Ghosts, Goblins, Gods, And Demons

[Altair]

Could someone explain the meaning and/or connotation of Chinese words for supernatural beings? For instance, I often see the word 鬼, but am not sure if they are always supposed to evil, scary, dangerous, or "abnormal." In my view, "ghosts" are always scary and abnormal (except for the Holy Ghost), but not necessarily evil or dangerous. How about 鬼？

There are a bunch of characters that seem to mean: "monster," "demon," "ghost," etc. and that are often combined together. Can someone sort out what the difference is between them?

In English we have:

A spirit: A being without a physical body

A ghost: The spirit of a dead person that should no longer be hanging around the living

A demon: A powerful, evil non-human spirit or an evil monster with god-like powers

A monster: A being with unusual features that are frightening or abhorrent

A god: An immortal being worthy of worship or admiration and having great power over some aspect of human activity or nature. They are usually good, but could be bad if belonging to a race of gods that are generally good.

Divine: relating to or coming from the good aspect of a god

Magic: Any activity not governed by the normal rules of nature or science. It can be good, evil, or neutral, because the basic connotation is something that causes wonder.

Sorcery: Magic with a generally evil intent. It always gives reason to be fearful.

An elf: A generally noble non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

A goblin: A generally evil non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

How do the following Chinese words compare?

鬼

灵

魔

妖

神

煞

巫

[GreenArrow45]

you forgot to list the ghost that is most commonly found in China: the 酒鬼...

[studentyoung]

A spirit: A being without a physical body

魂

A ghost: The spirit of a dead person that should no longer be hanging around the living

鬼

A demon: A powerful, evil non-human spirit or an evil monster with god-like powers

怪

A monster: A being with unusual features that are frightening or abhorrent

魔

A god: An immortal being worthy of worship or admiration and having great power over some aspect of human activity or nature. They are usually good, but could be bad if belonging to a race of gods that are generally good.

神 / 仙 / 佛 / 尊 / 菩萨/ and so on

Divine: relating to or coming from the good aspect of a god

神的？ 神赐的？

Magic: Any activity not governed by the normal rules of nature or science. It can be good, evil, or neutral,

because the basic connotation is something that causes wonder.

魔法 (evil); 法力 (neutral);

Sorcery: Magic with a generally evil intent. It always gives reason to be fearful.

巫术

An elf: A generally noble non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

精灵

A goblin: A generally evil non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

妖 / 精

[fengyixiao]

A spirit: A being without a physical body

灵

A ghost: The spirit of a dead person that should no longer be hanging around the living

鬼

A demon: A powerful, evil non-human spirit or an evil monster with god-like powers

魔

A monster: A being with unusual features that are frightening or abhorrent

怪

A god: An immortal being worthy of worship or admiration and having great power over some aspect of human activity or nature. They are usually good, but could be bad if belonging to a race of gods that are generally good.

仙

Divine: relating to or coming from the good aspect of a god

神

Magic: Any activity not governed by the normal rules of nature or science. It can be good, evil, or neutral,

because the basic connotation is something that causes wonder.

法

Sorcery: Magic with a generally evil intent. It always gives reason to be fearful.

魔法

An elf: A generally noble non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

神灵

A goblin: A generally evil non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

妖怪

[Hofmann]

LOL...what makes you think there could be direct translations for beings in European mythology?

[jbradfor]

Not to mention the concept of "God", comparing between cultures with mostly monotheistic religions, and a culture with polytheistic religions.

Slightly off topic, found this site a while back: God Checker. 1-minute overview of various gods, rather funny, but I hope accurate as well. [but please ignore their rather horrible summary of Chinese writing: "Written Chinese consists of symbols; little pictures illustrating an idea or a thing. One Chinese word can mean a whole sentence in English. Each of the four hundred basic characters contains a concept, and by putting them together, more complex words are formed." I have no idea what they mean by "four hundred basic characters".]

[Shi Tong]

hoffman, why not? There are translations into Chinese of Norse Gods and Greek gods..

弗雷 Fú​léi​ Freyr (god in Norse mythology

etc.

维纳斯 Wéi​nà​sī​ Venus (mythology, Greek goddess of love

[jbradfor]

You missed Hoffman's point. His point is that all of these translations are only approximate, given the difference in the traditions, and not very good approximations at that. So while 魔 is probably the closest translation for demon, the image and stories that "demon" conjurers up would be different for a European than 魔 would conjure up for a Chinese.

While not asked here, I think the best example of this is dragon / 龙, which are usually considered "translations" of each other. To a European, a dragon is usually a dangerous, evil beast, breathing fire and kidnapping maidens and killing knights. In contrast, to a Chinese, a 龙 is a powerful, auspicious creature, a bit dangerous perhaps, but only because it is so powerful. You don't see dragon motifs at the While House (ok, I'm going Europe -> USA here, deal with it) in the way that you see 龙 motifs in the Forbidden Palace.

[Gleaves]

I like baidu image search for stuff like this. If you look through 5-10 pages, you can sometimes pick up connotations. For instance, 鬼 feels more like what I would think of as a ghoul, rather than a white sheet floating around.

For many of the characters, I more commonly see them in two character words than by themselves. As mentioned above, I'm sure all of these have cultural stamps that prevent them from being direct translations:

灵 in 精灵 (elf) and 灵魂 (soul, spirit)

魔 in 恶魔 (demon), 魔法 (magic), 魔鬼 (devil), etc.

妖 in 妖怪 (evil spirit/monster, often female).

巫 in 女巫 (witch), 巫师 (wizard)

煞 (I don't see this one as often in the ghost/goblin/demon context)

[Shi Tong]

Right, I see what you mean now jbradfor, and he's right- there isn't really an easy way- usually descriptions of and explaintions of are required.

For example- 精灵 to me, in Chinese, means "Genie", which is very different from "elf", which is the usual translation of this word.

Of course, and Elf to any European or American (I did deal with that quite well BTW, thanks ;)) is the typical Tolkienite style magical immortal, almost like a human, with pointy ears and poetry style thing, rather than something as far removed as a magical genie, like something from Arabian Nights.

[anonymoose]

This thread made me think of 魑魅魍魉.

[Guoke]

神魔鬼怪

gods, demons, ghosts, goblins

[Altair]

Thanks everyone for the responses.

LOL...what makes you think there could be direct translations for beings in European mythology?

My purpose in posting was not to get direct translations, but precisely to understand the differences. I have read Chinese folk stories about 鬼, but have been a little puzzled as to what they are and how I am supposed to react to them emotionally. For instance, if you start of a story saying: "There were two children wondering in the woods who suddenly saw an XXX," you will have a very different assessment of the scene if you replace XXX with "witch," "sorcerer," "wizard," "ghost," "demon," "monster," "spirit," "goblin," etc. If the children saw a ghost, they would be frightened, but it is not clear that anything else would need to happen. If they saw a witch, they should try to run before she could enchant them. If they saw a demon, they should try to escape its notice, because they will likely be powerless if it took an interest in them. If it was a sorcerer or sorceress, the children are in grave danger, but the sorcerer or sorceress may well not be interested in mere children. If it was a monster, they would again be in danger, but there would be no need to think magic was involved. They must use ordinary means to get to a safe place. If it was a spirit, they should be extremely cautious, but perhaps try to understand why it has appeared there and what its nature is. If it was a goblin/troll/ghoul, they would be in personal danger, but the danger would be thought of as more localized in time in place.

Now, what about children who suddenly see a 鬼? How would they react, and what should they do?

An elf: A generally noble non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

精灵

An elf: A generally noble non-human being living in nature and that is associated with magic

精灵

What does a 精灵 typically do? Or in what circumstances do you find them?

Witches use magic to hurt individuals and the community; however, shamans use magic to help the community. What do 巫 do? I have read a lot of speculation about the role of shamans in ancient Chinese culture and yet cannot find a term for this among the Chinese words I have learned. I think I remember 碧眼狐狸 (Jade Fox) in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon being referred to as a "witch." Could she also have been a 巫?

[xiaocai]

Now, what about children who suddenly see a 鬼? How would they react, and what should they do?

Ever watched any 香港鬼片 before? There are plenty of good examples showing how people react when they see 鬼.

[Shi Tong]

I suppose there's also the problem that some ghosts have been mixed between the cultures, like vampires (吸血鬼) and zombies (僵尸).

I think you would do well to watch some stuff with these "creatures" in them and get to know them as depictions.. because that's exactly what they are- depictions of fictional creatures. You only know what a phoenix looks like when someone has actually told you, or you've seen one in real life.