Making comparisions with 有 vs. 跟...一样

[rmpalpha]

I'm currently working on NPCR lesson 28's grammar points and they begin the lesson by outlining how to make comparisons with 有/没有. For instance:

中秋节没有春节那么热闹。

I understand the structure of this pattern, but I'm confused as to why it would be different from a pattern that I've already learned - so, for instance, could I not also say this as:

中秋节跟春节不一样热闹。

The lesson makes no mention of the latter, so I'm wondering just how interchangeable the two patterns are when making this kind of comparison between two things. Could anyone please shed some light on this subject? Thanks!

[sixiao]

1.only for the word of 有/没有 means "there is/there isn't", but in the sentence of 中秋节没有春节那么热闹， the word of "没有"means "is not the same as".

2.the sentence of "中秋节跟春节不一样热闹"is not ok, because we don't express like this.besides, this sentence means middle autumn is not the same popular or interesting as spring festival. but the 1st sentence means middle autumn festival is not the same popular or interesting as spring, and!!spring festival is more popular and interesting than middle autumn festival.

3.difference?...it has, but i am sorry my english is not so good to express that...i hope the above explain is useful...

[打酱油的]

They're not interchangeable!

When you say "A is not as big as B" in English, what you actually mean is "A is smaller than B", right? But that notion doesn't translate into Chinese, where "A跟B不一样大" simply means "A and B are different in size".

"中秋节跟春节不一样热闹" doesn't make much sense (at least to me, a native Mandarin speaker). Provided with sufficient context, it could mean (I still doubt it) 中秋节 and 春节 are both 热闹, but in different ways.

[AlexL]

To clarify the above post (show where 没有 fits into the picture):

"A is not as big as B" is A 没有 B 大

"A and B are different in size" is A 跟 B 不一样大

It doesn't make too much sense to say that 中秋节 and 春节 are "different in 热闹ness", so that sentence doesn't work too well. But you can say that 中秋节 is not as 热闹 as 春节 (using the 没有 construction).

[rmpalpha]

Thank you so much, everyone, for your answers to my question! Based on your comments, it seems that the example I posted (one that I lifted from the book) was a pretty poor one. Let me try to ask the question again using a better example:

A跟B一样大。 （A = B in terms of size)

A跟B不一样大。 (A ≠ B in terms of size)

A比B大。 (A > B in terms of size)

A不比B大。 (A < B in terms of size)

My revised question is whether the 有 pattern was interchangeable with 跟...一样 for the affirmative and interrogative case. This is clearly not the case for the negative case (where an actual comparison is being made rather than simply an expression of inequality - this I did not know). In other words, are the following pairs of sentences interexchangeable?

A跟B一样大。 (A = B in terms of size)

A有B大。 (meaning A = B in size, right?)

A不比B大。 (A < B in terms of size)

A没有B大。 (A < B in terms of size, right?)

A跟B一样大吗？ (asking whether A = B )

A有B大吗？ (asking whether A = B, right?)

Thanks again, everyone!

[AlexL]

A 不比 B 大 - A is less than *or equal to* B in size. ie， A is not bigger than B.

A 有 B 大 - A is at least as big as B. I don't hear this used in the affirmative so much, but Ｉhave heard it used in questions (A 有 B 大吗？) - is A as big as B? The answer is yes even if A is bigger than B.

[马盖云]

rmpalpha,

check out this webpage that someone posted in another thread recently... click on the "Comparatives" topic. (I linked to the main grammar page, because there is a lot if useful stuff there, too!)

www.ctcfl.ox.ac.uk/Grammar%20exercises.htm

I think this is a helpful comparison of the 比、不一样，有没有 comparison structures.

继续加油！

马

[rmpalpha]

马盖云：

Wow, this is an amazingly helpful resource - the comparatives section in particular directly compares (heh) the three constructions that I've asked about here. All of my questions have been answered! Thank you for pointing me to this resource.