Pedestrian Crossings and Driving Quality of Chinese Taxi Drivers

[pprendeville]

does a green light at a pedestrian crossing in China mean that all traffic gives way to pedestrians or not? Every time I see the green man come on at home I usually cross without looking left and right continuously but I have started to become very cautious in China. Reason being is that I've noticed at intersections that when you're crossing when the green man is visible traffic can take a 90 degree turn. This doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever.

I also witnessed a cyclist turn left today at a T junction on the wrong side of the road and cycle straight into a car. It was like a slow motion accident.

As for taxi drivers, they must be some of the most calculated risk takers in China. Tail gating, braking hard, switching lanes without indicating, talking on their mobiles while smoking a fag and changing gears simultaneously - you name it they do it. If you attempt to put on a seatbelt they seem to get pissed off. What's the story there?

To finish on a funny note, I was in Beijing the other day and saw a bus stopped in traffic, bus driver gets out of his seat, opens door and lights up a fag, takes a few puffs and traffic resumes so he flicks it away and gets back in and drives off - nobody bats an eyelid.

[liuzhou]

does a green light at a pedestrian crossing in China mean that all traffic gives way to pedestrians or not?

Not. You aren't in Ireland now. As in many countries,it is permissible to turn right against red lights. Even if the green man is beckoning!

Cycles are not covered by traffic rules and can do what they like.

Taxi drivers have three objects in mind. Get your cash, you out of the cab and get the next fare as quickly as possible. It's called capitalism. Putting on your seatbelt just means you waste time take it off at the other end. They are technically covered by traffic rules, but it's too hot so the traffic police are hiding in the police station.

As to your funny coda, many years ago in Scotland, I was on a bus. The driver stopped the packed double decker outside a block of flats on the outskirts of Glasgow, disappeared for fifteen minutes, and came back with a smile on his face. I have no wish to speculate!

[jkhsu]

does a green light at a pedestrian crossing in China mean that all traffic gives way to pedestrians or not?

Definitely not. I've mentioned this before but one of the things that bugs me about China is crossing on a green light because the turning cars / bikes don't stop for you. In the USA, cars can also turn right on red but they are required to give the pedestrian the right of way. In some places, you can get ticketed (as a driver) if you don't wait for the pedestrian to completely finish crossing.

In fact, the term "traffic giving way to pedestrians" in China is myth. It's more like the other way around. The best thing to do is to follow the crowd when you cross. For smaller streets, I sometimes just cross when I don't see any cars coming (that way, at least I know there aren't cars coming straight at me). I don't always walk to the intersections to cross because I don't feel any safer around turning cars that don't care about pedestrians. The worst feeling is when I have to stop in the middle of the street and wait for turning cars to weave around me (usually really close) and then walk another few steps and repeat the same process until I finally make it to the other side. Sometimes I wonder why they even have crosswalks with green pedestrian lights when the turning cars never stop and never end.

[Silent]

does a green light at a pedestrian crossing in China mean that all traffic gives way to pedestrians or not?

Is their any country in the world where green light at a pedestrian crossing means that all traffics gives way to pedestrians? The simpel answer is no. There is not a single country in the world where this is the case. They may be supposed to give way, but in most countries a significant number of people don't care about (all) the rules. Just get/keep moving blindly only because you have right of way sounds at least a bit silly to me. Personally, when on foot or bicycle, I tend to do it the other way around. Watch whether it's safe and act accordingly independent of the traffic rules, it's much safer!

[大肚男]

While what Silent is saying is true, it is worse in China than in any other country I've been to, especially that cars turning right do not stop at all.

Pedestrian practically never have right of way, and you have to proceed at your own risk. Once, I was crossing with the a green light, a lady almost ran me over, then stopped, got out of her car, and started screaming at ME.

[jkhsu]

Adding to 大肚男's comments... I cross several streets every day while walking from the parking lot to my office in the USA and I never even think about turning cars because it's expected they wait for pedestrians to cross first. Furthermore, if I'm at an intersection where there are no pedestrian crosswalk lights, cars will actually stop when they see that I'm waiting to cross. This has never happened to me in China. Over there, when the light at the crosswalk turns green, all I do is look at the turning cars to make sure that I dodge them.

I am wondering if the legal system has anything to do with it? In the USA, if you hit a pedestrian while driving, you can get sued for all your money and go to jail as well (depending on the circumstances). People are really afraid of this. Not sure how things work in China though.

[Silent]

it is worse in China than in any other country I've been to

Don't know where you've been, but to me China didn't seem that bad compared to many other places I've been. The general rule of thumb in my experience is that in bigger cities motorised traffic often just keep driving independent of the color of the traffic lights. Only in (western) countries where rules are enforced it tends to be really better. And of course in smaller towns/the countryside it's better but that has often more to do with a lack of motorised traffic and pedestrians/cyclists/(hand) carts/cattle/sheep/chickens taking over the road.

Pedestrian practically never have right of way, and you have to proceed at your own risk.

I don't know whether pedestrians have (officially) right of way. It is however completely insignificant. It's very simple, verify whether it's safe to cross and decide on that instead of some arbitrary trafficlights that may be ignored/broken and/or poorly adjusted to each other etc etc. And of course you proceed at own risk, who else should own the responsibility for your actions?

[大肚男]

I live in the states, but I have been to the Bahamas, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Japan, China, and France.

By far China was the worst, with Egypt not too far behind. Not surprisingly, Japan (or at least Tokyo) was the best.

[icebear]

Is their any country in the world where green light at a pedestrian crossing means that all traffics gives way to pedestrians? The simpel answer is no.

In both Spain and Switzerland (and I suspect most of Europe), this is the norm. It is very, very far from the norm in China (and most of Asia/South America).

[pprendeville]

you can't turen left/right in Ireand and The UK and I think France as well when the green man is on (the green man was actually invented by a very well know Irishman cally Johnny O'Connor from Bantry in Co. Cork).

gosh, didn't realise that its possible to do this in the States. I spent a summer in Newport Rhode Island 10 years ago and I never saw cars doing this (visited New York and Washington DC also) turning while green man was on, at least I don't remember it. I suppose the threat of getting sued is a good deterrant.

would like to know what that bus sdriver was doing in scotland. ha

[Glenn]

...some arbitrary trafficlights...

If traffic lights are arbitrary, that is a sad state of affairs. But, when in Rome, I guess.

[pprendeville]

true

[Silent]

Bahamas, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Japan, China, and France

Strongly depends on place and time, however I remember Paris as bad but that was a long time ago when I wasn't very habited to bad traffic. In Amsterdam there was a time you basicly had to 'jump' in front of a car at some places (near the central station) to get across. It's much better now, though worsening again I think. Istanbul and Bangkok were pretty much the same, you had to jump in front to be able to cross. But as traffic was often slow/jammed not that big of an issue. Douala, as I remember barely trafficlights, but completely ignored and traffic tended to be a complete chaos during morning rushhour. Last april Marrakesh seemed not to have any traffic rules at all.... In my hometown (Netherlands) most follow the rules but every once in a while there is some asshole that ignores all the rules and speeds through a red light or blind (not really bad intending) people that fail to watch out properly.

Sure, China traffic doesn't follow the rules very well, however it surely is not the worse out there.

That said, my experience of 20 years bicycle touring at six continents is that rules may be ignored and traffic can be very bad. However also a lot depends on your own behaviour and attitude. A bit of assertivity, show people what you intend to do, and common sense can make a big difference. But off course as a pedestrian assertivity is much harder then on a bicycle.

[Silent]

In both Spain and Switzerland (and I suspect most of Europe), this is the norm. It is very, very far from the norm in China (and most of Asia/South America).

Sure, it's the norm, but the exceptions are far too common to just blindly cross on a green light. And why would you just cross blindly, what's the effort in having a look to the left/right/around?

[Silent]

you can't turen left/right in Ireand and The UK and I think France as well when the green man is on

In the Netherlands the green man only means you legally have right of way. It does by no way mean that no motorised traffic is allowed.

[icebear]

Sure, it's the norm, but the exceptions are far too common to just blindly cross on a green light.

What I'm telling you is that the exceptions are extremely rare in those countries. People do regularly blindly stroll through crosswalks without stopping and checking, and without much to fear - there is a very high level of respect for pedestrians in those countries. Standing at the roadside for a car to pass will almost always result in that car unnecessarily stopping and holding up traffic to allow you to cross.

Don't knock before you've seen it.

[Lu]

Apparently in China, too, it´s actually not allowed for cars to turn right on a red light. It´s so common I thought the rules said it´s ok. In Holland cars usually stop. In China I´ve gotten assertive enough to just stare them down and cross anyway, cars generally don´t really want to run you over.

[li3wei1]

In Taipei, at least 20 years ago, even being on the sidewalk wasn't enough to guarantee safety from motorized vehicles. When I started riding a scooter/motorcycle, I quickly learned to stay well clear of the row of cars parked along the side of the road because frequently they would jump out into traffic without looking or indicating, or something else would come out from between them at high speed. Always look, and in all directions.

[Silent]

What I'm telling you is that the exceptions are extremely rare in those countries.

Apparantly we have extremely different views of 'extremely'. But admittedly for both countries it has been a few years since my last visit. I wouldn't bet my life on it but if you want to do so feel free.

[adrianlondon]

I currently live in Switzerland, and at any crossing when the green pedestrian sign is lit, the locals just walk into the road without looking at all. I don't do this (memories of living in China) but it's just a quick glance before I too start to cross. But then, unlike the locals, I will cross when the pedestrian "red" sign is lit and there's no traffic.

As a driver and cyclist, you're often given a green light to turn right whilst pedestrians are also allowed to cross. You have to give way to pedestrians at all times. And I've never known it not happen.

To make it even worse (as a driver/cyclist), the locals often step onto non-controlled zebra crossings also without looking. The traffic will screech to a halt and let them cross.