after John DeFrancis

[pio_n]

The question is to those who have finished "Advanced Chinese Reader" by John DeFrancis. What following textbooks capable to increase number of known characters up to 4000-5000 and words to about 15000 would you recommend? Were there in chinese teaching history some prominent works in print?

[jbradfor]

Is there some reason you want to continue with a textbook, as opposed, to, say, reading native material? Is there something about a textbook that you prefer?

[pio_n]

jbradfor, the usefulness of native material is undeniable, but if some outstanding high-level textbooks have been published over the years, why not mention them - they could also spare a lot of time and effort for advanced learners, as DeFrancis does for beginners.

[renzhe]

It would be very nice to hear about textbooks aiming specifically at advanced students (since there are so few of them), I agree.

However, if you are in the ballpark of 4000 characters and 10000 words, you SHOULD be reading native materials, IMHO. That's a level where any textbook or student reader will essentially consist of materials for native speakers. NPCR 5 and 6 are mostly abridged/edited essays, for example, and they are not comparable to advanced DeFrancis readers.

With that sort of vocabulary, you are well equipped to tackle many real books out there. Get a good dictionary, a good grammar book, and start reading a long novel.

[jbradfor]

That was trying to be a serious question. At your level, what benefit do you see a textbook could provide you? If you could imagine the ideal textbook for you, what would it consist of?

[Daan]

You may want to consider The Independent Reader 從精讀到泛讀, published by SMC in Taipei. That was written for students who have a vocabulary of roughly 5000 words. Or you might like A reader in post-cultural revolution Chinese literature by the same author, Vivian Ling.

Both books consist mainly of native speaker material with vocabulary lists.

[anonymoose]

Only 1.3% of learners of Chinese as a second language get to the 4000 character mark*. Therefore, there aren't many textbooks that go up to this level of vocabulary - at least not systematically anyway. In fact, it is said that in all of Mao Ze Dong's works, only 3136 unique characters were used†. Therefore, if you really want to learn up to 4000+ characters, I think you have little alternative but to use authentic materials.

*From Roddy's book of made-up statistics.

†From here.

[pio_n]

jbradfor, the ideal textbook should continue to be a reader in charming DeFrancis way if possible. After finishing his "Advanced Chinese Reader" you still know only 1200 characters and are not at 4000 characters yet, so it is the aim of that hypothetical textbook to bring a student from 1200 to about 4000.

Daan, thank you. It is not the first time that I hear of Vivian Ling, so perhaps I could look for it.

[renzhe]

OK. 1200 characters is not enough for most native materials (though you could always try comics, like in our Grand Comic Project).

Getting from 1200 to 4000 is a long road, though. I don't know a good book, but some people recommend the Boya series.

[Meng Lelan]

Or you might like A reader in post-cultural revolution Chinese literature by the same author, Vivian Ling.

This is an incredibly good text I've had for over ten years. The vocabulary in there is amazing.

[jbradfor]

Ah, I apologize, I misunderstood your situation. I thought you were at 5000 words and wanted to increase it to 15000. Yes, I certainly agree that a textbook could help your situation.

As penitence for my mistake , I did a quick google search. Do any of these look interesting?

http://www.washington.edu/uwpress/search/books/WANADV.html

http://books.google.com/books?id=K594x4OzRDUC&dq=advanced+chinese+readers&printsec=frontcover&source=in&hl=en&ei=RjmwTaDfI4H3gAeNlKXuCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=16&ved=0CHoQ6AEwDw#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://www.otago.ac.nz/press/booksauthors/backlist/advanced%20chinese%20reader.html

[pio_n]

jbradfor, thank you very much, that looks very promising.

It was somewhat rashly of me not to look for them in google first.

[jbradfor]

IMHO there's nothing wrong with your posting -- people that might have used them can help you separate the crap from the non-crap, saving you time and money.

Anyway, if you do purchase / use some, please report back!

[Friday]

Any chance of finding any of these readers in China?

[pio_n]

The description in Yale catalog indicates that Vivian Ling readers are designed for students at the 1500 character level or beyond, so I gather it would be appropriate first to pay attention for those mentioned by jbradfor and then pass to Vivian Ling. If only one could be sure, that they are a higher level than DeFrancis' "Advanced Reader".