How rude is 我靠?

[Demonic_Duck]

One of my students (around 16 years old, and generally not a bad kid) used this phrase a few times in class today when he got questions wrong. He told me it means something like "oh crap" (i.e. a mild expletive, but not overly rude). I checked with my Chinese co-workers, and got mixed reactions. Most of them didn't seem to think it was all that rude, but one seemed to think it was a closer equivalent to "fuck" than "crap". My dictionary lists "bosh" and "crap" as possible translations ("bosh" sounds old-fashioned to me, and more comical than rude).

Just how bad is this word? How should I react if a student uses this phrase in one of my classes again?

[anonymoose]

Just ignore your student. Most students say it. If you start trying to discipline your students for that kind of thing, you'll just be digging a hole for yourself, whereby you'll either have to give up and lose credibility (face) or you'll spend your whole time telling them off for all kinds of trivial things, and they probably won't take you seriously anyway.

As for how rude it is, well, you've already got a general consensus from your colleagues. As I understand it, it is just a disguised way of saying 操, so whether you think it is rude or not depends on how rude you think 操 is, and how much you think the disguised pronunciation tempers its potency.

[Demonic_Duck]

Personally, I'm not bothered if students of that age occasionally use language of equivalent strength to "oh, crap" in the classroom, either in English or in Chinese, but if they used something stronger I'd feel I ought to be more heavy handed. I use bad language a fair amount myself, and I'm not offended by it, it's just a matter of whether it's appropriate for a classroom setting.

[anonymoose]

Maybe apart from asking your colleagues what they think of 靠, you should ask them what they'd do if they heard a student using it. My guess is that most of them wouldn't do anything. As a foreign teacher, you'll just make yourself look stupid if you go after students for things which even the Chinese teachers don't care about.

Don't get me wrong - I'm all for appropriate discipline and guidance in schools. But frankly, if you need to come here first to ask about the rudeness of 靠, it seems as though you are just looking for an opportunity to wield your authority.

[Tiana]

I'm inclined to agree with anonymouse. Take care not to be too serious on something in a foreign language which you still need to ask to understand. It's just like having as a tattoo on your body some Chinese characters the meaning of which you have to depend on others to understand.

[imron]

I've always seen it as basically the equivalent of frick/frig/feck etc.

[Kenny同志]

No doubt the phrase is rude. While I usually wouldn't be offended by it in informal settings, it's unacceptable to me in the classroom.

I never use it.

[Demonic_Duck]

Don't get me wrong - I'm all for appropriate discipline and guidance in schools. But frankly, if you need to come here first to ask about the rudeness of 靠, it seems as though you are just looking for an opportunity to wield your authority.

Wow, judgemental much? To be honest, I'd rather not have to wield my authority - I generally like this kid and this class, the last thing I want to do is make myself look like a tyrant. It was only because of the shocked reaction of one of my colleagues, thinking it was closer to "fuck" than "crap", that I even felt the need to ask.

[count_zero]

> I've always seen it as basically the equivalent of frick/frig/feck etc.

That's basically what I thought, though to be pedantic, "frig" is a very old word that does actually refer to copulation whereas "frig" and "feck" are minced oaths.

[gato]

Yes, basically cao = kao here.

[skylee]

I tend to agree with kenny2006woo.

[wilber]

People who use it usually when they get very angry ,in English "danm", but sometimes its just a catch phrase.

[daofeishi]

"No, miss, that's not what I said at all. This is what I meant."

[jasoninchina]

A few months ago, one of my long time students cursed in Hainanese. It was really off-putting to me and I was about to crack her back to Sunday, but then I noticed that none of the other students batted an eye. So I didn't say anything. A few weeks after that I heard the same girl say the same thing in front of parents. None of them thought anything of it either. It feels so strange to me but that's just how it is I suppose.

I usually run a tight ship in my school, so I totally agree with your desire to understand the word, but also consider the reaction that it's getting. I know that's not the greatest answer, but sometimes that's what we gotta do as foreigners living in someone else's culture.

[imron]

The easy way to fix this problem is to only allow them to speak English in class (see paragraph 4 of this post for one way to do this).

[roddy]

Colleague of mine once taught his students that "fiddlesticks" was just about the worst thing you could say in English. Completely unethical, but somewhat amusing. Wonder if he ever told them the truth.

But frankly, if you need to come here first to ask about the rudeness of 靠, it seems as though you are just looking for an opportunity to wield your authority.

Yes, such opportunities are so rare in a classroom they have to be sought out.

[count_zero]

Swearing seems to be a divisive issue in modern China.

I know a 20-something Chinese girl who told me she never under any circumstances uses "niubi" because it's so rude. But I know people who litter their speech with that like it's not even a cuss.

I've heard Chinese grannies drop the m-bomb with nary a hesitation but also witnessed old women try to stymie street arguments that got a bit too vernacular for their fancy.

[skylee]

This discussion has reminded me of an incident happened over a decade ago. That day I had to be in a sort of tribunal that dealt with public housing matters. A public housing tenant was appealing for his rights to retain a flat or to be relocated to another flat. Serious stuff, as it would affect whether or not he would have a place to live. This man talked most vehemently with swear words in every sentence he said. Then the chair of the tribunal stopped him and told him that the hearing would be stopped if he kept swearing. The chair then asked him to go on. And the man simply could not speak fluently without putting in swear words. I have forgotten what the ruling was.

My own conclusion was that people have to be taught to behave, either at home or in school. Otherwise it will be difficult for them to behave properly.

[anonymoose]

Sorry I didn't express myself well in my previous post. I'm just saying that if you, as a foreigner, admonish your students for saying things in Chinese, particularly when you don't even have a full understanding of what they are saying, you will likely come across as pretentious.

I think imron probably has the best solution.

[siledouyaoai]

I hear it a lot, and it doesn't seem to me to be as rude as 我操. I heard it came in from Cantonese, so maybe it doesn't sound so dirty when said in mandarin. The reason I say that I often hear people saying 哇塞, despite it meaning 我操 in Hokkein. I even remember it being said on 家有儿女. Whether that is true for 我靠 I don't know, just a theory.