Captivity in a Chinese prison (detention center)

[Angelina]

I swear I saw the same story somewhere else, not prisontalk, maybe reddit. Some things were also copy-pasted. That's why I told him to move on and tell us about his life now instead.

One of my great-grandparents died as a POW leaving his refugee family behind, I feel nothing but compassion for other people who have suffered.

[xiaoxiaocao]

This was in the news in New Zealand not long ago, guy did 4 years in a Chinese prison -

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/asia/8452321/Kiwi-describes-four-year-Chinese-jail-nightmare

[Living-In-ChinaDotAsia]

Had an American teacher and Swiss friend in Shenzhen. They're above their 40s old but prefers to "migrate" to China if they can as they feel actually more free in China and enjoys life there.

Their common comments were - living in a "systematically advanced" country actually has it's downsides, like higher taxes of which they don't have much say on how government spends it only to find government building useless monuments or too much laws left and right that it becomes limiting.

China maybe not as much as an activist in human rights as most foreigners think, but surprisingly, even some of its locals understands that's its stringent rules is there because it has to deal with managing a very big population living in a fast growing economy.

Can't help but feel sorry for those who were incarcerated in China or whichever country. From the way life in prison there was described, it does sound lousy but there are even worse in other countries. Further, prison life was never meant to be "pleasant".

[Lu]

Their common comments were - living in a "systematically advanced" country actually has its downsides, like higher taxes of which they don't have much say on how government spends it only to find government building useless monuments or too much laws left and right that it becomes limiting.

And so they come to China, where they do have lots of influence on how taxes are spent and the government wouldn't think of just building expensive offices for themselves. And there are few laws, which makes everything easier to manage.

Wait, where is this 'China' they moved to?

[Ruben von Zwack]

I just heard an amusing variation on that theme.

Someone said to me just the other day: "Europe is so ridiculous. The water here is so clean, one could drink from the toilet bowl. And that's just an example of our decadent ways and how the government spends our tax money. And I cannot influence it. I really want to live in Thailand. It's not so decadent there. The whole culture there is just more spiritual/etc/blabla"

[alreadytaken]

Kobo-Daishi

Not suprising you questioned me, since you are not familar with the Chinese legal/detention system.

I was put in a detention cener(看守所) not a prison(监狱), suspects before trail and appeal all in detention, tried and convicted crimianls sent to prison. BTW death row inmates are also kept at the "dention house", for "temporary detention" may sounds horrible but that's the way it is.

Murderer is on appeal, therefore not sent to a prison yet. Still in dentention. 3 years because law has no time limit(even if they do), really fcked up, not only the accused the prosecution could also appeal, case goes on forever.

Didn't I mention no seperation of criminals, at least at my dention place, no matter minor or major offense, all detainees are kept in the same cell. Don't say how US or European prisons are like, this is China and nothing play by the rules.

Simple terms, I was detantied because I mailed a BB-gun. Am I kidding? Unbelievable? Impossible? Yeah right, but this is China, even this is considered a "crime", (the charge was "smuggling") very fcked up, and I don't want to go over the case details, I suffered unjustice but enough is enough.

Angelina adrianlondon

I wrote that article.

xiaoxiaocao

Thx, I've read his story, interesting is "Dongguan prison" at least I've been told is considered a "model prison" with "good condition" where a lot of foreigners are housed, even from such a place he suffered harrassment shows how terrible China's human rights records are.

[alreadytaken]

For the nationality issue, this is not a loophole in my story. There are many ways for a "dual nationality". E.g Hong Kong Taiwan and Macau citizens has special status and if you don't report and cancel your household registration in China, you are still eligible for "dual citizenship" in theory, the fact you hold a foreign passport does not revoke your nationality immidiately. This is another legal issue, if you would are interested do some research about it, this is not significant to my story.

xiaoxiaocao

Found this.

Chinese propaganda of "how well he was treated when interviewed in prison" (In Chinese)

http://news.sohu.com...343370507.shtml

[Ruben von Zwack]

Thanks for coming back to clarify!

You see, when you say you don't want to talk about what you did, one quickly assumes it must have been something to be ashamed of - drugs or pornography related maybe, at least that's how my mind works.

I think if someone in the future asks you, you should probably tell the truth straight away. It's better than when your friends minds start wandering and probably imagine the weirdest things.

Now with the background info, I agree that your treatment was unfair and too rough.

The funny thing is, it seemed appropriate if you had done something immoral (at least in my mind, just being honest). But when your crime was that you mailed some shit, then of course the treatment was absolutely wrong.

How long have you been home now?

[BrandeX]

I have to wonder how your experience would have been different if you were: White, on a foreign passport, and didn't speak Chinese. (as compared with the story of the australian who was actually incarcerated, not just in detention)

[alreadytaken]

Fact is I was never punished when my stuff was consficated in 2011, customs alreadly identified it as a "toy". Only after a year, customs decided to crackdown on "guns, kives, explosives" before the 18th National Congress, someone dug my files up and decided to press charges. I heard that because I have no deep ties in China, not a permanent resident (enter and exit China about 10 times a year) became the patsy or scapegoat. If I am white or just a tourist, probably isn't worth the hazzel. But if I do get detained, no big difference except I would be kept at Shenzhen No.3 detention center, where I was told a lot of foreign inmates are held. If I am convicted, probably go to Donguan prison (same place as the Newzelander) or Shaoguan Prison for foreign inmates and it was lucky I did not.

[alreadytaken]

Apart from the drug dealers, thieves, bullies and murderer, I beleived there are some that suffers from grevious injustice, because of China's improper legal system, innocent people may be put in jail.

A business owner lended money to a friend to start his own business, friend somehow committed fraud. Owner was charged with "illegal fund raising". He claimed he was not a conspirator, no knowelege of what his friend did, only thing he did was to lend money. He was a well educated man and has an MBA degree in marketing.

A young man of 24, detained for jointly liable for his company's act. It was his first job after graduation, his company' was involved in some kind of dispute, the whole department including secretaries were jailed. He said his case is very complicated and would probably last very long, until they have investigated every employee in his firm. He has been in detention for 6 months. His charge sheet was labelled "theft" (white collar theft)

A manager of an IT company, also liable for his company's actions. His company was responsible to deliever a kind of electronic product for the government, the company suffers from financial crisis, they failed to deliver. His company was charged with fraud and the manager was jointly liable. He cliamed he was only involved in a "civil case" not a criminal case. He was been detained for a year now and the investigation is still going on.

A 40 year old man charged with "manslaughter". He denined of killing anyone. The case occured 20 years ago, when he was just a young man, he was beaten up on the streets by a gang. He was hospitalised but he told his friends, they went to beat them up and one of his friends pulled a gun and killed a man. His friend was arrested and charged with murder. Afraid of getting involved, he fled his city. For 20 years, he kept a low profile life, married and started a family. 20 years later he identified was arrested. He claimed he was not even at the crime scene and did not instruct his friends to beat and kill anyone, didn't even know his friend has a gun. The only evidence was based on what his friend told the police. He was charged with murder, were changed to "conspiracy for murder" due to insufficent evidence, lastly to manslaughter. His friend claimed he was the mastermind but he claimed his innocent. He has been locked up for 2 years now, still awaiting trail, his indictment has been changed several times and been transfered to different institutions over the years, but the prosecution would not drop the case. He said he shall not appeal if he is sentenced less than 3 years, as he has alreadly served 2 years in dentention (but very unlikely for manslaughter). However he claimed he is innocent and did not kill anyone. Very complicated case.

A Hong Kong man arrested for bringing 4 ipads into China, police claimed he is part of a smuggling ring. Even if it is, very petty crime, but he is jailed with no exception. In detention for 2 months.

When I was released these people are still in jail, I don't know what happened to them now. Some of them has lawyers and some do not but no one receives bail.

[roddy]

So, was that it?

[liuzhou]

There are many ways for a "dual nationality". E.g Hong Kong Taiwan and Macau citizens has special status and if you don't report and cancel your household registration in China, you are still eligible for "dual citizenship" in theory, the fact you hold a foreign passport does not revoke your nationality immidiately.

Wrong.

HK, Macao and Taiwan are indeed special cases. They are, at least in Beijing's eyes, part of China and therefore there is no "dual nationality" in those cases.

As to other cases, the fact that you hold a foreign passport certainly revokes your nationality immediately. The law couldn't be clearer. "Dual nationality" is explicitly banned.

That some people hide the fact of their new passports is irrelevant. They are acting illegally under Chinese law.

[fanglu]

That some people hide the fact of their new passports is irrelevant. They are acting illegally under Chinese law.

Yes, but so is the Chinese government by not treating them as foreign nationals travelling on an invalid passport. Instead the government treats them (when it suits) as Chinese citizens travelling on a valid passport, in direct contravention of the Chinese nationality law.

[liuzhou]

How many wrongs make a right?

My point is still 100% valid. The OP said that dual nationality is legal - it isn't.

[fanglu]

An interesting article on the same topic. Link