中文 vs. 英语

[fij]

Hi,

Is it correct that the "Chinese language/culture" is more often referred to as 中文 while the English language more often as 英语 ? If yes, then is the reason maybe that in earlier times Chinese perceived their own language more often as written (~culture) while they perceived all other languages more often as spoken languages (because they often heard visitors talk, but did not so often see the same visitors write in their own language)?

Thanks.

[Shi Tong]

I dont think there is any particular cultural reference made there.. I mean, they know that English people write, just not the same as they do. Maybe there would be more reference to 英语 as it's something they hear, but they cannot read, but I wouldn't have thought so.

Plus, Chinese culture is 中国文化-- 文化 is different from 文 in that 文 just refers to languange.. though 文 refers to both written and spoken forms. You can also, of course have 英国文化 or for that matter, any other 文化.

[renzhe]

英文 and 汉语 are also both common, so I don't think that there is an intentional system behind it. Some formulations simply become more common through usage.

All of these terms refer to language, where the 文 formulation carries a slightly more literary connotation to it.

[Shi Tong]

Another thing to remember is that you'll see ads for "learn English" written as 学美语-- the conotation here is that you'll be learning to speak "English" but it refers to American language, spoken with an American accent. It also suggests that you'll be learning to speak and listen, rather than concentrating on the writing and reading, IMO.

[Yezze]

学美语

美语， I haven't heard that before, but it makes sense if they mean with an American accent.

From what i can remember from class, it seemed to be implied that 中文 is more often regarded as written Chinese, while 汉语 is spoken. But when it comes to 英语 vs 英文, no difference comes to mind.

Thoughts?

[skylee]

it seemed to be implied that 中文 is more often regarded as written Chinese,

not necessarily.

[Yezze]

3rd notable thing I've learned today.

What do you feel is the difference, if any？

[clc]

Chinese language = 中国文字 = 中文

Chinese culture = 中国文化 (no shorter form)

Therefore, 中文 only means Chinese language, not Chinese culture.

[SiMaKe]

Integrated Chinese L1-P1 contains the following note: (emphasis added)

"汉语 and 中文 both refer to the Chinese language. 汉语 can imply a stress on the colloquial aspects of the language while 中文 can be more emphatic on the written form, but in most cases the two are used interchangeably."

Separately, several online dictionaries gloss 美语 as "American English". Some also add "American" or "American language".

I find both of these latter terms somewhat unusual and rather vague (but might not be in the proper context). But maybe not more so than saying I speak "English" since I say that all the time yet I don't live in England (nor speak that variety of English).

Yezze, I also learned something as I don't recall encountering 美语 before.

[jbradfor]

But maybe not more so than saying I speak "English" since I say that all the time yet I don't live in England (nor speak that variety of English).

Any more strange than someone born and raised in, say, Mexico saying they speak "Spanish"?

[xiaocai]

Just like you say "English" but "Chinese".

[SiMaKe]

@jbradfor

Don't they speak Mexican in Mexico? :huh:

Clearly, American and American language are recognized terms since they appear in several dictionaries. I just don't seem to encounter those terms on a regular basis. Probably it's just my lack of exposure, but when I saw/heard these terms, all I could think of was which American language? Thought it might be referring to a native North American language like Navajo, Susquehannock or Inuit or even American "street" language or something along those lines.

So the terms to me are a bit ambiguous.

Similarly, saying I speak English can be misleading as well. Do I speak British or Australian or American English or other forms?

That's all I meant.

But, of course, this problem doesn't stop me for saying it. :rolleyes:

[doraemon]

I think there are just some instances where 中文 just sounds like the more correct one to use, and the same goes for 汉语. I've heard from one of my teachers that the former is used more when referring to reading and writing in Chinese whereas the latter applies to speaking and listening. But if that's the case I don't really know why the HSK is called 汉语水平考试 since half the exam contains reading and writing components...

[papen]

one of my friends say some part of China, it calls 国语. Annd sometimes, if you ask do they know madarin , they have no idea. But if you ask they know pu tong hua, people will understand what language you're talking about.

Even for 中文. People in Beijing will understand it as madarin + simplified characters. Taiwanese will understand it as madarin + traditional characters, and Hongkonger understands it as Cantonese + traditional characters.