da + fu = daifu

[holger]

hello folks!

posting my first topic or even first issue here i'll start with one sentence about my person. I am a student of sinology and linguistics and computer science living in europe(germany(bavaria(erlangen)))

Having started with chinese about 3 months ago i'm afraid still being on the mentioned 这是他妈的书 level...but advancing giant steps every day.

now heres a tiny phenomenon i came across recently being now curious about> 大夫 is not pronounced dafu but daifu. is this a regional occurrence and are there any parallels with syllables changing from one tone to another depending on the next syls tone? Or are there paradigms to copy this sample to other words like the english spelling "[the] east"as "[thi] east" when followed by a monophthong?

thank you in advance

[Guest IVYtony]

actually, it's not an emaple of syllables changing from one tone to another depending on the next syls tone (as you said).

大夫, pronounced dai4 fu1, in modern China, only means medical doctor.

However, 大夫, pronounced da4 fu1 around 1000 years ago, that is a high ranked official in goverment (dynasty).

intersting question! when I began learning Chinese in primary school, I also had tons of such kind of pronunciation questions.

[skylee]

My putonghua teacher taught us that "大" is a 多音字, i.e. a word with more than one pronunciation, just like, say, "lead" in English.

My 現代漢語辭典 says that "大" is pronounced as "dai4" when it appears in 大城 (a place name), 大夫 (doctor), 大黃 (a herb), 大王 (when used in traditional opera / novels).

[Guest IVYtony]

exactly, 大" is a 多音字

e.g. Shan Dai Wang (大王)

大夫 (da4 fu1) is an official rank in government thousands of years ago in China.

[BeijingSlacker]

Having started with chinese about 3 months ago i'm afraid still being on the mentioned 这是他妈的书 level...but advancing giant steps every day.

Nice start!!

In case you don't know, "这是他妈的书" would probably come across as "This is the f^cking book."

[Quest]

大 was pronounced "dai" in ancient China, some words still retained that pronunciation in Mandarin.

[Claw]

大 was pronounced "dai" in ancient China, some words still retained that pronunciation in Mandarin.

In addition, it's still pronounced "dai" in Cantonese as well, for all senses of the word including "big" and in 大夫.