My Chinese fiance will choose his parents over me

[monto]

imron:

And if you had a daughter, and she went against your wishes and married such a man, would you think that this also "actually have nothing to do with Respects to Parents"

Aha! Before such question, I am never sure to say "Yes" or "No" with my limited English.

So I have to make my own words that if such thing would happen, I would not relate that to "Respect"-to-me. I might feel "loosing of faces" because I would have such a STUPID daughter.

As you know, I said

and I would not agree my daughter to marry such man if I had one

I didn't say

I would not LET my daughter to marry such man if I had one

I think there is big difference between the two.

[Woodpecker]

First, he is not a man (他不是个男人）as we Chinese often say. What he is doing actually have nothing to do with "Respects to Parents" we Chinese favour. He's still dependent on his parents psycologically, and most likely, financially too.

Of course he would be more heroic if he married Xuefang against his parents' wishes, but losing your family is not a nice thing to have happen. He's spent more time living with his parents so it's not surprising he doesn't want to lose them.

Five years of that relationship, and he still doing that kind of thing? I can be sure that he has no feeling of responsibities, or courage or even actual affection/love for you, or any of them.

They are engaged! What kind of a man would he be if he was engaged to someone he didn't love? Just because he is being emotionally blackmailed by his parents does not necessarily make him a bad man (but then I'm not Chinese).

[xuefang]

1. How good is your Chinese?

I don't speak Chinese, just some phrases. I really would like to learn both Mandarin and Cantonese. My fiance's mother language is Cantonese. I have always been very interested about China and Chinese culture, before I met my fiance. Some would say that I'm a fan of China. My fiance can't understand why I'm so into China.

3. His parents should have foreseen the possibility of you getting engaged. Were they happy for you to be together as long as you weren't engaged?

No, they have been against us for the beginning. When we start dating my fiance's parents said that we can't be together because I'm not Chinese. That's the only explanation that I've got.

where from China are they from?

They are from Guangzhou, but have been living in Finland over ten years. When my fiance visit China in 2005 they suggested that they could arrange a date for him and for some Chinese girl. But ofcourse he didn't accept that.

How old are you guys? If you're under 25 this could just be immaturity that he hasn't learned how to go against the parents. Often if his studies or living situation is financially backed by the parents this can also be difficult.

I'm 20 and he'll turn 25 soon. He needs some financial support from his parents but in my opinion the parents need more his help. He will go about 1-3 times a month to help at the parents restaurant. He is there at the moment too.

Thanks for everyone! This really is in my mind every day since my fiance told me about his opinion. Before I wanted that sometime his parents would like me. But now I want that they wouldn't hate me so much and all I want is to be together with my fiance.

[xuefang]

In any case, this mess has not being going on for the whole five years, only since his parents found out he was engaged in the last few months. They knew they were dating and didn't have a problem with that.

Parents have been againts us for the whole time. But now when they know that it really is serious they are showing their opinion stronger. I was okey when I didn't think of these things and just hoped things will go fine. But now I'm concern that this will be much harder than I thought.

[gato]

Apart from the parents issue, I think you are a bit too young to get married. So you started dating him when you were 16 and he was 21?

[xuefang]

Apart from the parents issue, I think you are a bit too young to get married. So you started dating him when you were 16 and he was 21?

Yes, I was 16 and he was 20. So we have 4,5 years between. I don't think that I'm too young to get married. If the parents would love me and we have enough money I would be ready to get married today. But because of these problems I would be really happy to get married in 4-5 years.

[Lu]

I agree that it would definitely help to meet the parents, and go out of your way to do absolutely everything to show how good a daughter-in-law you would be. And I really mean go out of your way, do everything you can that they might expect of you, even if you think it's a bit ridiculous or not really necessary. Ask advice to your fiance, but also to his little sister, and other Chinese if you know them, on what a mother-in-law expects of a good Chinese daughter-in-law.

All in all, I think it is generally a bad idea to make someone choose between their family and their better half. This is perhaps even more so the case in Chinese families, with its emphasis on the family and respect for the parents. Rather than make him choose you (even if he would, it would hurt him and his parents a lot), I think you should try to make his parents see that even though they think all foreign girls are unworthy of their son, you could be the exception.

It probably won't amend the situation right away, but it certainly won't hurt, and things might improve over time. So, I'd not expect to get married anytime soon (but both of you are still quite young, so it wouldn't be too bad to wait a bit longer, right), the problem might become smaller over time.

I'm not sure if sons have more leverage in this issue than daughters. A huaqiao friend of mine explained me once that it's acceptable if daughter marries a foreigner: she was going to leave the family anyway, she was never really their daughter to begin with, but the daughter-in-law of someone else. A son however is to continue the family line, consider the shame if the family line would be tained by halfbloods.

That little brother also has a non-Chinese girlfriend might make things even more difficult: if he had a Chinese girlfriend, the parents could at least hope for Chinese grandchildren from him, but as things are all hopes are on the eldest (who is the most important anyway).

Xuefang, I am sorry to hear about your situation, and wish you the best of luck!

[xuefang]

I am sorry to hear about your situation, and wish you the best of luck!

Thank you for your thoughts. I really want to be the best daughter-in-law for my fiance's parents. And the best wife for my fiance.

[Lu]

Of course you do, it's not my intention to imply that you wouldn't! I mean, traditional Chinese parents might have different ideas about what is a good daughter-in-law than your or my parents have, so what you have learned from home might not always work with them.

[yonglin]

It must be very difficult for young overseas Chinese whose parents settle in very white communities, yet demand their children to marry someone ethnically Chinese. Actually, I have this theory that it's quite easy to be affected by the aesthetic ideals of the surrounding community in one's beauty preferences: for instance, having spent some time in China, I'm just generally more attracted to Asian guys than white guys, and I have a white male friend who - having spent a year or so in China - just find English girls intrinsically unattractive. Similarly, many younger Chinese people settled in the West find their understanding of what is attractive becoming unconsciously skewed in favour of white people

Back on topic, we first have to keep in mind that many overseas Chinese parents are far more traditional than their mainland counterparts, since it's entirely up to them (as a family) to instill good moral and discipline in their children. In China, these matters are largely taken care of within the educational system, and many parents are quite easy on their kids at home. Some people in the Mainland still have a romanticized picture of how good things are in the west and embrace western culture for this reason. Overseas Chinese, on the other hand, have first-hand experience of what they perceive of as moral decay and general indecency.

I think that the OP will have to demonstrate to her future parents-in-law that she is not what they expect a young Finnish girl to be like, since this is radically opposite to everything deemed desirable in a good wife in traditional Chinese culture. As Scandinavian young women, we're not only expected to be blonde (in both senses), but also to be loud and feminist, drink excessively, and be easy to get in bed. I'm not exaggerating here, but talking from personal experience: for instance, when my boyfriend's quite conservative Asian-American parents found out that their son was dating a Swedish girl, they got quite upset and told him that he would have to be very careful with those Swedes. I would imagine that your fiance's parents frequently see other Finnish girls getting drunk, smoking, wearing revealing clothes, etc. (especially if they run a restaurant!) - all of which they probably find inappropriate for girls to do. Naturally, if they don't know you, they will believe that you are just like them. I think that once you get to meet your fiance's parents, it is very important that you keep a very low-key profile, that you don't talk loudly or excessively, that you are extremely polite, show that you care a lot about our fiance's well-being, and ideally, that you seem comfortable doing things at home (i.e., what the consider women's duties, demonstrating that you'd be a good wife... I personally find this bit particularly hard).

Of course, the more you know about China and Chinese culture and customs the better, and the more comfortable they will feel around you. This could involve things from mastering chopsticks impeccably and tapping your fingertips on the table when someone pours you tea, to speaking Chinese or be well-read on Chinese poetry. Your boyfriend might be able to teach you some of these things, but socializing with other Chinese people, as well as reading some books, etc. will help as well. I personally believe that we should all strive to learn the native language of our partner/spouse, so if they speak Cantonese to each other in your fiance's family, then you should learn Cantonese; if they speak Mandarin, you should learn Mandarin. Both of these languages are very expressful, very useful, and much fun to learn, so you really shouldn't have a hard time motivating yourself.

It is possible that once you have convinced your boyfriend that you will make a good impression on his parents, he will be less reluctant to letting you meet them. It might be the case that there is something about how you usually act - which he might like or at least not be bothered by - but which he knows that his parents will be annoyed by.

Finally, if he says he'd stay faithful to his parents rather than to you, and if he knows that your parents would never accept you, then surely he would have left you already (if he has some kind of honour).

Thus, I think he might just be waiting for the right time. My last piece of advice is just that you make sure that you are as well-prepared for that as possible when that time comes. That might be in months or years, but surely that time will come. Maybe you would even have had the opportunity to visit China with your fiance before then.

I really wish all the best for you!

[simonlaing]

I'm 20 and he'll turn 25 soon. He needs some financial support from his parents but in my opinion the parents need more his help. He will go about 1-3 times a month to help at the parents restaurant. He is there at the moment too.

There have been other threads about this but norm for traditional Chinese men to marry is 30-35 and after they have 1) Bought a house or apartment 2) Have a good job 3) have money for the wedding.

Your fiance hasn't done these things and your courtship has been at school, not quite like real life. So the good news is you still have a good chance the bad news is he will likely wait 4-5 years before actually getting Married.

You're only 20 , that should be enough time to wait. He has to become independent of his parents before you can make him think about taking this big step.

Overseas chinese are often more traditional than Mainland Chinese.

Good luck,

Simon:)

[ipsi()]

I reckon 20's way too young for marriage. I'm certainly not considering it for myself (being 21). Maybe in a few years... On the other hand, I may have to consider it sooner to help my girlfriend save face (she's 24, and may be looked down on if she's still unmarried at 28-29). We'll see how that goes.

Anyway, I agree with whoever said that overseas Chinese parents are more conservative than those in China. My girlfriend's family have all been very accepting of me (I'm extremely lucky there), even her grandfather acts ok with it (I have no idea what he truly thinks), whereas one my friends in New Zealand has Chinese parents, but grew up here. Thus, she thinks and acts like a Kiwi in all respects. She's dating a Kiwi dude, another good friend of mine (who's flatting in the house owned and occupied by her older brother...), and her parents aren't terribly happy about it, or about her being out late, to the point where her dad will call and tell her to come home at midnight or so on a Saturday... despite the fact that she's with her older brother and friends, who lives maybe 15 minutes walk away in an upscale neighbourhood (she's 19 I believe)... Very strange... Apparently there's also been a bit of talk that maybe her brother needs some 'help' finding a girlfriend... Not sure what they'd do if he found a Kiwi girlfriend.

As others have said, try and wait as best you can. Enjoy what you've got now, and don't ruin it by worrying about what might happen.

Oh, and if that's how Swedish girls are often portrayed, then it's the same over here, and if his parents are traditional then I'm not too surprised. It might not be a case of "not Chinese", but just a case of "Doesn't act like a Chinese wife should".

On the other hand, you may have to accept that they're completely racist, and that they'll never accept you, no matter what you do. It's hard, but some people just can't seem to change themselves.

[xuefang]

I would imagine that your fiance's parents frequently see other Finnish girls getting drunk, smoking, wearing revealing clothes, etc. (especially if they run a restaurant!) - all of which they probably find inappropriate for girls to do. Naturally, if they don't know you, they will believe that you are just like them.

Oh, and if that's how Swedish girls are often portrayed, then it's the same over here, and if his parents are traditional then I'm not too surprised. It might not be a case of "not Chinese", but just a case of "Doesn't act like a Chinese wife should".

I'm happy that I'm not typical (stereotype of ) Finnish in that way. I don't smoke, I'm never drunk or wear that kind of clothes. My fiance's uncle has said that I'm a good girl because of that. I have to make sure that the parents know that too. It would be great if the parents would come to our house and see how we are living and what kind of a wife I will be. When my fiance gets back home I'll discuss with him about all this.

But ofcourse I do have opinions that maybe Chinese wife don't. About equality between man and woman, raising children and so on. Or at least different opinions than the parents have.

This could involve things from mastering chopsticks impeccably and tapping your fingertips on the table when someone pours you tea, to speaking Chinese or be well-read on Chinese poetry. Your boyfriend might be able to teach you some of these things, but socializing with other Chinese people, as well as reading some books, etc. will help as well. I personally believe that we should all strive to learn the native language of our partner/spouse, so if they speak Cantonese to each other in your fiance's family, then you should learn Cantonese.

I would be more than happy to learn all these and especially learning Cantonese. I really want to know what the parents are speaking and what my kids will be speaking. I don't want to be an outsider.

[Woodpecker]

I would be more than happy to learn all these and especially learning Cantonese. I really want to know what the parents are speaking and what my kids will be speaking. I don't want to be an outsider.

Then go for it! Here's a forum for Cantonese learners:

http://www.cantonese.sheik.co.uk/phorum

And here's the (free) American FSI method for learning Cantonese (others are discussed in the forum linked above):

http://www.fsi-language-courses.com/Cantonese.aspx

And a question for everyone else: why are traditional Chinese parents so keen to break up mixed relationships?

[xuefang]

Then go for it! Here's a forum for Cantonese learners:

http://www.cantonese.sheik.co.uk/phorum

And here's the (free) American FSI method for learning Cantonese (others are discussed in the forum linked above):

http://www.fsi-language-courses.com/Cantonese.aspx

Thank you very much!

[Lu]

But ofcourse I do have opinions that maybe Chinese wife don't. About equality between man and woman, raising children and so on. Or at least different opinions than the parents have.

On this, my advice would be to not say anything about your opinions to his parents. If the subject comes up, smile sweetly and nod in seeming agreeance to whatever they are saying. You don't have to agree with them, but don't disagree with them in their face.

[zozzen]

be accidentally pregnant, get them have their own "sun" (grandson) and that's what we say "milled rice become steamed rice". Genetically the mixed grandson will be more likely to look like a Chinese and that possibly please the grandparents.

[studentyoung]

I don't speak Chinese, just some phrases. I really would like to learn both Mandarin and Cantonese. My fiance's mother language is Cantonese. I have always been very interested about China and Chinese culture, before I met my fiance. Some would say that I'm a fan of China. My fiance can't understand why I'm so into China.

Oh ~ ~! I think you should learn some Cantonese first. Just like how to say, “Good morning”, “Hello, aunt/uncle”, “thank you”, etc. Meanwhile, you can learn some Guangzhou people’s tradition in their daily life.

Hey, here is a good website for you to discover Guangzhou. Hehe. Hope you will like it.

http://www.lifeofguangzhou.com/node_10/node_228/index.shtml

No, they have been against us for the beginning. When we start dating my fiance's parents said that we can't be together because I'm not Chinese. That's the only explanation that I've got.

Don’t worry. I think they just need some time to accept you! If possible, try to learn to cook some Cantonese dishes and ask your fiancé take your master pieces back home for his parents. I’m sure they expect their daughter-in-law can cook some Cantonese dishes for them. Hehe. Ah~ ~, it will be great, if you can cook some Cantonese soup for them too. (Note: Cantonese soup is something very important in traditional Cantonese people's daily life. If your fiancé’s parents think the Cantonese soup you cook is very good, which might imply they will accept you in their heart very soon.)

I'm 20 and he'll turn 25 soon. He needs some financial support from his parents but in my opinion the parents need more his help. He will go about 1-3 times a month to help at the parents restaurant. He is there at the moment too.

If I were you, I would go to that restaurant and give a helping hand, especially when they’re busy. Hehe.

be accidentally pregnant, get them have their own "sun" (grandson) and that's what we say "milled rice become steamed rice". Genetically the mixed grandson will be more likely to look like a Chinese and that possibly please the grandparents.

I understand what you mean completely, but I think in this case, both OP and her Fiancé are still too young. I’m afraid that it might hurt OP.

Anyway, gook luck, xuefang!

Cheers!

[simonlaing]

If you can try and rent or download the movie,

My big fat Greek Wedding. It has a lot of these issues and is a good chessy movie to help you understand these things.

have fun, Good Luck

Simon:)

[DrWatson]

Or how about the film version of Amy Tan's Joy Luck Club?