Why locals can't understand foreigners with a slightly wrong tonation but can understand 本地口音?

[renzhe]

It's not just the locals, I've met European learners of Chinese and I couldn't understand some of them for the life of me.

I think that being used to regional accents plays a large role. Retroflex issues (sh/s) used to throw me off in the beginning, and Sichuan 3/4 tone swap still gets me sometimes, but I'm getting better at it. Foreign learners have a huge variety of accents and grammatical mistakes that throws people off.

[Guest realmayo]

I think Chinese people must be used to dealing with accents: China is full of Chinese people speaking Chinese with different accents. My guess is one problem with foreigners speaking is that their accent is NOT Chinese -- it's not a standard Putonghua accent, nor is it a regional one, it's an English/French/Korean whatever accent, which the listener has no familiarity at all with and assumes that the person is speaking a foreign language. Though the other reasons advanced here also of course must apply to some extent.

[youhao]

I got in trouble once talking to a beijing taxi driver. He got super mad at what I said. And I didnt know what I said. One of the only rare times I saw a chinese person get upset. I was so confused. Kinda put me off to beijing taxi drivers too. The bus is much cheaper!

[greenarcher]

Very true. I guess foreign accent is too different for them.

English on the other hand doesn't rely too much on tones. This is probably why native English speakers understand foreign English no matter how badly they sound much easier than Chinese locals understand foreignly-accented Mandarin.

I went to Sichuan without knowing their s/sh accent, it was so confusing at first but I eventually got the hang of it. Taiwan has a similar accent.

[tooironic]

To be honest, thinking that the reason you're not being understood is because the interlocutor isn't trying hard enough to understand you is a bit rich. Sure, Chinese don't expect the average foreigner to speak Chinese, but that doesn't mean you can't surprise them. Simply using a cutting-in phrase like 那个, 对了, 我想问你一下, etc - or even just a loud 恩 or similar Mandarin-sounding grunt - goes a long way in letting the making expecting Chinese. But in my experience even if I don't do this I rarely have a problem being understood. It's simply a matter of whether you have an accent that sounds similar enough to one of the major ones prevalent in China.

[amandagmu]

This conversation reminds me of a French friend of mine who lives in the U.S. He rarely has problems being understood in big metropolitan areas, where lots of immigrants have resided for years, but he had a hell of a time traveling in rural West Virginia and other parts of the country like that. He literally told me that the locals couldn't understand him most of the time. To be sure, he does have a heavy French accent, but his English is near perfect in terms of grammar and vocabulary. Actually, come to think of it, his vocabulary might also confuse people since he speaks more like an educated person from London. This is often why I'm misunderstood by people on the mainland, I think. I tend to use formal vocabulary I initially learned in Taipei, and sometimes cannot remember when something is 正式 or 书面话. I also preface nearly everything with 不好意思。

[skylee]

Actually, come to think of it, his vocabulary might also confuse people since he speaks more like an educated person from London. This is often why I'm misunderstood by people on the mainland, I think. I tend to use formal vocabulary I initially learned in Taipei, and sometimes cannot remember when something is 正式 or 书面话. I also preface nearly everything with 不好意思。

Forgive me, but I think this sounds very proud ... sounds like you think most people on the mainland are beneath you or not as educated as you or something ...

[nickpellatt]

I think I should point out an amusing difference between native Chinese speakers and native English speakers.

Native Chinese speakers are often surprised if a non-native speaks Chinese. Native English speakers are surprised when any non-native CANT speak English. :huh:

[xiaocai]

Isn't that normal, considering the numbers of non-native Chinese speakers and non-native English speakers out there?

And to amandagmu, maybe us mainlanders are less educated than those from island but I have no trouble understanding them however politely they speak; as a matter of fact, the only instances I may find difficulties are when they start swearing.

[rob07]

There are a couple of sites of the web that will play a two syllable Chinese word and ask you to guess what the tone combination is (you can find them through these forums). If you haven't already, it might be worth giving these a go - if your answers are not mostly right, then you have no idea how bad you really sound or how close to the standard 本地口音s are, and this might be your answer.

[amandagmu]

Hey everyone, calm down!!! Seriously. This is not my view - in fact to be honest, I wish I could speak better colloquially. What I'm saying is that I was TAUGHT formal speech in Taiwan, not necessarily my wish, either. This is not about mainland China bashing or Taiwan praising... geesh.... I have no strong feelings either way, I'm just telling you what I've noticed in speaking with people and having them give me odd looks or ask where the hell I learned such formal language. It was probably more a result of the specific program I was in anyways, not because it was "Taipei" and this is "Beijing."

[rob07]

Sorry Amanda, my last post wasn't really directed at you (I have the impression you are quite advanced?), I was more thinking of the person who said his Chinese was limited and bad. And I wasn't trying to be snarky either, I've had this problem myself. A big problem with Chinese at the early stages is that you can't hear what you are doing wrong, so when you think you have said something clearly that has been misunderstood, it is a good idea to remind yourself of your limitations. I think this is quite a common issue, although of course misunderstandings happen for other reasons too.

[Brian US]

I understood what amandagmu was trying to say. It would be like a Chinese person asking for my book like this:

Pardon my interjection, but might I procure your reading material for a gander?

Throw in a Chinese accent and you have officially thrown me off.

[JenniferW]

Think about this for comparison. British English has around 22 vowels (variation means not all speakers have the same number). If you use the wrong vowel in a monosyllabic word, you would probably not to be understood if the listener only heard that one word. Now multiply that - change the vowels in most words in a string of words. Not only would it genuinely take some deciphering, the listener is having a very discordant experience. Wrong tone means wrong vowel, so this must be what's happening for a Chinese listener.

If you were the listener and the speaker looked like one of your own native speakers, you might assume it was a person with a speech problem, and you might make the effort to understand. If the speaker looks like a foreigner, I think you'd have already said to yourself here was a foreigner mangling your language.

[o7o]

I'll share my experience, since I think it's different from a lot of people here. I came to Taiwan with no Chinese at all as an English teacher, and I acquired the fundamentals of Chinese in one-on-one classes with a tutor before I became a full-time student here. The first month after I started class (placed into high intermediate) I couldn't understand a damn thing any of my classmates were saying, with the exception of one American-born Chinese. I had no experience at all hearing foreigners speak Chinese, and mainly due to the tones being unstable or wrong I couldn't pick up what they were trying to say. In time I adapted and I actually think it helped my listening ability quite a bit, and afterwards I understood why my teacher could understand everything I said right from the beginning whereas it took months to be able to communicate even basic needs to the guy on the street. So I'd say, yes, it's a tone thing. Tones are just as important as pronunciation and far harder to grasp. Toneless Chinese is gibberish.