interracial marriage

[gamerfu]

Read this, it is from a western woman's piont of view. Sorry, it is in Chinese.

http://blog.worldbizcity.com/?p=5001

She really doesn't answer the questions.

[HashiriKata]

HashiriKata writes:

"In this global colonial age to which we all belong, all rationalizations about interracial sexual relationships are just rationalization and nothing more!"

(sh)

[bhchao]

The unspoken truth is that Chinese women, especially those from Mainland, want to seek White husbands from Anglo-America and Western Europe because those countries have a long term stable political environment.

Even though there has been relative political stability for almost three decades in China, psychologically many Chinese women still harbor a sense of social uncertainty and attempt to seek a raincheck.

I would be interested in any statistics showing interracial marriage per capita; especially among an Asian and a white; in Taiwan, Hong Kong, and Mainland. Chinese women from the Mainland are probably more prone to seeking white husbands due to the socioeconomic environment.

This is just a generalization, but I think women from Taiwan tend to be more traditional in their marriage outlook compared to their Mainland counterparts.

There is a rise in interracial marriages in Korea, but a very large majority of these marriages in Korea are not between Korean and white, but between Korean and Southeast Asians.

[bhchao]

Another thing to note is that women are under extreme social and biological pressure to tie the knot. My good female friend from Tainan, one of the most traditional cities in Taiwan, recently married a white guy after 4 1/2 years with her Taiwanese boyfriend.

The white guy is a nice guy (actually he and the Taiwanese guy are both very decent), and I'm glad she made her decision one way or the other. But I can see why she made her decision to tie the knot not long after her breakup with her Taiwanese boyfriend, who had decided to terminate the relationship. She is 35. At that age, many Asian or Chinese men would not bother marrying a woman that old. Most prefer younger women, especially those in their 20's. An Asian woman who is 35 and still unmarried will make a lot of men, especially Asian men, raise eyebrows and wonder in their heads "What is wrong with you?".

Unfortunately that is the brutal truth.

[opper567]

this topic has been over-analyized. people like what they like... thats it. people shouldn't be criticized for who they like.

[skylee]

An Asian woman who is 35 and still unmarried will make a lot of men, especially Asian men, raise eyebrows and wonder in their heads "What is wrong with you?"

Why?

[sarahkuang]

Have you heard of 男大当婚，女大当嫁? This concept still dominates in Chinese culture thought it starts to change a bit. When a girl or a boy is getting older and couldn't be seen a sign of marry, not only the surrounding men or women would give her the look but her/his parents and relatives would look at her/him with pity in their eyes. IT IS BURTAL TURTH. This have happened in my family and my relatives. I am glad I was far away from them and didn't make them feel the pressure.

[owen]

Owen, don't be jealous. Actually it is widely known in the Chinese community that Brigitte Lin and her husband have genuine affections. Just because a guy is rich doesn't mean a woman is a gold digger. Coincidentally a guy can have the internal qualities that a woman desires while being financially prudent at the same time.

And I have to say that Asian guys have both these qualities more often so than Caucasian men.

So the "Chinese community" has used their special powers of collective intuition to discover that indeed, the "affection" between these two strangers (from the perspective of those judging) is "genuine". Wow i wish the 'non-chinese community' had such collective powers to decide if jenniger aniston really, genuinely likes vince vaughan.

It's the assumption underlying your statements that the qualities necessary to be a shrewd businessman are intrinsically good. Given the times we live in, i would say the qualities necessary for being successful in business are almost without exception the same ones that makes a person a tremendous a-hole. But that's another thread on another forum.

[bhchao]

Given the times we live in, i would say the qualities necessary for being successful in business are almost without exception the same ones that makes a person a tremendous a-hole.

If you expect women to go for men with weak knowledge of financial accumulation or who are financially imprudent, think again. The same qualities necessary for being successful in business are also the same qualities that allow someone to raise a family (because you are skillful in handling financial matters), and lay the foundation for a prosperous future for the children.

That's one of the things women look for, being able to provide for their offspring. And how one perceives businessmen in general to be a-holes may be perceived differently from the women who marry them.

There is an admirable trait about businessmen in Asia. They are humble. They don't flaunt their wealth like many Western businessmen do. They live frugal lives despite being very affluent. As a result, Forbes magazine that publishes the world's wealthiest men (which are almost entirely dominated by Westerners) would never know the real assets of Asian entrepreneurs. Humility in this arena is part of the Chinese culture that sets it apart from the West. They restrain the visibility of their strengths and maintain a low profile by not showing off.

Ever heard of the phrase "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon"?

Hmm...three daughters in a successful marriage. I would be envious too.

[zixingche]

Are you really seriously saying the qualities needed to be able to make money in business are the qualities needed to raise a family? But then women who marry mainly for money probably wouldn't be too bothered if they're husbands were a-holes or what they did outside the home as long as they continue to provide the funds for shopping, travelling, servants, etc etc.

I doubt whether businessmen in Asia are any more or less humble than businessmen anywhere else. So who buys all those expensive Mercedes and other western status symbols? They certainly don't want their exact wealth to be known (for tax purposes) but you can be sure they're do anything to let the world know they are rich. Otherwise what's the point of trying to get rich if nobody else knows it, especially women?

Sadly, I think a lot of Chinese people see money as the only thing in life.

[johnd]

There is an admirable trait about businessmen in Asia. They are humble. They don't flaunt their wealth like many Western businessmen do.

My draw dropped when I read this. Maybe my perspective is warped by being in Shenzhen, but I would say that men here flaunt their wealth big time.

[delaSOuL]

Everyone is different, but knowing the businessmen among my friends and family, they certainly show off their wealth quite ostentatiously. In fact, in China, it is much easier for a wealthy person to stand out, compared to in the West.

[roddy]

Someone should go through this thread and collect all the pointless sweeping generalizations together, so we can put them together into a little book . .

[gato]

so we can put them together into a little book

And then burn it?

[bhchao]

Are you really seriously saying the qualities needed to be able to make money in business are the qualities needed to raise a family?

I'm not saying that women should go for businessmen. But are you indicating that women should not marry businessmen? A woman who marries a businessman is not necessarily a golddigger. I surely hope you're not suggesting that women should go for plumbers or janitors. And what if a woman went for a businessman? So. That is her decision based on her future outlook and her ideal qualities in a mate, just like a woman marrying a white guy should be no big deal at all.

It's like saying businessmen are crafty schemers, and therefore women should not marry them at all. Or like saying women who marry white guys shows the deficiencies of Asian men, which is why they go for white men.

They certainly don't want their exact wealth to be known (for tax purposes) but you can be sure they're do anything to let the world know they are rich. Otherwise what's the point of trying to get rich if nobody else knows it, especially women?

No doubt it is difficult to avoid unwanted attention when you are rich. When one becomes rich, their tastes and standards of living increase, and what they do and own will start to reflect this increased standard of living. I don't dispute the fact that there may be some rich folks in China who like to flaunt their wealth. But you rarely find businessmen in Asia who gets excessive media spotlight, and likes to bask in it, as much as Donald Trump likes to do. Otherwise they would flood the front pages of the Forbes and Fortune millionaire list, as well as in the international media. As far as I know, I know no businessman in Asia who is a household name around the world.

I've read news stories of people in China who become rich, yet live in frugal environs because there is still a prevalent, common belief among the masses in China that these rich individuals became wealthy by stealing from the poor, or through unscrupulous means. Not to mention that the CCP likes to keep a wary eye on the affluent elite, and tend to view their activities with suspicion. Therefore avoiding media attention is within their best interests.

[gato]

Not to mention that the CCP likes to keep a wary eye on the affluent elite, and tend to view their activities with suspicion. Therefore avoiding media attention is within their best interests.

There is a joke of sort in China that twelve months after each new Chinese Forbes list comes out, a certain number on the top of the list will wind up in jail. It's certainly an incentive to stay out of the media spotlight. That doesn't mean that they are not conspicuously consuming. They are.

[owen]

There is an admirable trait about businessmen in Asia. They are humble. They don't flaunt their wealth like many Western businessmen do. They live frugal lives despite being very affluent. ...Humility in this arena is part of the Chinese culture that sets it apart from the West. They restrain the visibility of their strengths and maintain a low profile by not showing off.

That is hands down the funniest thing i have ever read on this forum.

In case you are serious however, consider where the fastest growing market for luxury cars, upscale clubs, rare vintage wines and, last but not least, filipina maids is. You can guess where. Having servants equals humility? Of course they are not in the public eye. China's public eye is busy collectively ogling at foreigners who represent even greater wealth than their local vampires. And where better to look than America who has a whole capitalist mythology including mascots already packed and ready for export.

I surely hope you're not suggesting that women should go for plumbers or janitors.

Whoa whoa whoa...lets just slow down. No one is suggesting for a second that girls actually go for plumbers or janitors. In fact, i would hope that girls try to steer clear of any blue collar workers. Unless they're fatties. In any case, those couples don't matter.

Seriously though, my mom married a plumber, and he became my father. I'm not really prone to effusiveness on the subject but i can tell you i could never have asked for a better dad. Never had an overabundance of money but that was and should be secondary to any kid growing up. My parents are still as happily married as is possible after 37 years, while the parents of many kids i went to school with who were much wealthier are now divorced. I may be painting a cliche hear but its got a pretty firm basis in truth.

I would never say prudent thoughtfullness regarding financial matters is a bad thing. But it has its very narrow use and beyond that becomes destructive. Especially when one gets into the accumulation of wealth for its own sake.

[bhchao]

In case you are serious however, consider where the fastest growing market for luxury cars, upscale clubs, rare vintage wines and, last but not least, filipina maids is. You can guess where. Having servants equals humility? Of course they are not in the public eye. China's public eye is busy collectively ogling at foreigners who represent even greater wealth than their local vampires. And where better to look than America who has a whole capitalist mythology including mascots already packed and ready for export.

Coherence please.

Whoa whoa whoa...lets just slow down. No one is suggesting for a second that girls actually go for plumbers or janitors. In fact, i would hope that girls try to steer clear of any blue collar workers. Unless they're fatties. In any case, those couples don't matter.

Seriously though, my mom married a plumber, and he became my father. I'm not really prone to effusiveness on the subject but i can tell you i could never have asked for a better dad. Never had an overabundance of money but that was and should be secondary to any kid growing up. My parents are still as happily married as is possible after 37 years, while the parents of many kids i went to school with who were much wealthier are now divorced. I may be painting a cliche hear but its got a pretty firm basis in truth.

I would never say prudent thoughtfullness regarding financial matters is a bad thing. But it has its very narrow use and beyond that becomes destructive. Especially when one gets into the accumulation of wealth for its own sake.

Owen, kudos to your parents for staying married that long. But I have to say that despite your parents' success, money is still a big issue in relationships today, especially considering the modern world we live in now. Of course one should not be obsessed over it, but that's what you need to keep a household thriving and going. Otherwise, how are you going to pay the mortgage for the house, your kid's future college education, or to cover healthcare costs?

That's one of the reasons why couples who live in poverty usually break up, and the kids grow up in single parent households while living on the poverty line. It's also a factor in the rise in divorces. Take South Korea for example. The rise in divorces and the decline of the birthrate there is due to the unfavorable environment for raising kids, since couples are busy trying to earn a living and postponing marriage until the conditions are right.

Prudent thoughtfulness on financial matters is always a good thing. Even blue collar workers can accumulate a lot of savings if they have that trait. Actually people with white collar jobs will never get rich if they are irresponsible and reckless. Yet prudent thoughtfulness in the area of financial matters will almost always get a couple through during times of trouble, regardless of whether the husband is a plumber or a businessman.

[HashiriKata]

That's one of the reasons why couples who live in poverty usually break up, and the kids grow up in single parent households while living on the poverty line. It's also a factor in the rise in divorces.

I don't think poverty is the reason for the rise in divorces. In fact, it can be said there are more divorces among the more well off couples, and in the more well off countries (You yourself mentioned the rise in divorces in Korea as the country is getting better off !!!). Anyway, I'm not saying that you're more likely to divorce due to being poor or rich, but that the reason for the rise in divorces seems to lie elsewhere.

[Long Zhiren]

I'm not saying that you're more likely to divorce due to being poor or rich, but that the reason for the rise in divorces seems to lie elsewhere.

It's a vicious spiral. Here in the US, one of the most disasterous things is that most marriage counselors themselves are divorced; and have failing trackrecords for helping relationships! If you come across the work of any such person, don't bother wasting your time with it--skip it. How do they think they can successfully help anyone's marriage if they can't even help their own? All they seem to do is tell people what they already wanted to hear--reinforcing inabilities to sustain relationships.

The interesting thing is that if you look at the advice from the few counselors who have been married a long time with no divorces, their advice is quite different. They're actually successful too and often provide money-back guarantees on their work. A general theme of their advice is for couples to promise each other extraordinary care. The extremely popular "me-culture" at large is totally against that; and is generally nothing but bad news for any relationship. It sets up timebombs with rental (eg pre-nuptial agreements, no fault divorce systems, etc), free-load and cohabitation mentalities.

Here's a Singapore news article today on China's situation:

http://sg.news.yahoo.com/060828/1/431xo.html

China's most modern city trains its first marriage counselors

China's economic hub Shanghai has trained its first group of marriage counselors, state media said, as the city experiences one of the highest divorce rates in the country.

On Saturday, 140 people obtained certificates for the new career, ready to offer professional consulting services on marriage and family life in the city of 17 million people, Xinhua news agency said.

The training was jointly sponsored by the human resources development center of the women's advocacy group, All China Women's Federation, and the China International Marriage and Family Association.

The counselors will serve as volunteers and consultants in three local marriage consulting companies, Xinhua said.

They are not only trained in psychology, marriage law and child welfare, but also received training on how to deal with problems in cross-cultural marriages, which are increasingly common.

Divorce rates in China are rising rapidly, with the highest rates seen in big cities such as Beijing and Shanghai.

According to the Ministry of Civil Affairs, 1.78 million couples separated nationwide last year, up 7.25 percent over the previous year.

In 2004, 27,374 couples in Shanghai filed for divorce, averaging 75 couples per day, up 38.9 percent over the previous year, state media cited a survey of the city's 19 district marriage registration offices.

Among the divorcing couples, 7.2 percent were married for less than one year, the survey showed, according to the news website China.org.cn.

Social stigma against divorcees is less strong in big cities like Shanghai.

Young people meanwhile are less shy about ending an unhappy marriage, as they are not bound by the constraints of the older generation.