How to deal with synonyms in SRS?

[Ludens]

The more my vocabulary deck in Anki grows, the more I struggle with differentiating synonyms. There seems to be an endless amount of Chinese words that are translated to the same terms in English. I realise most of these synonyms are probably not (always) interchangeable in Chinese, but I can't find out the difference most of the time either. Proper usage probably comes only through ...usage.

I'm not really looking for a discussion on the limits of SRS learning here, just want some thoughts and experiences on dealing with growing numbers of synonyms in SRS decks, especially for English to Chinese cards. I often find myself adding notes regarding tones and pronunciation to differentiate the English side of cards from one another, and I realise this isn't the best thing to be doing.

I've read suggestions about adding example sentences; the problem is that I often can't figure out the difference between word usage, even with example sentences. Besides, if it's at all possible I'd like to keep my English side of cards completely in English.

What are your thoughts on this?

[Olle Linge]

Starting with example sentences is good, then I see no problem adding on notes, explaining details (in any language) as you see fit. I add tons of information to some card, not necessarily because I use all of it when I review, but because I want to be able to look it up later if I forget. It seems like you're not aware of the fact that you can create any number of fields? If you want to keep your English in English, by all means, do so, just create a new field called "Example" and another one called "Details" or whatever. When you compose your models, you can just choose what to show. If you don't want the details all the time, simply put them at the bottom, colour the text white (on a white background). That way you only see it if you use your mouse to select the hidden text. There are many ways of doing this.

I regularly sit down with native speakers to talk through synonyms or near-synonyms. I search my deck and see what it turns out, then bring that list to a friend and talk about it. Of course, most of the time I know the differences for most words, but need clarification on some of them. For instance, if I wanted to check synonyms for "often", this is what it would yield:

• 平常
  
• 通常
  
• 常常
  
• 經常
  
• 時時
  
• 往往
  
• 每每
  
• 尋常
  

Some of these words are interchangeable, some aren't, but after discussing it with a friend, I'd make some notes for the words that didn't work exactly like I thought they did. Choosing a good example sentence is also key. You have to choose sentences that are as specific as possible. For instance, in some sentences, 通常 and 平常 might both work, but they mean slightly different things. Try to pick sentences that are as specific as possible. I never hesitate to ask friends about this, trying to find the sentence that best exemplifies the difference between the words.

[scoff]

My general principal for dealing with stuff like this is that some context always trumps no context. It seems like your facts are just made up of Chinese words with the appropriate English translation(s). While you're right that looking at example sentences might still be confusing, I'd argue that prolonged exposure to the way a certain word is used will be more beneficial in the long run even if the difference is not immediately apparent. Looking up more than one example sentence is probably the way to go if the first sentence you come across doesn't quite cement the meaning. Finding multiple sentences for each confusing word will probably be a PITA, but it comes with the territory.

Regarding keeping the English side of your cards still in English, I can think of two options.

1. Test yourself on the example sentences instead of just vocabulary words for C->E cards. This method has the advantage of providing a bit of context each time you see a confusing word, but it probably doesn't fit into your current way of studying.
   
2. Create a third "side" of your cards and test the example sentences that way.
   

Neither of these methods will be too much help going from E->C if the English on your cards is the same unless you use English sentences as well.

tl;dr Context is King

[WestTexas]

I only make English->Chinese cards for words if I am 90% confident I know how to use the word exactly and I think I might use it in conversation. So if you are not confident how to use a word, just don't worry about it, if it is a useful word you will run into it again. Another thing you can do, for words that are (almost) exactly interchangeable, is put more than one answer on the Chinese side. So your English side says WordX and your Chinese side says AorB, if you say either one it's a good answer.

But you definitely don't need to make a English->Chinese card for every Chinese->English card you make, I probably have at least three times as many Chinese->English cards as the other way around.

Also, you might not have the skills for this yet, but being able to use a Chinese only dictionary makes a HUGE difference in your comprehension and accuracy, and is IMO the best way to differentiate between synonyms besides asking a native speaker.

[imron]

Also, you might not have the skills for this yet, but being able to use a Chinese only dictionary makes a HUGE difference in your comprehension and accuracy, and is IMO the best way to differentiate between synonyms besides asking a native speaker.

I agree completely with this, and would recommend people to switch to a Chinese-Chinese dictionary as soon as feasibly possible in your learning.

[Olle Linge]

Also, you might not have the skills for this yet, but being able to use a Chinese only dictionary makes a HUGE difference in your comprehension and accuracy, and is IMO the best way to differentiate between synonyms besides asking a native speaker.

Sad, but true. I mean, there is of course a level when studying any language that, when you pass it, you almost have to start using dictionaries in the target language, but in Chinese, that level is much, much lower than any other language I've studied, mostly because of bad dictionaries. I could find quite accurate descriptions of English usage in Swedish dictionaries, for instance, and Swedish students of English are only forced to use English-English dictionaries for very advanced vocabulary (technical or professional). I suppose this will change in the future. However, using a Chinese-Chinese dictionary is a learning opportunity in itself. It might take a while getting used to and, depending on the dictionary, the threshold might be high, but once you get over it, such a dictionary is usually able to answer most questions.

[paike]

Now here is the second part that doesn't get talked about and I had to learn the hard way.

Once you want to become an interpreter or take some classes like that to make learning Chinese more fun, you need English words and a REALLY good Chinese to English dictionary. Some Chinese, I know what it means so well but can't exactly explain it in English (also my English keeps getting worse after 6 years in China )

But that said, go Chinese to CHinese dictionary pronto! Pleco is alright, 现代汉语大词典 with a Casio dictionary is WAYYYYYYYYY better, but you dont get the flashcard program, which is a real bummer. =( So now I use both.

[querido]

The roughtly 6000 char or 10000 word vocabulary set of elementary school 小学生 reference books I linked to here:

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/27932-4313pp-ch-ch-dictionaryreference-for-children/

includes a synonym dictionary!

It also includes a chengyu dictionary that gives synonym and antonym chungyus!

(It's hard to believe, but I posted there a year ago "the price before shipping was about $20".)

[Ludens]

Late follow up... Thanks again for all advice, I've been trying out several of the suggestions, but I'm still having trouble handling synonyms in Anki.

The thing that helped me most are example sentences, they really help to distinguish cards. However, when looking up example sentences I have no way of knowing what uses are most common, and have no idea if the synonyms couldn't be used in the exact same sentence. Another 'problem' is that it takes a lot of time to find suitable example sentences without too many new (not yet studied) words.

I've tried to ask native speakers about the differences between words, but although they could tell there's a difference between different words, they have rarely been able to explain the difference.

The Chinese dictionary advice hasn't been too useful, maybe I'm using the wrong dictionary? According to nciku:

互相：表示彼此同样对待

相互：互相

Are most people only reviewing Chinese to English? Do people that do review English to Chinese add other kind of 'hints' like pinyin or whatever? Or is it just me... I only have a few thousand words in my deck, so I'm a bit worried about the road ahead here.

[WestTexas]

I've tried to ask native speakers about the differences between words, but although they could tell there's a difference between different words, they have rarely been able to explain the difference.

maybe you are just asking the wrong people. The two tutors I've had were always able to explain the difference, or they would just say 'these two are the same'

Are most people only reviewing Chinese to English? Do people that do review English to Chinese add other kind of 'hints' like pinyin or whatever?

no hints. You aren't going to have hints in the real world, why would you have them in your deck?

[Ludens]

no hints. You aren't going to have hints in the real world, why would you have them in your deck?

I'm not doing this myself, but I'm suggesting this as I'm curious how on earth it's possible to distinguish between (near-)synonyms in decks of 20 or 30 thousand English > Chinese cards.

[Guest realmayo]

If they are near-synonyms then you've got to find out the difference and test yourself with that difference as part of the question. If they are identical, then I can't see any way around testing yourself on both words simultaneously.

I'm impressed that anyone would have an active Engligh->Chinese deck of that size, ie production not (just) recognition.