Why is her Mandarin Rubbish?

[HashiriKata]

I got my swimming goggle with 550 degree in Vietnam

Anyway, what does this mean?

[zozzen]

Check your plurals. With errors like that, are you sure you can communicate?

Ahha, they really didn't understand a word from me. I used my body language, not sure how to make it plural. I guess you could buy a cigar in Cube with natural born body language too, buying two is difficult.

Anyway, i think it's getting too far and expect nothing more about putonghua discussed here. Ni man man gen li sansan gong pudonggua, ban shao ye meikung tong li fan. Again, it's hongkongese putonghua.

[zozzen]

Shhh... you'll upset his strange view of linguistics where listening comprehension is best gauged by text as opposed to that whole listening thing.

Well..................................

I'd say, what you need is a cheerleader for your wild imagination on hongkong style putonghua.

you don't know about it, but you know proof-reading. Tin seng wo cai bi you yong ne.

[wrbt]

I'd say, what you need is a cheerleader for your wild imagination on hongkong style putonghua.

And I'd say you need a reality check when you believe the ability to read purposely skewed pinyin is as worthwhile judge of listening comprehension, especially given the availability of video of person speaking.

you don't know about it, but you know proof-reading

Says wrong-pinyin-boy. We can only hope you're not in any way involved in teaching or lending any counsel to people learning a foreign language.

Bottom line:

1. I could understand someone speaking in a video, so you are attempting to prove what with pinyin?

2. It was easy to find plenty others who understood her, which pretty much crushes your ridiculous argument that she can't communicate.

When you have something logical, intelligent, or worthwhile to add please come back.

[zozzen]

ni so ni ting de dong, dang ni you kan bu dou wo xie de dong shi, wo zi si you dian hao ki la.

The point is , the pinyin text is based on a typical hong kong putonghua like her, but you can't read it. You don't know any about the problems with this kind of putonghua, you've never been to china with pronunciations and accent like this, but you're trying to convince me that putonghua like this is good enough to communicate well in china.

What makes interesting is how you feel about my disagreement. Discredit, dishonest, blah blah blah. You're arguing something you don't know, but take my disagreement too personal. Nothing could be weirder than this.

You really need a cheerleader.

Happy with your ivory tower, son.

Edited July 12, 2009 at 08:23 PM by zozzen

[leeyah]

Originally Posted by zozzen:

The point is , the pinyin text is based on a typical hong kong putonghua like her, but you can't read it.

Well, who says this new language called 'hongkongese putonghua' is impossible to understand?! Let me try

ni so ni ting de dong, dang ni you kan bu dou wo xie de dong shi, wo zi si you dian hao ki la.

你说你听得懂，但你又看不到我写的东西，我只是有点好气了。

Right?:wink:

()

[zozzen]

It's 有點好奇.

12 years after the handover, I decide to make this thread more useful by training people to understand hongkongese putonghua.

Ni lian la me lan de gang hong duo ting de dong, zeng xi lei hai, wo zen si you xiang mang mai ge mei bo lao song gei ni.

Also try this one:

This is funny if you know the pronunciations mean.

[wrbt]

The point is , the pinyin text is based on a typical hong kong putonghua like her, but you can't read it. You don't know any about the problems with this kind of putonghua, you've never been to china with pronunciations and accent like this, but you're trying to convince me that putonghua like this is good enough to communicate well in china.

I brought forth an opinion on listening comprehension, you turned it into playing error-pinyin. By the way, it's apparent that about a dozen others in this forum disagree with your assessment of whether she can communicate, but don't let that inconvenient fact get in the way of the pinyin warrior. Hey brother spew out some more nonsense pinyin to show that all these people who could understand her in fact couldn't understand her! Nice.

What makes interesting is how you feel about my disagreement. Discredit, dishonest, blah blah blah. You're arguing something you don't know, but take my disagreement too personal. Nothing could be weirder than this.

Wild imagination. Cheerleader. Etc. Pot, meet kettle. Black.

Happy with your ivory tower, son.

The irony of this is great.... I can understand someone who's actually speaking in a video, you wish to use warped pinyin to disprove that notion (as opposed to actual listening) and then call others ivory tower? Funny. You are the epitome of ivory tower here.

I'll continue to study Chinese, and will continue to use these forums safe in the knowledge that there are wiser heads to seek counsel from, ones that don't believe a pinyin mangling is a better tool for gauging listening comprehension than sounds entering the eardrum.

[zozzen]

The irony of this is great.... I can understand someone who's actually speaking in a video, you wish to use warped pinyin to disprove that notion (as opposed to actual listening) and then call others ivory tower? Funny. You are the epitome of ivory tower here.

You can understand what she said in the video and spend so many time to assert that putonghua like this can communicate well in China, but you just don't understand any pinyin text based on her putonghua style and you've never been to China to speak with local people.

how lovely and cute.

I'll continue to study Chinese, and will continue to use these forums safe

Yes, use it safe and be careful with any disagreements. They're really dangerous to mental health.

[leeyah]

Originally Posted by zozzen:

It's 有點好奇.

Hey! This IS hairsplitting (AGAIN)! & Oh? What? No for the rest of my hanzi? :roll: I'm really disappointed...

Actually, I put 好奇 first then I thought you meant to say: I'm really amused, but anyway both 奇 & 气 are ki/qi aren't they?

[zozzen]

Haha, you have great ears.

Is the topic switched to "A game on guessing hong kongese putonghua" ?

Here we go and i'll show the answer and explanation later:

Ni lian la me lan de gang hong duo ting de dong, zeng xi lei hai, wo zen si you xiang wang mai ge mei bo lao song gei ni.

[wrbt]

You can understand what she said in the video and spend so many time to assert that putonghua like this can communicate well in China, but you just don't understand any pinyin text based on her putonghua style and you've never been to China to speak with local people.

Again, you are an amazingly intellectually dishonest and bankrupt person. I never said that I haven't been to China (that's just you doing your thing saying that) and once again, I am amazed that anyone with any semblance of experience with language learning would take pretend-pinyin over actual listening as proof of communication.

Would you prefer someone who's just driving thru NYC or someone who mastered the test? Obviously the latter.

how lovely and cute.

Or maybe lovely and cute that so many people in here say they can understand her and she can communicate but you're stuck in some weird rut insisting otherwise despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Lovely and cute? Nah, sad. I could just imagine you covering your ears when meeting someone with strange accent, instead judging their ability to communicate with whatever pinyin test you can quickly scribble on a napkin.

[zozzen]

Actually, I put 好奇 first then I thought you meant to say: I'm really amused, but anyway both 奇 & 气 are ki/qi aren't they?

good try anyway.

I'm wondering if there's any systematic way to pick up all common mistakes in hongkongese style putonghu. Let's try this first: - K/ Q / J sounds

In Cantonese, many words start with K turns out to be Q or J sound in Putonghua.

Cantonese romanization below is not standard one.

奇 (Canton: Kei ) --> qi

期 (Canton: Kei ) ---> qi

企 (canton: kei) ----> qI

巧 (canton: kiu) ---> qiao

技 (Canton: Kei) ---> ji

及 (Canton: Kap) ---> ji

肩 (Kin) ---> jian

健 (kin) ---> jian

(Thanks Hofmann, the wrong romanization on 巧 is modified )

Edited July 12, 2009 at 10:08 PM by zozzen

[wrbt]

zozzen -

Answer me this: what is a better judge of listening comprehension, actual listening or purposely error-laden pinyin?

[wrbt]

zozzen -

Answer me: if so many people in this forum can understand her and say she can communicate, why should I instead believe the opinion of someone who strangely believes pinyin is a better judge of listening comprehension than actual listening?

[leeyah]

Originally Posted by zozzen:

Haha, you have great ears.

No, zozzen, I'm a genius

Is the topic switched to "A game on guessing hong kongese putonghua" ?

No, but you've been leading the topic in that direction & I felt like giving it a try (and prove that you're ... not always right (I just hate to say wrong ) And of course, you can 'adjust' the answer any time, so I'll just skip this one ...better yet: I'll let others try

Originally Posted by wrbt:

purposely error-laden pinyin

this is a good point: EDIT: I've noticed there are a few inconsistencies as in # 105 (re:post #106): ni so ni ting de dong, dang ni you kan bu dou, a fine example of "error-laden pinyin" as mentioned in post #114, because 但 is dan, never dang as in 当, in all standardized romanization systems i.e. 'pinyin's, vs. hearing-based romanizations. Just a thought, anyway...

Edited July 14, 2009 at 09:38 AM by leeyah

[zozzen]

Again, you are an amazingly intellectually dishonest and bankrupt person. I never said that I haven't been to China (that's just you doing your thing saying that) and once again, I am amazed that anyone with any semblance of experience with language learning would take pretend-pinyin over actual listening as proof of communication.

It's great that when you've been to china, you spoke with a lot of local people and saw how they react to putonghua like this. It's not second hand experience anymore? Bad for recycling of arguments, but thanks for your first hand contributions. I thought of asking your dad to spank your butt son because of your intellectually bad mouth, but i appreciate your efforts on field survey. Don't need to feel "dangerous" in this forum now?

[zozzen]

No, but you've been leading the topic in that direction & I felt like giving it a try (and prove that you're ... not always right (I just hate to say wrong ) And of course, you can 'adjust' the answer any time, so I'll just skip this one ...better yet: I'll let others try

oh, i didn't change the answer and i wouldn't say it's error-laden pinyin, it's a hong kong style putonghua like Li and Koo's .

Anyway, the game comes to the end now. In some other time, it'd be great to gather all rules between standard putonghua and hongkongese putonghua.

Good night everyone.

[wrbt]

It's great that when you've been to china, you spoke with a lot of local people and saw how they react to putonghua like this.

Never said anything about anyone reacting to putonghua like this, but at this point I'm used to you manufacturing strawman arguments to attack... sign of someone with no real base for intellectual discourse just swinging wild hoping to connect.

I thought of asking your dad to spank your butt son because of your intellectually bad mouth, but i appreciate your efforts on field survey. Don't need to feel "dangerous" in this forum now?

We'll chalk this up to more flailing, you're upset because your methods (pinyin > listening for judging listening) and opinion (most in the thread thought she could communicate) have been thoroughly trashed, so you lash out with talk of butt spankings.

Again: actual listening is a better judge than wrong-pinyin for judging communication, you know it and anyone with an IQ above 50 knows it. Why you're clutching to this ridiculous position that makes you look so foolish is beyond me.

[wrbt]

Anyway, the game comes to the end now. In some other time, it'd be great to gather all rules between standard putonghua and hongkongese putonghua.

Even better... let's take someone who understands a person speaking and refute that with garbled pinyin exams. To hell with whether they could understand, decrypting pinyin is a better method for judging listening comprehension! Wee!

Good night everyone.

Good night to you. May your dreams have properly scripted pinyin, since without that you can't understand anything in them.