Taoism in China

[bhchao]

Is there really a Taoism revival in China? According to this NYTimes Magazine article, Taoism, Buddhism, and Christianity are attracting ground in China.

Is the statement "The Chinese are in the midst of a great awakening of religious belief" a rosy generalization? In reality, are most Chinese apathetic to religion or ancient philosophical beliefs?

I find it odd that the author of the article see Taoism as a religion.

Enter religion. China is in the midst of a religious revival, and people will pay to visit holy sites. So the local government set out to rebuild the temple, which was wrecked by Red Guards during the Cultural Revolution, modestly rebuilt then torn down when the park was first constructed. Officials commissioned a 30-foot statue of the Jade Emperor, had it hauled to the peak and encased in the brilliant red pavilion. They then built a bell and a drum tower, as well as another set of halls devoted to minor deities.

Religion has long played a central role in Chinese life, but for much of the 20th century, reformers and revolutionaries saw it as a hindrance holding the country back and a key reason for China’s “century of humiliation.” Now, with three decades of prosperity under their belt — the first significant period of relative stability in more than a century — the Chinese are in the midst of a great awakening of religious belief. In cities, yuppies are turning to Christianity. Buddhism attracts the middle class, while Taoism has rebounded in small towns and the countryside. Islam is also on the rise, not only in troubled minority areas but also among tens of millions elsewhere in China

As China’s only indigenous religion, Taoism’s influence is found in everything from calligraphy and politics to medicine and poetry. In the sixth century, for example, Abbess Yin’s temple was home to Tao Hongjing, one of the founders of traditional Chinese medicine. For much of the past two millenniums, Taoism’s opposite has been Confucianism, the ideology of China’s ruling elite and the closest China has to a second homegrown religion. Where Confucianism emphasizes moderation, harmony and social structure, Taoism offers a refuge from society and the trap of material success. Some rulers have tried to govern according to Taoism’s principle of wuwei, or nonaction, but by and large it is not strongly political and today exhibits none of the nationalism found among, say, India’s Hindu fundamentalists.

[gato]

There is a lot of praying going on in China. It may not be what you think of as Taoism.

[roddy]

Kind of makes sense that as people get richer and worry less about food and shelter that they'll start to worry about things further up the hierarchy of needs - you're also seeing a rise in yoga, arts and crafts and amateur photography. I'm not sure there's any great social significance to it.

[anonymoose]

I can't say much about Taoism specifically, but I've always been surprised by the number of Chinese christians I've seen here, and of those that I know of, they are mainly young women.

Having said that, Chinese society, at least in developed eastern coastal areas, generally does not seem to care much for religion, and that includes traditional Chinese religions. Old people still seem to hang onto old traditions though, for example burning paper money in the streets for the deceased.

[rezaf]

It's strange but I have seen a lot of churches in small towns and villages. Also in hospitals there are many people who advertise Christianity and many patients who turn to Christianity. Somehow China is becoming more and more Christian. Anyway apart from 外国人 I haven't heard anyone talking about Daoism in China. Daoism is really against the general culture of modern Chinese people.

[gato]

My guess is that Christianity is probably the largest organized religion in terms of number of believers in mainland China today.

There are many who believe in indigenous gods (like the wealth god, 财神), 观音, burning money and what not, but most of those are not organized and are probably more just a general belief in supernatural powers than based on a systematic set of beliefs.

Second largest is probably Islam, followed by Buddhism. But the thing about Buddhism is the organizations are very weak and beholden to the government. There are probably many individual believers of Buddhism who aren't affiliated with any organizations.

It definitely feels that the Christians are more intense in their belief. Maybe it's due to the evangelical nature of Christianity.

[jbradfor]

I find it odd that the author of the article see Taoism as a religion.

I find it odd that you do not consider Taoism as a religion.

It doesn't have a central Deity, that much is true, but many religions don't. One might say it doesn't have a Deity at all, or one one might say that nature is its Deity. But many religions don't, e.g. Shinto.

Beyond that, it sure seems to meet the criteria of a religion to me. It's a system of beliefs about how one should act in society and how to be in accordance with the supernatural (the 道).

[renzhe]

Do keep in mind that Taoism in China is commonly mixed with old folk religions to different extents.

[bhchao]

Beyond that, it sure seems to meet the criteria of a religion to me. It's a system of beliefs about how one should act in society and how to be in accordance with the supernatural (the 道)

Confucianism is also a system of beliefs about how one should act in society. It involves the supernatural to some extent. For example, rulers are supposed to embody the Mandate of Heaven's will, and keep the balance between Heaven and Earth. Yet Confucianism is not considered a religion.

[jbradfor]

Yet Confucianism is not considered a religion.

By whom? It certainly was in the comparative religion class at my undergrad school.

It involves the supernatural to some extent.

"to some extent"? To say that Taoism isn't a religion because Confucianism isn't a religion and Taoism and Confucianism are "similar" seems logically flawed.

[bhchao]

Jbradfor, Confucianism and Taoism are two distinct philosophies and sets of principles governing how and when one should act. They don't involve worshipping a deity, Just because many religions lack central deities does not mean Taoism and Confucianism should be considered religions because they too lack central deities. Unlike Christianity or Islam, Confucianism lacks a supernatural being that one should worship. Confucius was not a god. Many Chinese follow his principles, but they don't worship him as some kind of almighty being.

Taoism actually shares striking similarities with American Transcendentalism. Both are philosophies emphasizing balance with nature, individual freedom, refusal of societal constraints, and simplicity of mind. And both share anti-authoritarianism tendencies.

So would one consider Transcendentalism a religion?

[gato]

There is a very helpful article about this issue:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/taoism/beliefs/religious_1.shtml

Diffference between religious Taoism and philosophical Taoism

Taoism is often taught in the West as an atheist or agnostic philosophy, but in China and Taiwan particularly, Taoism still functions like any conventional religion, and not like an abstract philosophy of life.

There are Taoist temples, monasteries and priests, rituals and ceremonies, and a host of gods and goddesses for believers to worship. These are as vital to the survival of Taoism as individual understanding and practice.

The religious elements of Taoism draw much of their content from other Chinese religions (including many local cults), and so enfold a very wide range of culture and belief within the wings of the Tao.

[aristotle1990]

Daoism is a religion, Confucianism isn't.

[jbradfor]

@bhchao, I think we'll just need to agree to disagree on Taoism :blink:

FWIW, I never said Confucianism is a religion. I was merely saying that many religion "experts" (of which I am not one) do consider it a religion, and that your logic in post #9 is flawed.

[bhchao]

Jbradfor, fair enough B)

Of course there is no right or wrong answer on this. Just trying to see the logic behind how one sees things.

[anonymoose]

I don't know what the criteria are that define a belief system as a religion, but one thing I can say is that Confucian temples look a lot like Buddhist temples.

[jbradfor]

Of course there is no right or wrong answer on this. Just trying to see the logic behind how one sees things.

Often there is no logic, just definitions......

But in terms of how I approach this, I base my categorization based on how the religions are currently being practiced, not based on a strict reading of the "original" text.

That is, when discussing Taoism, I do not look just at the plain text of 道德經, but rather more at the practices and beliefs of people that consider themselves Taoist today. In particular, I agree with you that based on a strict reading of 道德經, it does take a somewhat expansive definition of "religion" to call it a religion. [Not that it isn't a religion, but it certainly is borderline.] In contrast, as renzhe and others have pointed out, if you look at the practices of most modern-day Taoist, you will find a lot of beliefs that appear no where in the 道德經. And based on those practices, I would consider Taoism a religion.

This is true for all religions. Consider Christianity today and how it is practiced. [And I'm going to be USA-centric here, as that is what I am more familiar with.] Show me in the bible any mention of Christmas trees and the Easter bunny. Most of the hymns in current services are not in the bible (although some are, e.g. the Psalms). Communion? Indulgences? [OK, that one is not really current any more....] Confessionals? WWJD bumper stickers? Even the entire approach to belief, through the Catholic Church on one side versus a more direct relationship on the other, is not in the bible.

[renzhe]

Thank you, gato, that link sums it up succinctly.

There is basically no religion in 道德经, but with time Daoism became a proper religion, with gods and temples, monks and the supernatural, and everything else one expects.

bhchao, I'm sure that you must have visited a Daoist temple at some point. I've never seen anyone pray in one, though, unlike the Buddhist temples.

[gato]

Really? I visited a Taoist temple in Sichuan recently. There were people praying to statues of deity/luminaries there. They seem to be more laid-back about collecting donations than Buddhist temples that I've seen.

[gato]

Back to bhchao's original point, I do think more people are interested in religion and spiritual matters nowadays. I don't think it's strictly related to economic development. It's not that they were too poor to practice religion before, but rather Maoism was the only religion allowed for a long time..