Buddhism

[waxwing]

I'm not sure if this is the right place, but I wanted to ask about Buddhism in China.

I really am quite a novice when it comes to Chinese culture but I've had a longstanding interest in Buddhism.

Is it widely practiced in China (I believe the answer is yes)? What does this practice really entail? Which 'branch' of Buddhism is most prevalent (I believe it's some form of Mahayana .. I seem to remember the term 'Chan' but I'm not sure..)?

How does the Communist aspect of modern China interact with this?

Any good websites?

Thanks.

[holyman]

buddhism in china is mahayana and in qing dynasty lin'ji branch and cao'dong branch are the 2 main schools, with lin'ji as the one with overwhelming influence(the qing emperor shun'zhi was a lin'ji believer). during the kmt regime a monk by the name of hong'yi revive the 律宗 but wasnt very influencial. the most prevalent one at present(in china and in most chinese concentrated areas) is the sacred land branch, for its simplicity. imo not many in china knows what buddhism is all about nowadays. just take it as a form of religion.

[ananda]

The buddhism in china is Mahayana, the famous are pure-land and chan,

and many others, but these branches are all compatible, for example,

one monk of some temple creates his buddhism system based on his

understanding of some buddhism books, and his work was appreciated

by others, then it would be called 'xxx' branch. Pure-land and Chan

are most popular in Han chinese, and there's a tendency for them to

incorporate into one 'cause you could find many temples which are

pure-land and chan.

The difference between Chan and Pureland:(to my understanding)

Chan: one could be buddha only by the way of helping himself, no one

else could help him except himself.

Pure-land: it's possible to direct some one to become buddha,

and, it's neccesary to borrow the buddha's strength to gain ur aim.

Chan: there's no need to dedicate into the language/books, just 'purge

the dust of your heart' and you could become buddha.

Pure-land: To say "A mi tuo fo"(Salute to Buddha Amito!) would help

you become buddha.

Chan:Buddha lies in your heart.

Pureland: Buddha lies in the west happiest land(not europe)

Pureland: There's a clear borderline between mundane life and pureland.

Chan: no need to chase 'pure-land' 'cause it is everywhere if you could

find it.

But in order to learn the books of Buddhism. don't care about the branch.

It's not necessary to practice buddhism in a temple or become a monk,

but it's helpful to do that. You could practice it in nearly every temple,

and it's better to find some temple which has Buddhism institute.

Don't pay much attention on the Communists aspect, I doubt wether

there're true communists in china.

[shibo77]

I don't know much about Buddhism, but I think Chan is an incorporation of Buddhism with Daoism.

I guess Ananda was Pure Land then?

-Shibo

[maybedaisy]

as a chinese,i know less than you guys

because i'm not a Buddhist.but my grandmother is a Buddhist.

in china, many elders are Buddhist, especially the people who have been little educated.

[holyman]

chan, or zen in japanese, is a pure buddhism product. in tang dynasty there are many branches of chinese buddhism. a general saying would be like 10 branches. during the time of tang wu zong the govt believed that buddhism had encouraged people to be lazy cos temples were taking up good lands and they dont pay tax to the country. the monks beg for alms and are not productive in anyway. so he ordered the closing of buddhist temples and forced 220 000 monks and nuns back to secular life. only the zen branch survived this cos 1, in earlier days they forseen such accusation and they changed the buddhist way of life. begging for food is disallowed and monks have to work the fields to provide for themselves. 2, unlike other branches who relied on scriptures and relics to pass down the teachings, zenism emphasized more on learning the way of buddha thru one's own experiences and understandings. even if the temples and scriptures were destroyed they can still carry on practising buddhism.

if i'm not wrong, present buddhism branches are all different branches within zenism, . pure land is popular among the common people cos its way of attaining enlightenment is relatively simple compared to others, just chant the prayer 'amittabha'.

[waxwing]

@ananda: thanks, that was a pretty useful post.

@holyman: same 2 U kind sir

@shibo77

I guess Ananda was Pure Land then?

Hmm do you mean Ananda the disciple of the Buddha, ananda the poster on this forum or 'ananda' as .. joy?

thanks for your info too.

In china, many elders are Buddhist, especially the people who have been little educated.

Hehe, that's funny, in the West, most of the people who are interested in Buddhism are vastly over-educated.

[ananda]

shibo77, I'm not a Buddhist till now, just have some interests in it.

[xuechengfeng]

The majority of people I met who are Buddhist are homosexuals, mainly they tell me because it is one of the only "religions" (subject to your interpretation of what religion is) that accepts them.

Waxwing:

How true, people do often seem to be highly educated in the West who classify themselves as Buddhist. A lot of the most mindless followers come from Christianity. I can't tell you how many Christians I know or have met who don't know the slightest thing about the religion besides that Jesus Christ is their Saviour.

Most of them either don't go to church, sleep through it, or haven't ever looked at but a few words in the Bible, it's sad.

Especially when people draw up things out of thin air telling you how you're supposed to live your life off of hearsay, when they have never seen a passage pertaining to this!!!

I could go on.. as you can tell

[amperel]

so may i ask if u r christian?

[xuechengfeng]

ehh, at this point, who knows

I believe in something greater than us... still figuring out what though

[amperel]

it's a lifelong pursuit indeed

[frozenmyth]

In case if you still are interested in a good website for "Chinese" Buddhism.

http://www.ddm.org.tw

The "Chinese" Buddhism had long been modified to incorporate some Chinese teachings or concepts. However, ever since Buddhism almost completely died out in India, China had been a land for Buddhism.

Hinduism basically absorbed many parts of Buddhism then eroded and eradicated Buddhism in India.

The Japanese and Koreans sent their intellectuals to China to study and learn Buddhism in the ancient time. That's partly why the Japanese and Koreans use a lot of Chinese writing in their languages, although nowdays both have been trying to lessen the Chinese influence linguistically.

It's true though that the Japanese in the modern time have "studied" Buddhism more thoroughly than the Chinese (not necessarily more consummate in practicing Buddhism though), at least more widely.

When the Chinese communists took over mainland China, they basically persecuted all religious practices or beliefs because of communism.

I do not know if anyone would state that Buddhism once died out in China like in India.

The Buddhism in China, as you might have already learned, had long been an amalgam of Confusianism, Taoism, and Buddhism. Many might comment that the "real Buddhist teachings" have never been widely spread into the Chinese society. You see many people pray or go to temples, but the majority of the Chinese population does not know or even have the slightest understanding of what some of the most basic Buddhist teachings are, and that's the truth!

The Chinese communists are reforming slowly under the name of Communism with Chinese characteristics. They still are not very keen on any religions, but are probably not like the iron-fists they used to be either. Don't be surprised if you run into some Chinese, even if they were never communists, who have the mentality of staying away from all the "religions."

People really should be cautious when they choose to learn more about Buddhism. The reason is because the comtemporary societies provide many teachings which may disguise as Buddhist teaching but are not.

There is plenty of "real cults" in all different forms or borrow the name or some teachings of Buddhism. Even in many parts of Asia those phenomena are common and they have plenty of "highly school educated" followers. Anyway, hope that website will provide some good information you once sought. That is one of the few good and real Buddhism website out there.

[Bamboo Grove]

The majority of people I met who are Buddhist are homosexuals

Where have you met these people? I've been living around Buddhists (although mainly Hinayana) people for 16 years and only a small minority have been homosexuals. The mind boggles.

[frozenmyth]

Hum.

Apparently I did not see that remark about the majority of Buddhist someone met were homosexuals.

Yeah, I wonder the same thing as where did the person meet those Buddhist? Keep in mind though homosexuality itself is a broadly debated topic as to if some are naturally borned that way or chose to change somehow. The majority of Buddhists live in Asia and are Asians. Of course, Buddhism does not exist for any particular ethnicity solely. I have never heard of Buddhism as being a psychological asylum for either heterosexuals nor homosexuals specifically in my life. Almost anybody who chooses to embrace the teachings can become a Buddhist.

I hope nobody misunderstands it as what some might think that a lot of Buddhists are homosexuals. By that I mean I hope the Western world does not twist it around and put an equal sign there. Both heterosexuals and homosexuals may choose to embrace Buddhism if they choose so of course. Any culture which uses any kind of sexual acts as a way to practice Buddhism or claims to be spiritual is as I mentioned as "disguising." Don't be fooled by those. Even many Westerners who have the slightest idea about Buddhism should know that one of its main principles is to "give up all the desires" because life is full of sufferings, and desires lead to/ create sufferings. The teachings are not designed for any particular mentality, but rather applies to all life forms!

Buddhism does teach about tolerance, mercy, compassion, and much more. It certainly does not think of or label teachings of Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Taoism as heresies. Not categorizing those as evil or placing devil's hat on any of them. If it did it would be self contradicting for Buddhism. Of course, there are some fundamental differences in their theories and principles even with the ideas of god(s) and creation / world views.

[xuechengfeng]

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply all Buddhists were homosexuals, just the ones I have met [which is like 10 to 15].

[frozenmyth]

I am certainly learning. I've never thought about homosexual Buddhists, but they are just like hetrosexual as humans. So they make their own decisions with regard to what to believe as humans.

I have heard a couple of people who studied psychology mentioned that many homosexuals tend to be more open minded than hetrosexuals.

They also told me that many successful psychologists are not hetrosexuals. Only heard a couple of those "opinions."

[MarkH]

There's a lot of bad info on the web about Buddhism. www.buddhanet.net is pretty good and comprehensive. It does have a lot about Theraveda buddhism, which is not very prevalent in China. Here is their specific page about buddhism in China (the links at the bottom of the page are good too). http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/buddhistworld/china-txt.htm

One poster mentioned that there are some buddhist "cults" -- that is indeed true. As a general rule, buddhism at its core is essentially non-dogmatic and is much less rigid in its requirements (esp. for laypeople) than other religions. This is of course a generalization, but not an unreasonable one. I would be very suspicious of any "buddhist" teacher or leader, or any version of buddhism, that does not encourage you to think for yourself and wants to filter everything through their own view or set of texts.

And, yes, I am (buddhist, that is, not gay . . . not that there's anything wrong with that, etc.)

[Lu Yi Si]

From first hand experience in mainland China I could certainly suggest that buddhism, is far less important in peoples' day to day lives as it is in Thailand, for example.

Thai buddhism, I know is a branch of Theraveda( sp?) buddhism but there are far more taboos and offerings. As well as a deeper reverance in spirituality than post-commuist (hmm) China.

Buddhism does seem to be gathering some pace though over the last few years and is seen as more than something just for old people. Visiting a holy 'shan' seems to recharge my own soul and many Chinese whether they are visiting Tao, Buddhist or Confucian places of worship.

By the way Buddhism is still very connected to Hinduism as Hindus still regard the Buddha as the 7th incarnation of Vishnu.

[frozenmyth]

Indeed, Buddhism has some of its roots in Hinduism.

By that I do not mean that Buddhism merely branched off from Hinduism or anything like that. Rather, some of the early concepts and maybe even a few practices were suggested to be the same or very similar historically. However, those were in the early phase though. Shakyamuni Buddha's enlightment introduced Buddhism to our modern world, very different from Hinduism teachings in some principles and practices, almost 2600 years ago.

Buddhism is buddhism, and there was no distinction when Shakyamuni Buddha lived. The Buddhist teaching only varied according to the different levels of its audience. A while after Shakyamuni Buddha passed away Buddhism got spreded differently in Asia in some of its forms of teachings.

With its center in China, Buddhism spreaded to Japan, Korea, Mongolia, and Tibet (of course, Buddhism did not spread to Tibet & Mongolia from China interior). Those were the Northern Buddhism Sanskrit system.

With its center in Sri Lanka, the Southern Buddhism Bali system spreaded to Thailand, Burma (Myanmar). That kind of distinction originated from Northern Buddhism system and the Southern Buddhism system refutes the veracity of such a distinction. While there are some differences in the ways the N & S teachings vary. Buddhism is buddhism with its principles and essence the same, regardless of the different sects of real Buddhism, and without the inclination of human distinctions arbitrarily.