word order: 他给我打电话

[li3wei1]

I've got two grammar books that give the above sentence, or similar, and state that 给我 comes before the verb. On the other hand, I have vague memories of 他打电话给我, and it does seem to crop up if you google it. Is either one incorrect, or less correct, than the other?

[skylee]

Both are ok.

[skylee]

Both are ok.

[Lu]

It seems in Taiwan people say 他打电话给我 (shortened to 他打给我) while mainland uses 他给我打电话. But yes, both are fine.

[Glenn]

他打給我 makes me think someone's getting beaten. I guess context is king here.

[skylee]

他打給我 makes me think someone's getting beaten. I guess context is king here.

Word order. 給打 can indicate that someone is beaten, like 給我打（他）！ or 我給（他）打了。 Also take a look at the first example under verb 2 here.

Or more simply, just take away the 給, 他打我 does mean that someone is beaten.

[creamyhorror]

I'm used to 他打(电话)给我. It's a natural extension of [verb]给X, like 送给他.

I feel this post-verb 给 structure 打电话给他 marks a target (and is equivalent to English 'to'), and is different from the pre-verb 给 in 给他做X (which equates to English 'for').

他打給我 makes me think someone's getting beaten. I guess context is king here.

As skylee said, this can't quite be interpreted to mean "beating me", because the target of 打 'beat' should be the direct object (and 給 marks 我 as not being the object). Hence you'd need something like 他打我. Alternatively, move 給我 to before the verb and you'll have a passive structure 他給我打 meaning "he was beaten by me".

[crystal123]

他给我打电话 is better.

But sometimes 他打电话给我 is ok, like chat with someone, you can say it like that, people can understand.

[skylee]

Do note the different regional preferences mentioned in #4, 7 and 8.

[scykei]

I feel it plays a role in emphasis. Here's my literal translation to English.

(a) 他給我打電話 - He gave me a telephone call

(b) 他打電話給我 - He telephoned me

If you look at their translation in English, both are accepted and can be used interchangeably in most contexts. I think that (a) would sound more formal though.

[li3wei1]

Thanks for all those answers. To sum up, both are okay and mean the same thing, but there is some difference of opinion as to whether the difference is regional, formality, or nuance. I can live with that.

Alternatively, move 給我 to before the verb and you'll have a passive structure 他給我打 meaning "he was beaten by me".

This can't be right, can it? Otherwise 他给我打电话 would mean 'he was called by me'. Surely it means either 'he hit me' or 'he hit it to me'.

How would you say 'he made a telephone call for me' i.e. on my behalf?

And how would you say 'he beat you up for me'?

Thanks!

[creamyhorror]

This can't be right, can it? Otherwise 他给我打电话 would mean 'he was called by me'. Surely it means either 'he hit me' or 'he hit it to me'.

给 is a funny thing. It can operate in multiple ways. In this case it is equivalent to the passive marker [被]: 他被我打了. Here's an example from Yip & Rimmington:

-- 那个警察给流氓打伤了。 That policeman was wounded by hooligans.

Your example 他给我打电话 is not analogous to my sentence, which is

他给我打 = [object] 给 [subject] [transitive verb] = [subject] beat up [object]

If you force 他给我打电话 into the same model (by interpreting 给 as a passive marker), you get

他给我打电话 = [object] 给 [subject] [intransitive verb phrase]

but 打电话 is not an action that can be applied to an object. (That's why I label it intransitive, although my terminology likely isn't right.) The reason for that in turn is that 电话 is the object of the verb 打, and 打电话 can't accept a secondary/indirect object. The upshot is that you can't interpret 给 as a passive marker particle here. Thus the only likely interpretation is 给 as a target marker: "He gave me a call."

Sorry for the abstruse grammatical explanation. Another simple example if you're not convinced: “我给他骗了” generally always means "I got cheated/tricked by him". It's a clear example of 给 as a passive marker equivalent to 被.

How would you say 'he made a telephone call for me' i.e. on my behalf?

And how would you say 'he beat you up for me'?

他为我打了电话（给某某人）。

他为我打你。 / 他（是）为我把你给打了。

[lingo-ling]

In the wild, I hear the 他打電話給我 pattern more often.

This is in Taiwan, if that is relevant.

[Takeshi]

I had learnt 他給我打電話 in school too but heard 他打電話給我 a lot in actual speech (in Guangzhou).

I thought this was a Cantonese thing; the only acceptable Cantonese word order is 佢打電話畀我 where you put the "give" after the verb.

Well, I learnt something new.