cars

[Scoobyqueen]

as per title.

[Senzhi]

I guess Beijing is not Dakar.

I hope I'll never have to encounter them in Shantou. It's already bad enough that people consider the pavement an extra driving lane here, even at primary schools.

[BrandeX]

There isn't any automobile racing in China from what I can see, so interest in tune cars for personal use may be low also, i.e. a cultural thing. Also if Beijing is even remotely similar to here, where are you going to "open it up" any ways? Most of your time is in bumper to bumper traffic. Now, I have seen several "rally" styled cars, but these appear to be mostly cosmetic with people putting some ground effects dozens of stickers, a louder muffler and a big wing on some otherwise normal car. (Hmm lots of those back in the US also, haha). In fact its pretty rare to see any kind of "sporty" production car here in Guangzhou,2 -door must be 1 in a million. Saw a 71-73 Mustang here once though, that was nothing short of amazing to see driving by here.

[cdn_in_bj]

I notice that in Beijing tuned cars are conspicuous by their absence and I was wondering why that was. Can you not buy them in China (eg Skylines, Evos)? I saw a lot much more expensive cars so obviously price cannot be a factor. Perhaps the image just isnt one that the Chinese can relate to (however fun they are to drive).

Scoobyqueen, I'd meant to ask you about your interest in Subarus, and here you've given me the opportunity to do so.

Firstly, those "much more expensive" cars that you're referring to are probably all the Audi A8s, Benz S-class, BMW 7-series, Porsche Cayenne, Land Rover, etc. - these cars would not usually be the first choice of your typical young auto enthusiast.

I've actually seen a couple of WRX STI's here, but no Skylines nor EVOs - the latter two aren't officially imported. The closest thing you'll find to an EVO here is the locally-made Souest Lancer.

Anyway, it seems nearly all Chinese want to buy a car (I even met a waiter who was considering spending his parents' money on one) which is surprising since it is basically not a good investment, something I thought was a consideration in any large purchase decision.

It's every young (and not so young) man's dream here to own a nice car, that's after they get the apartment of course. Have you flipped through any of the Chinese automobile magazines? You'll find features on many cars that are not available here, and if you get the chance to chat with someone here who is "into cars", you'll probably find that they're just as enthusiastic about these cars as you are. The problem is that it's just not practical right now to own these type of car, for several reasons. Firstly, while the the auto market here is huge and is growing at an incredible rate, it is also very focussed - many of these sports/rally cars are just not sold here. And the ones that are are imported and therefore heavily taxed. As for bringing your own car over from overseas, that's a big hassle and even if you have the required paperwork you'll get whomped with huge import taxes.

As for tuning/modifying cars, I take you're not just talking about adding a big wing and some flashy stickers, right? ;) The main reason why you don't see as many modified cars here is because it's technically illegal. Even installing a body kit will cause you to fail the annual registration inspection. What many people do is they'll get their mechanic to swap back to the factory bumpers when they do the inspection. Or they'll bribe the people doing the inspection. However, more extensive modifications would be harder to get away with. So any serious tuning would be limited to those with a lot of money and the right connections.

Regarding the "racing scene", I think there is one here but it's probably very small. A few years back there was a group of racers who famously did a "lap" of the 2nd ring road in a rediculously short amount of time (under 13 minutes), and posted it on the 'net. I just found a danwei article that briefly mentions this:

http://www.danwei.org/media_and_advertising/drag_racing_in_china_sanlian_a.php

(It also looks like I need to start reading the Chinese version of FHM)

As for myself, I've always thought that it'd be fun to get a VW/Audi/Skoda with the factory 1.8t or 2.0t and order a performance chip from overseas for an easy horsepower boost. But I'm not particularly fond of VWs and the A4 is way too expensive over here...

[rob07]

Regarding the "racing scene", I think there is one here but it's probably very small.

What about Han Han (韩寒)? He is a Chinese professional race car driver. I seem to remember an interview with him in which he said that the racing scene was small but everyone in was encouraging each other to one day be as good as the best Western drivers.

I'm interested in Han Han because he just has the most ridiculously glamorous life. Not only is a professional race car driver but he is also one of China's top four or five best selling novelists (which is how he makes it on to my radar) and apparently by some counts has the most popular blog in the world with hundreds of millions of hits making him an influential social commentator. He's only 25 but seems to have been around for years.

I read one of Han Han's novels a couple of years ago when my Chinese was even worse than it is now. When I finished it, I thought "That was really deep. Every sentence made me think". But then it occurred to me that maybe that was just because I was struggling to understand the language he wrote it in. Does anyone have an opinion as to whether there is real substance behind any or all of Han Han's racing aspirations, novels or social commentary?

[Scoobyqueen]

Thanks for the responses.

[cdn_in_bj]

cdn_in_bj I bought an STi a few years ago (and have been hooked ever since) to go fast around corners with here in Germany where I am currently based.

Good choice in car! If I were still in Canada there's a good chance I'd be driving a WRX.

I am talking here about the Volvo C30 (?) in particular. But the prices quoted at the auto show in Beining were higher than my STi. Perhaps import duties are higher.

Yes, import duties on cars are very high here. The reason why cars like the Audi A4 and BMW 3-series aren't even more expensive than they already is because they're locally manufactured. Unfortunately, the S4 and M3 are imported.

There is also a tax on engine displacement. Hence the only cars you'll find here with more than 6 cylinders are the big Audi/BMW/Benz sedans.

By the way, I was wrong when I previously stated that the EVO is not available here. In fact, the EVO IX is sold as an import and the price is a cool 458k RMB.

Anyway, on the quality front, Chinese consumers appear remarkably savvy, considering they accept so many other sub-standard products. They were talking about VW and Japanese makes.

Those who can afford to pay more for better quality will demand it. And this goes for other products, not just cars.

I doubt the Chinese designed and produced Land Wind (what's it called in Chinese?) will sell well in China if the crash tests they have done here in Germany is anything to go by. The dummy was decapitated in the process!

It will sell well as long as its cheap. There is a large demographic here that can now just afford to buy their first car, and that's the main customer base of the local manufacturers such as Chery, Geely, and yes, even Land Wind. Those who can afford better are concerned with safety, and that's where you see the C-NCAP ratings being mentioned in advertisements. Of course, the C-NCAP ratings are also having an affect on the cheaper cars, so it's good for the entire industry.

From what you say about the car market, it may well be that the consumers wont have a chance to buy rally cars in the future because in a few years they will be deemed to pollute the environment too much and the few of us still driving them will be banned to the smoker's abyss whereever that will be.

That's a good point. China is taking emissions very seriously, and there will be a nationwide ban on new cars not meeting the China 3 (which is said to be equivalent to Euro 3) emissions standards next month. However, that's gonna do squat all for all those old, smog belching diesel trucks on the road. It's said that Beijing has even gone a few steps further and raised the bar to China 5 (Euro 5) levels, but I don't know of any cars currently on the Chinese market which meet China 5.

Tuning to me means small clever electronics that boost power. The legal barrier exists here as well but its often a warranty issue. In China, I imagine there are many issues to be be solved in insurance cases.

Again, backing up on my previous statement - you are allowed to modify the body as long as you can amend the registration to show it. However, that's apparently not very easy to do, and would be even more difficult with very extensive changes. And I believe that powertrain changes are out of the question. Of course if we're talking about aftermarket electronics such as a performance chip or boost controller, then these would be easy to conceal/"undo" and shouldn't be a problem.

The insurance adjuster will go by what's shown in the vehicle registration. So if your fancy aftermarket body kit gets smashed up in an accident, and it isn't shown on the registration, then you can forget about claiming damage to that part.

Come to think of it, I would not want to own a car there because of it. Here in Germany, they attack you for causing a tiny scratch on your car (it happened to me and I was riding a bike) but in China who is at fault is probably so difficult to determine that the insurance of each person has to pay up even though you had nothing to do with it. How does it work?

Nicks and scratches (and worse) are a fact of life here. Fortunately, it's very cheap to get minor bodywork done here - for example, it only costs 300-400 RMB to get a bumper repainted. I don't see any issues with determining who's at fault in accidents. In fact, last year the traffic bureau published guidelines for drivers to quickly determine fault in minor accidents without involving the traffic police. The goal being to get disputes resolved in a quick manner and reduce the number of traffic jams caused by fender-benders. Of course, in more complicated accidents, or cases where consensus cannot be reached between the parties, the traffic police will come to determine fault and fines. As for insurance claims, the way it works is that the insurance company of whoever is at fault (or more at fault) has to pay for the other party's claim. Of course this will affect the insurance premiums at the next renewal for the at-fault party. There is a centralized system to track claims that all the insurance companies are connected with so it's no longer possible to avoid premium increases by changing insurance companies. However, since the insurance is tied to the vehicle and not the individual driver, you get a break if you change cars.

Re VW. The GTI is available in China but it still has that spongy suspension that I am not that keen on for VWs. What about a Honda? Honda TypeR in fact was my first choice until I drove the STi.

The GTI is also an import and therefore it's rediculously expensive here (I believe it's over 350k RMB). As for Honda, unfortunately we don't get any of the Type-R cars over here. The few interesting sports cars here are the RX-8 and 350Z, but again these are imports. I am actually very tempted by the RX-8, and the markup isn't quite as bad as some other premium cars, but 380k RMB is a lot to spend on a car. Especially here where the in-city traffic is so bad.

Thanks for the article link. Wow that's fast. It reminds me of the illegal street races that take place in Russia. There are a number of good girl drivers too. Fast and Furious has a lot to answer to.

I remember reading that there is a larger street racing scene in Shanghai, especially amongst motorcyclists, which is causing concern for the local police.

If anyone has any links to Chinese car mags, I would be interested to to see them.

I don't have the links to the Chinese car magazines, but here's a blog that discusses the Chinese car industry:

http://www.chinacartimes.com