Foreigners, 1 Child Policy, Passports and Kids

[BrandeX]

China requires you to renounce citizenship to any/all other countries in order to be a Chinese citizen.

[gato]

I can't speak for China, but this has never been an issue for my son who holds dual citizenship. In fact, just to make sure the first time we traveled with our son, I laid out both of his passports in front of immigration officials in both countries. Each official grabbed the passport from their respective country and said they didn't need the other.

Then again, I have not visited China and I don't know the Chinese rules...

If you showed both a US and Chinese passport to a Chinese immigration official at the airport, they'll likely confiscate your Chinese passport or invalidate it.

[xifbk]

"Absolutely not. It is still very much in effect, and top leadership regularly affirms that they want to keep to it. "

I was sure there were quite a few exceptions? ie I was told by a chinese friend of mine that there are some exceptions like this:

1) If you father is of a certain nationality he is allowed more than one child. (I forget which nationality it was)

2) If your parents obeyed the one child policy, and only had one child you are allowed multiple children.

[gougou]

I was sure there were quite a few exceptions?

Yes, if you take a look a bit above your post, people are listing some of the exceptions; but that doesn't mean the rules aren't in effect anymore.

[jak__]

We are having the same issue that kdavid and BrandeX are talking about, but are a little further along than you guys. Here's what I know so far: Our son was born in Beijing, got Chinese and US birth certificates, a US passport, and the little passport-like thing that allows him to exit the country. We moved to the US for a few years. When we went to a Chinese consulate in the US to get him a visa to China to visit, they told us he cannot get a visa unless he formally renounces his Chinese citizenship at a PSB in China (Chinese law states that the consulate should be able to do this, but they said they won't). They instead issued him a '旅行证' that is a little passport-like book that allows him to enter China and stay as long as he wants and is valid for 2 years. To get this 'travel document' we had to give them his old exit permit, so don't throw it out! We checked at the PSB in China and they said they can't renounce his citizenship. (maybe a PSB in a different city can?) Its really not a huge problem, its just that we are not sure what happens when he turns 18. A friend of my wife's did find a way to get her daughter a Chinese visa in her US passport--she personally wrote the Chinese ambassador a letter, and they agreed to do it then.

Also, when we entered the country the immigration agents were all very friendly and they even said 'oh, he probably has a US passport' when they saw our son's 'travel document'. So I'm guessing a lot of people have done the same thing. Just be prepared and bring as many documents as you can to the consulate to avoid having to make a second trip like we did.

[msittig]

Just to add another anecdote to the pile…

Same situation as BrandeX, though a little farther along like jak__, but at a different point. Our second daughter was born in late 2008 and left China for the first time over the Christmas vacation. I am USAian and my wife is Chinese; we live in Shanghai, where both our daughters were born.

When we started planning the trip back to the US, we used her Chinese birth certificate to get our daughter an American birth certificate and passport at the consulate in Shanghai. In order to exit the country, like was mentioned above she needed a 通行证 from the 出入境管理局, a big office in Pudong where things like passports and visas for Chinese and foreigners are processed.

To get the 通行证 we first had to do something called 国籍审定 ("Nationality Authentification") on the same day in the same building. We're not sure of the purpose of this step. We had been prepared to expect something like what jak__ was expected to obtain, a renunciation of the child's Chinese citizenship. But when we actually applied, it seemed as if we were signing a document saying that we recognized that our daughter was in a state of ambiguous nationality (I work during the day so my wife took care of all this; I have it 2nd hand from her). So in fact she still had the status of Chinese citizen. Then when we applied for the 通行证 we were told that our daughter could in fact return to China as a Chinese with this booklet; so calling it a "fake passport" is not far from the truth in our experience!

However, for the sake of expediency and in order to avoid any One-Child Policy hassles in the future we had already decided to make her American citizenship official on this trip. On the first weekday back in California we drove to the Chinese consulate in Los Angeles and went through the standard process of applying for a tourist visa for our daughter. I requested just a 30 day visa because I anticipated adding her onto my residence permit upon our return to China (we've submitted the application and are waiting on that now), but in fact they granted her a one-year, 90-day-each-visit L-visa! A nice touch to cap off a very smooth application process where she was treated just like any other American getting a China visa.

When we came back to China she entered on her American passport with a Chinese tourist visa, no questions asked. Actually we were pleasantly surprised because PVG has separate border control lines for foreigners and locals but an airport attendant let us go in the Chinese citizens line as a family, and even ushered us to the head of the line seeing we had a tired baby in addition to several big pieces of luggage! Another pleasant surprise. (In this round trip, we were brought to the front of the security/entry line four times, 2x in China, once in Japan and once in the US. Worth the hassle of traveling with small children? Still, NO.)

I know this doesn't clear up the China-US dual nationality conundrum and I'll admit that I don't know the answer to that one either, but I offer this story on the odd chance that it might be helpful for people in our situation who don't plan to pursue the dual-nationality option. I'd like to note, however, that in all my years (literally) of following discussions on this topic on BBSs across the internet I've never met anybody whose child had China-US dual nationality/passports and could detail the process of exiting and entering the countries involved from personal experience. It always seems to be the child of a friend, or a friend's friend, or a mechanic's roommate's ayi's second cousin. So I remain skeptical of the idea.

[msittig]

I just realized that my first post was waaaay off-topic and completely unhelpful to the OP. So here's a more relevant reply.

Probably the "child license" you're being asked to get is the 准生证. Both of my daughters were born in Shanghai, were foreigners are plenty so we didn't get asked for it. It sounds like the local gov't is stricter where you are. In any case, here are the requirements for the 准生证:

1) 双方身份证 both partners' national IDs

2) 双方结婚证 both partners' marriage licenses

3) 双方户口本 both partners' hukou books

4) 双方单位”初婚初育”证明函 "first marriage first child" letter of proof from work unit

5) 办理”准生证”的申请信,包括双方签名 application signed by both parents

So it seems the government official is being strict about #4. You've been counseled to get the declaration from your consulate; I'd second that route.

Marriages in China also require a letter of proof that your single, but what the consulate gives Americans (like me) is just a letter that says "this guy says he's single, and we wash our hands of any responsibility -- if he's lying then he agrees to face the consequences alone", which is clearly just a declaration and not a letter of proof at all. And just as the consulate has no way to check that you're not already married, neither can they check for previous marriages or children, so a letter of declaration from the consulate should* be good enough in this situation as well.

My two cents.

*TIC.

[chrix]

China further loosens One Child Policy

[gougou]

China further loosens One Child Policy

As becomes evident from the article (and indeed even from the part they quoted), it's not the whole of China, but rather Beijing only.

[chrix]

Aw right, that wasn't written up in a very clear way... well it's the same guy who keeps calling Berlusconi and Zapatero the Italian and Spanish "presidents"... (a pet peeve of mine)

[Hero Doug]

Haven't been around in a while and I see that the thread has taken on a life of it's own. The issue has been resolved; we now have the little green book.

Fortunately (or unfortunately depending how you look at it), we obtained it because my wifes mother knew someone in her hometown who worked in the government. Her friend convinced the official that if my wife gets checked at the local hospital and the test comes back negative (no previous pregnancies) then we could get the license. So it was the result of a friend of the family doing us a favour.

There is something to take away from this though. And this is something everyone married to a Chinese national needs to do if their planning to have a baby. Get this issue sorted out before the pregnancy. One recurring excuse that we encountered was that the officials have no way of knowing if my wife moved to another city and gave birth there. That indicates to me that inter-government communication is poor at best (it could also just be an excuse to avoid issuing the license). And getting checked while pregnant is apparently difficult as well (or so we were told my a few different hospitals). So don't put it off.

In regard to some of the other posts.

From my research Canada's regulations seem to be similar to the US.

I have to go to the Embassy and obtain a registration of birth abroad and a temporary passport which is good for one year. To obtain this I need my child's birth certificate, my marriage license, and my wife and I both need supporting documents (passport, birth certificate, etc).

After that passport is issued I have a year to go back to Canada and properly register my child. I'll try and post back to this thread as the process continues. In the meantime here is some info.

Citizenship F.A.Q.

New Citizenship Rules (very important to Canadian parents, read this.

Applying For Citizenship

[Meng Lelan]

Get this issue sorted out before the pregnancy.

I imagine that this night all mixed couples in China are checking each other's papers before jumping into bed together.

[Hero Doug]

I imagine that this night all mixed couples in China are checking each other's papers before jumping into bed together.

It'll be just like a trip through customs.

Documentation.

Please state the nature of your visit.

[jbradfor]

"Business or Pleasure?" OUCH!

@msittig:

(In this round trip, we were brought to the front of the security/entry line four times, 2x in China, once in Japan and once in the US. Worth the hassle of traveling with small children? Still, NO.)

I am SOOOO envious I can barely type. We've made 5 international trips with our (2 year old) daughter, and NOT A SINGLE TIME did anyone do anything nice like that to us. Maybe it takes two kids?

[Comrade]

Hi, I have a few questions, although I'm not sure if someone on here could clarify them.

1. If my wife hops over across the border to my country (I'm from Russia) to give birth to the 2nd (3rd, etc.) child and the child will get Russian citizenship, then get the visa like a regular foreigner and we go back to China, would this be considered breaking the One Child policy by the Chinese govt (with resulting fines and/or loss of government support for healthcare and schooling of the first child who is PRC citizen)?

2. a.) Since Russians are considered one of the 56 official minority ethnic groups, is it possible for a child between a Russian citizen and a Chinese citizen to be assigned the "Russian" minority ethnicity at birth instead of the mother's ethnicity?

b.) If the above is possible, would it be possible then to legally have two children instead of one, since the children are in the minority ethnic group (despite the mother being Han)?

[gerri]

"Children of Vietnamese Mothers in Limbo" (English version of Global Times)...

here, it would seem that foreigners are indeed being held to the one-child policy, but the reasoning behind what's happening here totally goes beyond me... Are the hukou being refused because there is more than one child, or because the mothers are not Chinese nationals; and if those are really marriages, then why would the mothers have to be repatriated instead of getting L-visas (they don't really say if those are really marriages or if they are really illegal)...

In a way, it fits in with the questions of Comrade, but probably only opens more uncertainty...

[Comrade]

In a way, it fits in with the questions of Comrade, but probably only opens more uncertainty...

To be honest, I don't see how it applies to my situation at all. They are trying to sort the bureaucratic mess out already years after the children were born, while in my case I'd like to know what my options are before we have children. Also, I didn't swim across the Amur river or otherwise gotten myself smuggled into China, I'm here legally on a work (Z) visa.

[Hero Doug]

Seeing as how their willing to let children have two citizenships (ex: you get your child citizenship in your country but they won't let you renounce his Chinese citizenship) I can predict a lot of bureaucratic red tape.

I can say one thing though (and it may apply to Comrade as well), if and when we have a second child it'll be in my home country as that's what citizenship I wish him to have. I'd much rather have trouble getting my child a visa to leave China than enter China.

[gchodorow]

I don't have anything to add to the analysis of the one-child policy.

 

But I have enjoyed reading the diverse opinions about travel issues for children of binational couples. Here's my article, from a legal perspective, about applying for an Exit and Entry Permit (出入境通行证) and other available options: www.lawandborder.com/applying-exit-entry-permit-child/. I hope it adds to the discussion, at least by referencing the relevant rules.