It's great that you found a diet that works. I just read a few webpages about the Anabolic Diet. It seems like it may have been what you were looking for, in terms of finding a diet that would be easy to accomodate to China, plus it seems like there is a genuine good response from strengths athletes. Without knowing anything about it though, I would kind of wonder whether it would be a good long-term diet, as far as one's health. Although I'm sure it would be better than the Standard American Diet (SAD).

[Colossus]

Does anyone know if there is any way to tell the nutritional content of foods I buy from the supermarket. For example, I recently bought some sausage, but there doesn't appear to be any nutritional facts. I am trying to stick with a diet, so it'd be nice to know.

[Rhubarb]

Concerning vegetarianism, I hope I'm not revealing a secret by saying that strict vegetarians cannot eat meat occasionally without having stomachaches, so if you decide like this guy who, after four years of strict vegetarianism went back to eating meat, to switch back, you'd better do it gradually!

[Colossus]

What made you switch?

[Rhubarb]

What made you switch?

Who? Me? No, I was talking of vegetarians I personally know.