translating question

[Dani_man]

Hi guys,

I need to translate these two sentences:

1. "please take these apples down from the table" I translated into:

请你把在桌子上的苹果拿出来.

I think it is problematic as using 出来 means that I take it "out" of somewhere.

is these an expression that can make it more accurate?

2 "after half an hour looking into the mirror, she said that her eyebrows are too black"

照半个小时的镜子以后, 她说她的眉头太黑了.

is that correct? I know I can also say 照镜子照半个小时以后,他说她的眉头太黑了

but it sounds more "grammer" than daily life talk.

What do you say?

thanks

[fireball9261]

"拿出来" should be "拿下來". "拿下來" also have the meaning of taking it away or taking it down.

"照半个小时的镜子以后, 她说她的眉头太黑了" is correct, but the other way is wrong because you mixed the usage of gender. The original sentence used "she" at both places, so you should do the same. If you want to use the originally non-gener-specific, "他", it is OK, too, but you need to use it at both places again.

I would add one thing and change one word in your sentence:

"照了半个小时的镜子以后, 她说她的眉毛太黑了"

This way, it sounds better in both writing and speaking. Yes, after my change, the grammar would be more nature and more Chinese.

[Dani_man]

Thanks a lot fireball

[muyongshi]

You could also say 拿走...

[imron]

You could also say 拿走

I think that would change the meaning though. The original sentence isn't asking you to take the apples away, just to take them down from the table.

[muyongshi]

Okay well when I hear "take something down from the table" to me that just means to take it away and the so-called "verb of direction" (in the english) does not actually indicate direction so in my mind it doesn't change the meaning.

[Asiasy]

拿走is ok

[imron]

I guess it depends on context. To me, if someone had said 把桌子上的苹果拿走, it would mean like they were offering me the apples to take away. 把桌子上的苹果拿下来 however would just be asking me to take them off the table.

[Dani_man]

Maybe a better word to use in this case will be "please remove the apples..."

in the dictionary I've found 拿走 as remove... but I agree, 拿走 will be used for taking something for yourself.

Does anyone has an idea how to express "removing" in this case?

[anonymoose]

Does anyone has an idea how to express "removing" in this case?

拿开

If I heard 把桌子上的苹果拿下来, my reaction would be to take them off the table and put them on the floor, since the floor is a lower place and thus moving them would be in the direction 下. If I heard 把桌子上的苹果拿开, I would move them to any other place, maybe the floor, or another table or something. Here the emphasis just seems to be on clearing the table.

[Dani_man]

so 拿开 sounds like the most suitable one for this case.

Thanks a lot!

[fireball9261]

拿开 is also fine, but 拿走 is more like you are giving the apple to the person.

拿下来 in Chinese does not mean putting it on the floor. It has the meaning of removing it. 下来 really has no such strong directional sense.

Like someone will say to me, "your father has just step down from the court room" (he was a lawyer) -- 你父親剛從法庭上下來. It would not mean he has just stepped down from some high places to the floor, but he has "removed" himself from the court room or left the court room.

[skylee]

拿下来 in Chinese does not mean putting it on the floor. It has the meaning of removing it. 下来 really has no such strong directional sense.

Actually 把蘋果拿下來 reminds me of something like 把那奸賊拿下來.

[anonymoose]

拿下来 in Chinese does not mean putting it on the floor. It has the meaning of removing it.

So would it be wrong to translate 把桌子上的苹果拿下来 as "Take the apples down from the table" then? And if so, how would you in Chinese say "Take the apples down from the table"?

[Dani_man]

I think what Fireball tries to say is 拿下来 will have the same meaning as 拿开 in this case, regarding to what you said before, that 拿下来 would insinuate putting something on the lower surface than it is now.

拿开 seems to be an expression by itself, means to take away things, while 拿下来 is like adding the direction complement (maybe artificially - my friend didn't find it even in wenlin) to express our meaning. I'm not sure about that, but... who knows.

[semantic nuance]

So would it be wrong to translate 把桌子上的苹果拿下来 as "Take the apples down from the table" then?

No, it is not wrong. You can of course translate that way. 拿下來 in this case does indicate the directional sense. About this point, I have different opinon with fireball's. However, it is not necessarily 'down to the floor'. It just means to remove it to a place which is lower than the table. 拿走(開), 拿開, 拿下來 in this case, if you don't differentiate subtly, they can generally mean 'remove'.

拿下来 in Chinese does not mean putting it on the floor. It has the meaning of removing it. 下来 really has no such strong directional sense.

Like someone will say to me, "your father has just step down from the court room" (he was a lawyer) -- 你父親剛從法庭上下來. It would not mean he has just stepped down from some high places to the floor, but he has "removed" himself from the court room or left the court room.

I agree with fireball in the first part that 拿下來 does not mean putting something on the floor. And 下來 has no such "strong" directional sense. However, 下來 still has 'directional' meaning, be it physically or mentally. Like the case fireball made, 你父親剛從法庭上下來,although it does not mean he stepped down from some higher places physically, it does imply he stepped down from 'some higher places' (i.e. the court room) mentally. I hope you guys understand what I'm talking about.

[fireball9261]

I think the "down" position could be the person's hand. At least, that is what I understand.