The Great Leap Forward

[SeekerOfPeace]

I'm currently trying to be less ignorant about China as I've been there close to two years now.

I've been reading some about Mao, excerpts from: "The private life of Chairman Mao" and "Mao: the unknown story" and I'm starting to wonder why I keep seeing his mug plastered on the walls.

Anyways, about the GLP (great leap forward), I would like to be enlightened.

The following is an excerpt from Wikipedia:

n October 1949 after the retreat of the Kuomintang to Taiwan, the Chinese Communist Party proclaimed the establishment of the People's Republic of China. Immediately, landlords and more wealthy peasants had their land holdings forcibly redistributed to poorer peasants. Within the Party, there was major debate about redistribution. A moderate faction within the party and Politburo member Liu Shaoqi argued that change should be gradual and any collectivization of the peasantry should await industrialization, which could provide the agricultural machinery for mechanized farming. A more radical faction led by Mao Zedong argued that the best way to finance industrialization was for the Government to take control of agriculture, thereby establishing a monopoly over grain distribution and supply. This would allow the State to buy at a low price and sell much higher, thus raising the capital necessary for the industrialization of the country. It was realized that this policy would be unpopular with the peasants and therefore it was proposed that the peasants should be brought under Party control by the establishment of agricultural collectives which would also facilitate the sharing of tools and draft animals. This policy was gradually pushed through between 1949 and 1958, first by establishing "mutual aid teams" of 5-15 households, then in 1953 "elementary agricultural cooperatives" of 20-40 households, then from 1956 in "higher co-operatives" of 100-300 families. These reforms (sometimes now referred to as The Little Leap Forward) were generally unpopular with the peasants and usually implemented by summoning them to meetings and making them stay there for days and sometimes weeks until they "voluntarily" agreed to join the collective.

What exactly were the "mutual aid teams"? I don't understand...

[studentyoung]

What exactly were the "mutual aid teams"? I don't understand...

It is called “互助社hu4 zhu4 she4”in Chinese, and its full name is “农业生产互助合作社 agricultural production mutual aid teams”. Usually it was made up of 5 to 15 farmer households “农户”. In this team, they shared farming tools and learned farm technologies from each other. In this way, they helped each other and improved each other’s farming technology.

In Chairman Mao’s Collected works (毛选), it is also expressed as “农业生产互助合作组织agricultural production mutual aid organization.”

Cheers!

[jeffofarabia]

I always thought it was unfortunate that China started putting Mao back on all of the money, instead of keeping the different nationalities on the bills. He did some truly horrible things to China. It is amazing how Deng isn't on any notes or coins, since he radically transformed China's economy.

[SeekerOfPeace]

It is called “互助社hu4 zhu4 she4”in Chinese, and its full name is “农业生产互助合作社 agricultural production mutual aid teams”. Usually it was made up of 5 to 15 farmer households “农户”. In this team, they shared farming tools and learned farm technologies from each other. In this way, they helped each other and improved each other’s farming technology.

In Chairman Mao’s Collected works (毛选), it is also expressed as “农业生产互助合作组织agricultural production mutual aid organization.”

Cheers!

Thank you.

Here's more from Wikipedia:

Besides these economic changes the party implemented major social changes in the countryside including the banishing of all religious and mystic institutions and ceremonies and replacing them with political meetings and propaganda sessions. Attempts were made to enhance rural education and the status of women (allowing females to initiate divorce if they desired) and ending foot-binding, child marriage and opium addiction. Internal passports were introduced in 1956 forbidding travel without appropriate authorisation. Highest priority was given to the urban proletariat for whom a welfare state was created.

Why is it that the Party decided to get rid of all religious and mystic institutions.

Is it because that now was a good time to enforce this aspect of communism.

Also, why is religion incompatible with communism in the first place?

[82riceballs]

Why is it that the Party decided to get rid of all religious and mystic institutions.

Is it because that now was a good time to enforce this aspect of communism.

Also, why is religion incompatible with communism in the first place?

I just read about this two days ago on epoch times online

Under the section: "Evil Communist Theory Opposes Traditional Culture,"

Both Buddhism and Taoism are forms of theism....The Communist Party, on the contrary, not only believes in atheism, but also runs wild in defying the Tao and assaulting the family....Traditional culture differentiates the Chinese from the foreign, but the Communist Manifesto advocates the end of nationality. Confucian culture promotes kindness to others, but the Communist Party encourages class struggle. Confucians encourage loyalty to the monarchy and love for the nation. The Communist Manifesto promotes the elimination of nations.

The section "Traditional Culture is an obstacle to the CCP's Dictatorship" basically says how, traditionally, Chinese believed that in order to "enforce the Tao on behalf of heaven," they could overthrow a regime that was "immoral--unenlightened to the Tao."

"The dictatorial CCP could by no means accept traditional beliefs such as these. The CCP wanted to canonize its own leaders and promote a cult of personality, and so would not allow such long-held concepts such as heaven, Tao, and God to govern from above. The CCP was aware that what it did was considered the most heinous and enormous crime against heaven and the Tao if measured by the standards of traditional culture. They were aware that as long as the traditional culture existed, people would not praise the CCP as “great, glorious, and correct.” Scholars would continue the tradition of “risking their lives to admonish the monarch,” “maintaining justice at the expense of their lives,” [26] and place the people above the rulers. Thus, the people would not become CCP puppets, and the CCP could not force conformity on the thoughts of the masses."

Under the section "Traditional Culture Challenges the Legitimacy of the CCP Rule"-

"THe CCP promotes historical materialism, claiming that Communism is an earthly paradise, the path to which is led by the pioneer proletarians, or the Communist Party. The belief in God thus directly challenged the legitimacy of the CCP's rule.

[SeekerOfPeace]

Ah ok.

So basically, anything that had to do with religion was pretty much stripping the CCP didactorial supremacy.

[imron]

I just read about this two days ago on epoch times online

Which for those who don't realise, is pro-FLG and has a heavy bias when reporting anything about the Chinese government (just like for example the China Daily has a heavy bias when reporting on anything FLG).

[simonlaing]

A couple of things

One the idea of Historical Materialism was the Marxist idea of Political scientific method. There is revolution of ideas that clashes with the old order (feudalism, capitalism) there is a conflict and new more superior level of country operation. This happens several times to reach the final level of communism .

Tradition and religon are seen as props for feudalism.

On communes and work groups.

In the mid to late 1950s there government started creating bigger and bigger comunes.

Around 1959 (have to check a book for the exact date) the country embarked on a plan to jump a step in industrialisation. they created huge communes and asked people (forcibly) to contribute live stock (many people killed their livestock as well) . People went to huge canteens where they were at first told to eat as much as they wanted.

As well as the food people were told to contribute iron ore to make steel. Most of these were low grade or from farm tools. (so the amount of quality steel made was small and the loss of farm tool productivity was great it is theorized as stats aren't published). In these village communes small smelters were constructed to make the low grade steel. In addition much farm land was deforested to feed the smelters. (Some environment activists point to this has continued caused for erosion issues and loss of arrable land.)

In addition the women folk were sent out to the hard labor of crops (i.e. back breaking rice) Their efficiency wasn't as good as both men and women, add to that erosion issues, run away food consumption and bad weather there was much loss of life.

In Chinese textbooks it is called the time of the "3 year drought" I think.

It was so bad that in 1962 or 3 Mao lost one of his titles and moderates in the party took more control.

My Foreign Affairs teacher back at Nanda also told me some other contextual infomation. Also in the 1950s there was a Russian Marshal plan, lots of loans, engineers and weapons support. But unlike the US which gave several extensions on the loans and was flexible on the repayment of the European loans, the Russians were sticklers (only huge apples and large crabs) and made China pay back the loans on schedule. Also just China is starting to industrialize it is drawn into the Korean war and borrows lots more money from Russia to run at the machine guns in North Korea. In addition around 1959 at the start of the great leap Mao has a falling out with Russia over several things, including not sharing nuclear technology, loan repayments, russian passivism cold war attitude, not helping in Korea etc... Russia withdraws it's engineers and China is left with unfinished bridges (one in Nanjing) factories and huge factories that lack good technicians to run them.

So at the time of collectivisation decreasing farming out out, increasing consumption, paying back massive loans on bad terms and a lack of Engineering skill China did not do well in the Great leap forward.Which is roughly 1958-64

The little leap forward, 1949 -58 which apart from the Korean war . Was very good for the economy with rebuilding the country after World War 2 and the civil war. Small coops were seen as very useful. The could work on joint irrigation systems for example. (there were limited experiments with market systems that worked well.) The Russian engineers, techonology and loans helped tremendously.

I hope this gives you some background.

It is hard to talk to Chinese people about this time as well.but it good to be sensitive to it.

History is interesting,

Simon:)

[imron]

So basically, anything that had to do with religion was pretty much stripping the CCP didactorial supremacy.

Here for example is another point of view:

'Religion is the opium of the people,' said Karl Marx. It is the task of the Communist Party to make this truth comprehensible to the widest possible circles of the labouring masses. It is the task of the party to impress firmly upon the minds of the workers, even upon the most backward, that religion has been in the past and still is today one of the most powerful means at the disposal of the oppressors for the maintenance of inequality, exploitation, and slavish obedience on the part of the toilers.

[outcast]

Why is it that the Party decided to get rid of all religious and mystic institutions.

Is it because that now was a good time to enforce this aspect of communism.

Also, why is religion incompatible with communism in the first place?

Because for centuries religion was a tool used by the old monarchies in Europe to oppress their people. One of the reasons for the French Revolution was to overthrow the First Estate.

[Luobot]

'Religion is the opium of the people,' said Karl Marx.

... religion has been in the past and still is today one of the most powerful means at the disposal of the oppressors for the maintenance of inequality, exploitation, and slavish obedience on the part of the toilers.

Funny how you can replace the word "religion" with any of the following -- nationalism, communism, fascism, capitalism, and others where people put their faith in an "ism" -- and the rest of the statement still generally seems to work.

[imron]

Yeah you can. The point I was trying to make is that you should gather information from multiple sources, and draw your own conclusions from that. To rely on one single source, especially one that is heavily biased (by being either pro- or anti-communist) will leave you with an inaccurate and incomplete view of things.

[renzhe]

Funny how you can replace the word "religion" with any of the following -- nationalism, communism, fascism, capitalism, and others where people put their faith in an "ism" -- and the rest of the statement still generally seems to work.

Yes.

Both Marxism-Leninism and the modern free-market capitalism are basically religions.