Guest mark Posted October 13, 2003 at 02:47 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 02:47 PM I am new to the forum and VERY new to learning the language. Been working for just a few weeks with two or three texts folks most often recommend and some software and language tapes. I am getting the hang of figuring out how to look up words in the dictionary (I am using the Oxford Concise), but sometime run into problems. Since I started, I have been avidly tyring to parse my way through every bit of written Chinese I see. After about an hour I managed to figure out the text on a classic Shanghai 1930's cigarette poster my wife and I purchased a few months back. My latest attempt was at the few characters that appear on the poster for Tarantinos's new film Kill Bill. Within the letters of the name there are two characters. The first, I am pretty sure, means "revenge" here, but the second baffles me and I am not sure I can even figure out the radical. This may be a kanji rather than a hanzi, although I have not figured out whether the Japanese versions are sufficiently different that you need a Japanese dictionary to read those words (I told you I was a total newbie at this game). Any one got any ideas? (Also, what about the stuff on the sword itself in the poster. Fairly sure that is Japanese, however, and may have katakana in it.) Thanks. What a great forum. You guys have already been a great help. Mark Quote
Tsunku Posted October 13, 2003 at 03:04 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 03:04 PM Japanese Kanji are, if I remember correctly (I studied Japanese about ... 6 years ago) not simplified, but traditional characters. That's the only difference, if you can even call it that, because lots of places still use trad. chars. I wish I knew what the character was. Sometimes the radicals can just be a little tricky to figure out. Welcome to the forum btw. Quote
roddy Posted October 13, 2003 at 04:31 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 04:31 PM The only Kill Bill poster I could find with characters on had them half-hidden by a blood-stained sword, and from what I could see they looked like they had been at least stylized, if not just invented. If you can come up with a link to an decent image, I'm sure somebody will be able to help you. I remember when I first started using a dictionary, I decided to translate a book on calligraphy. Don't think I ever finished that somehow . . . Anyway, welcome to the forums, and ask away if you have any more questions. Roddy Quote
Tsunku Posted October 13, 2003 at 04:50 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 04:50 PM Those characters on that poster (I did a search too!) say "ki-ru bi-ru" in Japanese katakana. Just "Kill Bill" spelled out in Japanese phonetics. My first translation attempts were Mao Zedong's poems. Actually, they were pretty easy. Song lyrics are also good practice. Quote
Guest Anonymous Posted October 13, 2003 at 05:19 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 05:19 PM This may be a kanji rather than a hanzi, although I have not figured out whether the Japanese versions are sufficiently different that you need a Japanese dictionary to read those words (I told you I was a total newbie at this game). Welcome to the forums. Japanese Kanji and Chinese Hanzi are closer than you might assume. Aside from the very few Japanese Kokuji characters, which were "invented" by the Japanese to fit their language, the rest of Kanji are just Chinese Hanzi with some in simplified form and most in traditional form. Quote
Guest mark Posted October 13, 2003 at 05:42 PM Report Posted October 13, 2003 at 05:42 PM Thanks for the responses. The ad I am talking about is the full page newspaper ad. I can't find it on the internet to link to it. In addition to the sword in the middle of the page, the words KILL BILL are printed in large letters in the lower third of the page and there are two characters, in vertical formation, in each of the "I" of "KILL" and "BILL". Mark Quote
skylee Posted October 14, 2003 at 06:54 AM Report Posted October 14, 2003 at 06:54 AM I found two posters on the internet here and here. In both of them it is katakana "ki-ru-bi-ru" (キルビル) behind the sword. I don't see any Chinese characters. In Hong Kong the movie is called "標殺令", but I don't think you mean any of these characters. Quote
Guest mark Posted October 14, 2003 at 04:48 PM Report Posted October 14, 2003 at 04:48 PM Thanks for all the responses. The charcters I was talking about were in the full page ad in the LA Times, but I haven't seen them any where on the internet. I am starting to think now that they probably are kanji. I know Tarantino shot a lot of the movie in Beijing, but I just read that that's where all the footage that was supposed to be the Tokyo interiors (and the garden outside the restaurant) was shot (he also shot exteriors in Tokyo proper) -so maybe there is no Chinese element to the movie (disappointing, I was really looking forward to seeing Beijing scenes in the movie). Upshot is that maybe the second mystery character really is just a neat looking but obscure or invented character. Oh well, on to the next bit of text to decipher. (My packets of teas from Taiwan.) Mark Quote
roddy Posted October 14, 2003 at 04:52 PM Report Posted October 14, 2003 at 04:52 PM Oh well, on to the next bit of text to decipher. (My packets of teas from Taiwan.) That can be fun in itself. I've got a packet of tea somewhere that claims to cure radiation sickness and cancer . . . Roddy Quote
Quest Posted October 16, 2003 at 01:33 AM Report Posted October 16, 2003 at 01:33 AM Oh well, on to the next bit of text to decipher. (My packets of teas from Taiwan.) That can be fun in itself. I've got a packet of tea somewhere that claims to cure radiation sickness and cancer . . . Roddy haha is that the anti oxidation (therefore cancer preventing) effect that green tea's supposed to have? Quote
smithsgj Posted October 16, 2003 at 01:40 AM Report Posted October 16, 2003 at 01:40 AM Particularly effective in combination with Long Life cigarettes from Taiwan. Quote
niubi Posted October 16, 2003 at 02:02 AM Report Posted October 16, 2003 at 02:02 AM I've got a packet of tea somewhere that claims to cure radiation sickness and cancer . . . there is a powdered tea like drink in china made from lingzhi which some believe to be effective against cancer. its thought to potentially boost the immune system, prevent dna damage, and be effective as an anti-oxidant. lingzhi or Ganoderma lucidum is a kind of mushroom. in a dried state it has also been used in crafting scholar art objects interestingly enough. is also shown though that lingzhi can also result in a decrease in platelet levels which could be dangerous if the levels were too low. on the other hand people who take chemo as a treatment for cancer are at the risk of blood clots and a decreased level of platelets would be helpful in that respect. Quote
tetsuo500 Posted December 12, 2003 at 06:35 AM Report Posted December 12, 2003 at 06:35 AM Although many Japanese kanji look the same as traditional Chinese hanzi, some of the meanings actually differ. So, just to be on the safe side you should always find out the Chinese meaning and the Japanese meaning for a character. Most of the time they're the same, but just check. Each Japanese kanji usually has about 3 different pronounciations, one of these is usually close to the Chinese pronounciation. For example: 神 in Chinese is shen, in Japanese one pronounciation is shin. They have the same meaning in Japanese and Chinese. 天 is pronounced tian in Chinese and ten in Japanese, again the same meaning. Sorry, I don't know any examples of character meanings that differ, as I ｊｕｓｔ ｓｔａｒｔｅｄ ｌｅａｒｎｉｎｇ Japanese a few weeks ago Oh yeah, look out for Kill Bill: Part 2, I heard the next one is actually set in China. I guess it must be in Beijing, as that's where everything was shot, but I'm not sure. Do you remember the shot where The Bride says: "Those of you lucky enough to still have your lives. Take them with you. But leave the limbs you've lost. They belong to me now." Well, Quentin Tarantino was one of the many guys rolling around their own blood. :o Quote
skylee Posted December 12, 2003 at 07:43 AM Report Posted December 12, 2003 at 07:43 AM tetsuo kun, I think what you referred to are 音讀 and 訓讀 of Japanese kanji, like 神 in Japanese can be pronounced as "shin" or "kami", depending on the context and usage. Quote
trooper Posted December 12, 2003 at 03:04 PM Report Posted December 12, 2003 at 03:04 PM Japanese characters are NOT all identical to traditional Chinese ones, but some Japanese characters differ from the Chinese ones in minor ways (a few strokes or so). Quote
Quest Posted December 12, 2003 at 03:46 PM Report Posted December 12, 2003 at 03:46 PM they simplified their characters too, however, the vast majority are the same. Quote
pazu Posted December 13, 2003 at 08:25 AM Report Posted December 13, 2003 at 08:25 AM Japanese Kanji are' date=' if I remember correctly (I studied Japanese about ... 6 years ago) not simplified, but traditional characters. That's the only difference, if you can even call it that, because lots of places still use trad. chars. I wish I knew what the character was. Sometimes the radicals can just be a little tricky to figure out. Welcome to the forum btw.[/quote'] Not necessarily true. Japanese Kanji are a mix of the Simplified Chinese and Traditional Chinese characters. Japanese has a character of "醫", but they tend to use the simplified version 医 now. There're much more examples but I'm too lazy to list more here. Quote
smithsgj Posted December 15, 2003 at 01:57 AM Report Posted December 15, 2003 at 01:57 AM some of them are different entirely like guangzhou de guang (the mainland three-stroke character, with a bopomofo 's' inside it) Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and select your username and password later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.