To be or not to be a Chinese Translator

[brucehuang]

@ LU

Oh, don't bring the government thing into this. Unless you have the "political trustworthiness" and that you are kick-ass, and that you have connections. You won't get any sort of government projects, at least not on the Chinese end. So in other words, if you hold a passport other than The People's Republic of China, and that you are a member of the CCP; don't even think about that part...It's like, dream on...For very same reason, I told Simplet that she won't make it into the BFSU's Simultaneous Interpretation.

But the other ones you're talking about. That's still considered "higher end" don't you think? I mean unless you only consider government projects to be "higher end".

[Lu]

Yah, I suppose the ones I mention are high-end, although not the highest end. But what would the middle part look like, then? Or do you mean that the middle part is all taken up by underpaid and underqualified people, pushing it into low-end?

 

Anyway. I'm not even sure what this discussion is about at this point. The OP found their dream school, other schools were discussed and elaborated on, the market is different in every country and for every language pair, so we're pretty much done, no?

[brucehuang]

@ LU

 

Yes, that's kinda what I mean. Everything in the middle is kinda pushed to the lower end because of unqualified people and cheap prices. That's kinda what I mean by "the US is an entirely different market on its own", well compared with China. I mean...200RMB per DAY...for an interpreter...That's what? $30 USD? Yeah...Good luck living off of that...

And yes, of course unless simplet has something else to ask about.

[Lu]

Speaking of diplomatic interpreters, here's a short article about how China's MFA trains them. An interesting read, they really put a lot of thought and effort into it. I wonder how this works in other countries?

[brucehuang]

@ Lu

Yeah, and USUSLLY, BFSU (Beijing Foreign Studies University) and CFAU (China Foreign Affairs University) is where one will be doing this. As far as the United States, I know of a similar program down in Monterey CA, called the DLI, the Defensive Language Institute, who's mainly in charge of training the US outgoing diplomats, linguists of the military and agencies such as the FBI and other personals. Interesting thing though, the DLI is only three blocks or so away from MIIS (Monterey Institute of International Studies). Doesn’t it make you wonder what the connections are? Yeah, professors in MIIS and the DLI are pretty inter-exchangeable. I only knew this because I almost went there… ALL of US secret agency’s foreign “dealers” such as linguist, as well as the military's linguist, take a test conducted by the DLI called the DLPT (Defensive Language Proficiency Test) (again, I know this because I took it…through multiple departments) But the level is just…………VERY WATERY (if you know what I mean)

Anyways, other countries, I don’t know.

[Jamasian]

 I'm grateful to everyone that kept all of this information within the forum. I hadn't been having any luck when it came to choosing an MA in interpreting in China. Even my Chinese association friends on campus didn't help much.

 

That being said, I'd like to apply to BFSU since it seems to be "better". If there are any new members there or anyone that can help me get in touch with some current foreign students, I'd greatly appreciate it. I've only passed HSK 5 but I will go on and start studying to take HSK 6 before the application deadline. I'd like to go this year or next.

 

On a side note, I see that Sichuan University and Sichuan Normal University also have programs. Would you recommend going there under any circumstance? I've lived in Chengdu before and really enjoy everything about that city. (http://www.tac-online.org.cn/en/tran/2011-06/13/content_4264230.htm)

 

In the financial department, I will apply for scholarships, but, in the event I must pay out of pocket I'd like to know the range I should have from month to month in Beijing. Just the basics (food, apt, trans., school functions) in RMB.

[angeia]

Hi Jamasian!

I’m glad that this forum was able to help you out!

BFSU seems like the best option in China (I haven’t been, but from what I hear), and living in Beijing will definitely be a big plus to your Mandarin.

I don’t know where you’re from (?) but universities in China run very differently from that of my home country, the USA. The level of disorganization and lack of curriculum may be overwhelming and frustrating. If SISU (the no.1 school for interpreting in China) wasn’t able to provide this, then I really wonder if a university in sichuan can provide a good education for you.

I say your best bet is to contact them and see how they handle you as a prospective student. I contacted SISU many times and they wouldn’t reply back, answer my questions, send me any documents I requested (or just plain help me in general). I was enraged when I blew my brains out to study HSK 6 in 2 months and pass it because it was a requirement listed on their website, only later to have their staff tell me, “oh, 5 or 6, or no HSK at all—doesn’t matter!” I should have seen that as a big red flag.
 
E-mail or call them and ask them questions: how does your program work, what are the classes like, what should I prepare, etc etc.. If they get back to you and can properly answer your questions, then I think the school might be reliable.

And I don’t see why you should pay out of pocket. You should DEFINITELY apply for the CSC scholarship. China wants more and more international students to come study in China, and from what I can tell the scholarship is not that difficult to get (hell, even I got it). There’s a ton of CSC forums on this website, and here’s a link to their official website. This scholarship is so easy to get, and it will pay for your room/board and everything! Do it!

http://en.csc.edu.cn/

[OneEye]

I've said this elsewhere on this forum, but I think you really ought to aim much higher than HSK 6 before applying if you really want to be an interpreter. The better your Chinese is when you start the program, the more you'll get from it, and the more likely you'll be to find a job afterwards. Get to HSK 6 and then spend a year or two working really hard to bring your Chinese up to a high level (in-country of course), then maybe apply.

 

For reference, I've been working as a freelance translator for nearly a year now and have some pretty high-profile clients, and I'm doing an MA in the Department of Chinese at NTNU (one of only a handful of Westerners in the department), and there's no way I'd feel ready for an MA in interpretation. Like I said earlier in this thread, I'm taking a C-E consec class right now, and it's pretty brutal.

[Jamasian]

Thanks Angeia!

 

Yes, I'm also from the states but I know my skills will improve better if I'm in China. I had my heart set on MIIS for about 2yrs but I've decided it may not be worth it being a U.S. citizen... I will apply for the scholarship. I've just checked all of the requirements and I think I can do this. hahaha I read each of the comments here and I'm grateful for your honesty of how classes are run. I kept getting the "I loved the city. I made a lot of friends." answers so I stopped researching. Shame on me but I hadn't been in a position to apply anyway.

 

I'm only thinking of doing Sichuan if the BFSU doesn't work out. Afterall, they are listed on the site as "eligible to teach TI". 

 

 

One more question about SISU, (I'm using it as the last chance) I love interpreting but I'm also interested in subtitle work in my downtime. If I only took the Translation courses do any of you think that would be worth it? Hmmm actually, I don't think having no textbooks is a good thing...

 

When you self studied and translated did the "teacher" at least check it for mistakes and help or they just assumed you knew where the problems were?

[Jamasian]

OneEye I agree with you, but I can't wait forever for what people think fluency is. I already interpret at conventions on a low level and sometimes on the phone or in any job situation that comes up. I also subtitle movies/dramas as a hobby. That being said, people want documentation that you can do what you say you can. I want the uni and anyone else to see a paper saying I know level 6 material. I haven't taken exams in some time so I'm going to need to get back into a study habit of listening, speed reading, etc. On top of working a full time job teaching English hahahaha  

[OneEye]

I'm not saying you shouldn't take the HSK 6. Of course you should. What I'm saying is that if you go into an interpreting department with just-passable HSK 6-level Chinese, you're going to be in for a rough time. I have friends who have graduated from the program at NTNU who can't get work as interpreters because their Chinese still isn't good enough. They do just fine as translators, but they're having to spend time now, some several years after graduation, bringing their language skills up to par. I'd personally rather be looking for work right after graduating (and thus having recently undergone intensive training in interpretation) rather than being several years rusty and having to rely only on my own ability to keep my interpretation skills up. But that's me.

 

In my own field, I've known quite a few people who have gone to very prestigious universities for PhD work before their Chinese was up to the task (not to mention their Japanese, which tends to be almost non-existent if they know any at all). With only one exception, they've either dropped out or been unsuccessful finding work in their field, so they've had to find other jobs. The one exception is having to take a few years off from his PhD work so he can bring his languages up to some bare minimum for being able to do research, and it's costing him a lot of money. I've seen enough of this sort of thing (in both my field and yours) to convince me that it's worth getting both my Chinese and my Japanese up to a professional level before starting PhD work if I possibly can, even if it means starting later than I had originally planned.

 

You need to do what you think is best, of course, but I think when talking about your career, some things are worth taking your time on. Either way, good luck.

[angeia]

Hi Jamasian!

I saw that you are also studying Japanese (and Korean? whoa!) how is your nihongo coming along?

Yes I was thinking about MIIS as well, but it was more of the pricetag that scared me off. I know it's a top notch school and will introduce you to some amazing people and opportunities, but at the same time it seemed unlikely I would graduate from there with anything less than 50k in debt. I recently met up with a fellow JET alumni that went to MIIS for international policy and he basically got into tens of thousands of dollars of debt. When he graduated, he couldn't find a job and ended up teaching English again in Shanghai. I know int'l policy and interpreting are completely different, but that story really scared me off.

You know, Sichuan is an awesome place. And I think on the CSC scholarship application you have to list three or so schools anyway, so why not add it on there? I would still contact them, though, just to make sure the school isn't too flakey.

The SISU program is supposed to be Masters of Translation and Interpreting (MTI), but in reality it's mostly interpreting. During my time there (the first year) they didn't offer us translation courses, but I hear from my former classmates they are taking translation courses now (really boring, from what i hear). No textbooks. I think the general flow of the translation class is the teacher giving you an assignment every lesson, and then you critique it as a group (as well as do partner critique). I heard a lot of the translation is E-CH (since the majority of students are Chinese), so that will be hard.

The general flow of a typical class at SISU went something like this:
The teacher plays a speech for 5 minutes. Calls on a random student to interpret. Random student interprets, then the class ensues critique. The teacher will throw in a few comments, and then it's another victim's turn.

The Chinese students are really nitpicky, to the point of "he said turquoise, which isn't 蓝色," and if the teacher is good you'll get good advice. Some teachers at SISU were ridiculous and actually taught wrong English to the students, which is when me and the other native speaker stood up and spoke out.

I heard the above style is actually quite typical for interpreting courses, so that wasn't really the problem. The problem is having lack of structure or flow. We weren't told beforehand what kind of speech we would be interperting (not even the industry or topic), and it was literally a random assortment everyday. One day banking, next day environmental protection, and then coal mining...? I mean, even professional interpreters don't accept jobs where they don't even know what the topic is going to be! With no textbook or resources I really found it difficult to self study; I mainly interpeted TED speeches, end of the year annual reports from big companies, whitehouse.org etc.. for practice, but the biggest problem was finding CH-EN material. I coudln't find much at all. When I asked the teacher where I could find CH-EN materials for practice, all he said was: "The internet." Uh, 可以具体一点吗？

Anyway, hope that helped! If you have any other questions let me know ;) CSC can be a pain to fill out, but it's totally worth it. Check out the CSC forums on here! They're really good!

[brucehuang]

@ Jamasian

 

I'm glad to see so many of us on here! You know, I know something that might just help you out.
Well, frist of all, like OneEye said, you must bring your Chinese level way beyond HSK level 6 before considering. But here's something I recently found out about SISU. Appearnetly they signed a partnership program with MIIS, where SISU students can participate in MIIS's advanced entrance program. Should you, and if, you pass their entrance exam, you will then enroll at MIIS for one year compeleting your MA in Transation and Interpration, earning both MTI From SISU and MA in Transation and Interpration at MIIS. Tuition at MIIS runs for about 34k a year, plus whatever it costs you to live in Cali.

I am preparing for that exam, after one semester of studying here at SISU. I admit, the school is a little messy when it comes to administration, but if you study your butt off, you will imporve.

Hope that helps you!

 

PS. Anyone who passes MIIS's advanced entrance test, will be automatically considered for a 10k scholarship. So if you pass it, it'll only cost you about 25k in tution.

[DanWang]

Hi guys! I have been reading this post and I have a few questions in mind since I am hoping to get a free ride in Shanghai international Studies university studying interpretation and translation. 

 

1. Is it easy for a foreigner to get a scholarship for CI program in Shanghai International Studies University? I know it is easy for the MTI but what about CI? GPA requirement? work experience? I am confused of where to start. 

 

2. How accessible is the CI program for foreigners? I mean they only give out 10 certificates per year right? So I wonder if it is politicized into a "ChineseChinese only" thing— though I would fit in by general appearance and mannerisms anyway. 

 

3. How rigid is the "pack and leave' rule? I mean is it a final that I have to fail to get flunked out or just a single terrible in-class performance from a mind freeze that will result in an outright banishment? 

 

4. SISU is not an accredited institution? WHAT?!

 

5. I am in college currently and am thinking about taking either the HSK 6 or DLPT 5. Which one is harder? Is there a test that is harder than both? Anyway, I am just looking for something to "prove" that I know Chinese and which is relatively recognized among U.S. and Chinese employers and Universities. If both HSK and DLPT are fine, what is my "next step" in getting into translation and interpretation? get some related work experience? possible workshops? 

 

 

P.S. To Bruce: Wow, you are the first one I have encountered that have went through the same thing that I did. So..."pat on the back" for your consolation, trust me, I know how it feels. 

 

P.S. #2: sorry guys about my long and tedious questions that may at times appear basic. I am just trying to get a hang of how the system works. I appreciate your feedbacks very much!

[brucehuang]

@ DanWang

 

Hey, did you enlist too? Haha, I took the DLPT from two agencies, the DoD when I was in the Navy, and the DOJ when I tried out for the FBI. Actually you aren't alone, I know a few other people like you; I know it sure dose feel like, you're the only one in the world, so thanks for the "pat". Anyways, the CI program isn't a degree program, hence, it is not covered by the scholarship. The "pack up and leave" rule for the CI classes happens on your yearly final. CI is only a certification not a degree, you should notice the difference between them. The scholarship is so easy to get, especially for US citizens; appearntly Obama and Hu Jingtao signed a exchange program, in the US it's called "100,000 Strong" from the Department of State, and in China it's called "US-China Cultural Exchange Scholarship" or something from the Ministry of Education. It is super easy to apply and nobody usually appies, so basically, if you apply, you get it. And yes, I know it's hard to believe, but SISU isn't a US accredited school, either is BeiWai nor any of them "Language" schools here in China; I learnt about that when I was dealing with my undergraduate student loans, so I am 100% sure about that. However, SISU dose have a partnership program with Monterey Insitiute of International Studies, where you take their advanced entrance exam and do one year of CI there at MIIS, and you will earn a graduate degree from both universities. MIIS is a US accredited school.

P.S. The CI program here, isn't a "Chinese Chinese" thing, I know this British guy who's graduating from CI. But you gotta be super good.

[angeia]

@ DanWang

 

Hey, I think Bruce answered all your questions, but just to simplify it for you:

 

1. Is it easy for a foreigner to get a scholarship for CI program in Shanghai International Studies University? I know it is easy for the MTI but what about CI? GPA requirement? work experience? I am confused of where to start.

 

There is no scholarship for CI.  You have to pay for that out of pocket, and it's about 20,000 RMB (correct me on this, but it's at least 10,000 RMB).  Even if you were in MTI and you had a full ride CSC scholarship, you still have to pay extra money if you are 厉害 enough to make it into CI.  Usually one year after MTI studies they give you the CI test and it's pass or fail.  I knew two foreigners that got in so it's not a "Chinese-only" thing.  If you wanted to skip MTI and just take CI, you can contact SISU and ask how that's done.

 

2. How accessible is the CI program for foreigners? I mean they only give out 10 certificates per year right? So I wonder if it is politicized into a "ChineseChinese only" thing— though I would fit in by general appearance and mannerisms anyway. 

 

I knew 2 foreigners that got in and finished CI.  If you're good enough, and you pass the test, you can get in.  It's just crazy hard, that's all.

 

3. How rigid is the "pack and leave' rule? I mean is it a final that I have to fail to get flunked out or just a single terrible in-class performance from a mind freeze that will result in an outright banishment?

 

SISU wants foreigners.  They will not kick you out.  You could speak latin or Japanese when they call on you to interpret, and theyw ould roll their eyes and skip over you.  I think if they see you making somewhat of an effort they won't flunk you.  Like I said earlier, SISU has no curriculum, or, well, anything that is even slightly organized or put together, so there is no GPA or test scores.  They have no way to measure whether they should flunk you or not--but don't worry, foreigners are safe to stay.

 

4. SISU is not an accredited institution? WHAT?!

 

No.

 

5. I am in college currently and am thinking about taking either the HSK 6 or DLPT 5. Which one is harder? Is there a test that is harder than both? Anyway, I am just looking for something to "prove" that I know Chinese and which is relatively recognized among U.S. and Chinese employers and Universities. If both HSK and DLPT are fine, what is my "next step" in getting into translation and interpretation? get some related work experience? possible workshops?

 

I suggest you take HSK 6, it's good to just say 'hey, I have HSK.'  It helps the employer know you are fluent at Chinese without meeting (ie just looking at your resume). I'm a Chinese/Japanese translator and interpreter, and I've also worked as a consultant where I did market research using both languages.  Usually the companies saw my resume and said 'wow, she has HSK level 6!' then proves the fact at the interview. 

 

As for translation, it depends what kind of translation and interpretation you want to do.  Do you want to do freelance?  Then start looking for clients, proz is a good place to start.  As for interpretation, you can do simple meetings and conferences, or theres simultaneous which is the holiy grail and will probably require additional training. 

 

You don't need work experience to be freelance, but it helps if you've translated Chinese-English in school or have some experience in it, whether it be professional or not.  You also might want to think about what specialization you want to go into.  If you want to go in-house, then you'll ahve to start looking at companies that are hiring.

 

加油！

[Nathan Mao]

@Bruce

I didn't understand what you meant about the DLPT being "watery".  When did you take it?

 

Since I've never taken the HSK, how would you say the DLPT V compares to the HSK 6?

[DanWang]

@Brucehuang&Angeia

 

Thanks Bruce, and you too Angeia. I know foreigners are safe to stay, especially ones with a "nordic" facial structure and complexion. But I have a very
Asian" face, and knowing how things are there, I hope they don't discriminate against me and give me less leeway than if I were to have a "white" face in the context of "pack and leave" policy. What do you think? Also, Bruce mentioned an exchange program between MIIS and SISU. Does the degree from MIIS actually allow me to do conference/simultaneous interpretation or just general consecutive interpretation and translation? Is the cost of the exchange program lower than 50,000? which is the cost if I were to enroll in MIIS directly. If it is really easy to get into the "100,000 strong..." program I might as well take advantage of that and study in Tsinghua Beida if the scholarship is good. Due to a shortage of applicants, is it safe to say that if I apply to "100..." scholarship, I will most likely get a full ride? I don't know anyone in my life that is applying so I have no idea how much they give in scholarships for most applicants. Thanks! 

 

p.s. still in undergraduate so I haven't enlisted for anything yet. 

[brucehuang]

@DanWang

 

You know something, that "Asian" face of you and I, is a double edge sword. I mean for the first time in my life, I feel so strange. The MIIS exchange program would cost you 34,000 USD in tuition, but you will get a 10k scholarship if you pass their advanced entrance exam. And the "100,000 Strong" scholarship, is only designated for US citizen, of course you can apply to BeiDa or Tsinghua. Do keep in mind though, I am talking about SISU when I said nobody usually applies, but BeiDa and Tsinghua are the popular choices for foreigners, so that also includes Americans. Almost all scholarships are full ride, they have different names but from what I've seen, they all say the exact same. Full tuition paid for, accommodation paid for and you get a monthly salary (1500 for BA, 1700 for MA, 2000 for PhD, RMB of course).

@brainfertilizer

 

The DLPT is like....HSK4 level stuff, with one exception, DLPT tests both in English and Chinese. Like you'll have a passage in Chinese and answer in English and vice versa. But the Chinese content in DLPT is kinda equivalent to HSK4.

I served 5 years in the US Navy as an active reservist, while I was going to college. So I took advantage of their language pay bonus. Since I spoke Cantonese and Amoy and Mandarin, I took full advantage of them.

 

The last time I took the DLPT (retest), was in MEPS Spokane, Washington last year. The Mandarin version of DLPT5 is actually pretty hard. But HSK is a little different. It is strictly a Chinese test. Testing your ability to use the language rather than testing your ability to translate.

[angeia]

@DanWang

 

I see from your name you are most likely Asian, haha.

 

Anyway, I think they don't care about whether you look white or not, as long as your native language is English.  The reason they want foreigners so badly is because there are no foreign teachers in the program (or, at least, none that are native speakers of English) so they used to rely on me and the other British girl to correct everyone's English (even the teacher).  So basically, you'll be like the English moderator for the class.

 

I'm half Asian and they were just fine with me.

 

I thought HSK6 was pretty damn hard, the reading is intense.  HSK6 will be good to have if you want to get a job that involves speaking Chinese, but if you want to use it for a way to improve interpreting it might not be the best, since the standard HSK test is reading, writing, listening.  They have a spoken HSK test, which I hear is hard as fck.  You get one tone wrong and its 10 points off or something crazy like that.  It's intense (and maybe not worth it?).

 

HSK 6 will improve your vocabulary, though.  Learning to read all those hard articles will definitely up your knowledge of difficult words.