Ji'nanHua 济南话 (Tsinan Dialect 濟南話) anyone....?

[Xi'Er Dun]

Now I know "Ji'nanHua 济南话", the Tsinan Dialect which is classified more generally under the greater ShandongHua 山东话 (Shantung Dialect) is quite often regarded as a variation on Mandarin. However, when I was last in Ji'nan studying at Shandong University (山大), I on quite a few occasion when attempting to get a taxi (打的), I encountered a language difficulty, as aren't Taxi Drivers supposed to use Standard PuTongHua普通话, but they only wished to use Ji'nanHua, so I sjowed them a written card with Shandong University written on it, but they exclaimed what sounded like "San-dong Da-sua" and not Shandong Daxue 山东大学. So I know this is the pronunciation in Ji'nanHua, but as I am returning to Ji'nan next year, I wish to learn more spoken Ji'nanHua as it know has my interest. I also the local greeting there sounds like "Ni Hou Ma?". Many people have often said to me that the Ji'nanHua is so close to standard Mandarin, but I'm still not so sure as I heard distinct differences in pronucniation.

I am just wondering if anyone on this forum is from Ji'nan, if so could they either link me to a page on Ji'nanHua or write transcribe some useful Ji'nanHua pronunciation in regard to distinct differences in their reply.Some mor often that not classify the local Ji'nan Speech under they name of greater "QiLu Mandarin冀鲁官话". I have also once before found a Ji'nan Dialect sound table, which lists initial sounds not found in Standard PuTongHua such as [v], [ŋ] ng- and [ɲ] ny- as present in their usage inventory. So is this a more historical derivation of Mandarin or a dialect itself that has maintained initial sounds once found in much older mainstream Chinese dialects.

So if anyone with specific knowledge in this area, could they please discuss Ji'nan Dialect in greater detail in this thread, then that would be most helpful.

~~Xi'Er-Dun

[liuzhou]

aren't Taxi Drivers supposed to use Standard PuTongHua普通话

Taxi drivers throughout the world speak varieties of 的士话. In a long existence in a several countries, I've never once met a taxi driver who spoke standard anything else.

[mythia]

I think an essential part more or less in common with learning various foreign languages is to listen to the natives speak, and try to immitate and ultimately, use it as the natives do. So I highly recommend listen to some 济南话 material.

I hope this http://so.youku.com/search_video/type_tag_q_济南话 could be of interest to you. It was a program made by a Shandong TV channel, which dubs some classic western movies in Jinan Hua. The dialogues are loosely based on their original contexts, but are processed to make them funnier and sound better to a Shandongman's ear. We used to watch it in our uni days and laugh our a$$es off.

济南话 is different from Mandarin in that it has tone variations and lots of slangs of its own, which altogether could confuse any Shandongman who's not from Jinan. Having said so though, 济南话 is not as different from Mandarin as probably the rest of Shandong Hua are, and if you could just pay attention to some difference in general in the manner of pronunciation you could find yourself pouring out Jinan hua in a few months if not weeks. What's better than picking up an accent when you are with those people who speak it. ;)

Edited September 30, 2008 at 03:04 PM by mythia

[Xi'Er Dun]

Thankyou all the users who gave graciuosly given a few minutes of their time to respond to my thread. All though, you are write I guess as I have been told before too, that achieving conversational level in speking some of theses local Mandarin derived city"Hua's"in Northern China come by staying there for not a great deal of time.

Your links shall prove more than useful.

[Ah-Bin]

There is a dictionary of this dialect written in traditional characters and inernational phonetic alphabet 濟南方言詞典 but it only contains dialect-specific words and is a bit difficult to use.

[parasite]

I love JinanHua. Only wish my Mandarin was decent before I went there so I'd have had a full year to give it the attention it deserves. Since there are definitely no books that teach it, I think the only venue to really get a decent level (a technique I didn't know existed back in 2003 when I was around) is Dr. Argüelles' shadowing. Get something you are sure is authentic but useful in Jinanese or else get a Mandarin beginner's Chinese book dialogs translated, then hire someone to record it with super clear super pure Jinanhua enunciation. Then... shadow with the recording until it's burned in your brain Then "perform" for a native to get the subtle problems in your pronunciation fixed.

Be careful of 济普, which is what the older people speak when they THINK they are speaking Mandarin. The line is really blurry I think because a lot of older words got supplemented by Mandarin words, and the stuff grandpa uses can be incomprehensible to the youth.

By the way there is a newspaper which had a column every week teaching some Jinanese. You should see if a local can tell you what paper and what day, I don't remember the details.