american programs in China

[venture160]

I am an american student from Boston, I am in my second year of mandarin studies, and last fall I studied in Jinan at Shandong University for a semester. I am planning on returning to China starting this summer for 14 months, and I would like to spend that time studying in different locales. Everyone here seems to promote the cheap domestic chinese programs, but what about the American ones,?

compared to large class sizes you have classes under 5 people, and more individual attention. I am looking at the CET Harbin Program for the Summer, and then either the Hamilton University ACC program in Beijing, the IUP program in Beijing or the Middlebury program in Hangzhou for the fall and spring. Are these programs really better? I have the ability to provide for the funding, so cost really isn't an issue, its just a matter of getting THE BEST education in Chinese language possible. Thanks for the responses in advance.

Jim

[Craig]

Princeton http://www.princeton.edu/~pib/

Middlebury http://web.middlebury.edu/msa/schools/china/

and Harvard http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~clp/HBA/index.html

are considered the best programs from US schools as far as i have heard. As to whether it is worth the money or not i know a few who have gone on the Harvard and Princeton ones and have gotten conflicting reports. Some will tell you it definitely is, it is a school that knows exactly how to teacher westerners of above average ability (aka average Harvard, princeton and Middlebury students) and it is intense training.

Others have told me they felt they were paying for the name on the certificate, and she learned as much in the 9 week summer program at Middlebury for much less money than she learned in a semester with the program. If you are going for cultural immersion which i see as a key benefit of studying in china, there is definitely something to be said for studying at a Chinese host institute as from everything i've been told they are run very differently and the other schools westernize their methods. Personally i don't think it is worthy the extra money especially if you already have transcript credits from an ivy school, as it looks great on a resume but i don't see the amount you learn being radically different.

[marcopolo79]

You have to understand that in general, what you get when you participate in an American organized program, is a lot of unessential extras that are marketed to pampered American university students so as to minimize the material/cultural shock of studying in a developing country. In most instances, the materials and teachers employed by these programs are the same as those employed by the host Chinese institution, with the class hours being roughly equivalent. Class sizes are much larger in the normal Chinese programs though, but with the money you'd save you could easily hire a different tutor for each day of the week, if you so desired. Additionally, many of the American programs rely on a brand image and gimmicky "all chinese contracts" to justify their exhorbitant prices, but there really is no shortcut to learning Chinese other than putting in the time. Nothing is more sad than watching a group of American students, living in seperate quarters away from other exchange students and attending their own classes being forced to communicate in Chinese with eachother, they'd be much better off with trying to talk to their Korean and Japanese classmates in the regular program.

If you have previously been to China and feel you can navigate the usual bureacratic nonsense and be responsible for your own life (which is really not at all that difficult), I personally feel that you would be much better off enrolling directly in a Chinese administered program. Both the Chinese administered programs and the American ones are run primarily as revenue enhancing programs for their host institution, the difference is that the American programs include a host of extraneous and superfluous services with overly high material standards, which in my opinion are neither necessary nor even warranted.

When I was university I had to attend a university sponsored program in order to obtain credit for school, so I participated in CIEE's Nanjing program, which was billed as one of their most intensive. The rates they charged were so high that they felt obligated to return part of the money each month to us in the form of a stipend, additional resources were spent on pointless field trips, several expensive dinners, providing for an office staff and program corrdinator to handle basic administrative tasks that could have been dealt with through the university, a general fund in case we wanted to have yet another group banquet, etc. Additionally we were obligated to stay in the next to top grade of rooms in the foreign student's dorm, further adding to the expense. Most importantly, I learned more from passive absorbtion from being in China for three months than I did in class, which was poorly organizeed and taught. After I graduated, I went to work and live in Harbin, and eventually enrolled at 黑龍江大學, I initially wanted to enroll at 哈爾濱工業大學, but since CET had signed an agreement with the school, any American or Canadian students enrolling in the language program there would be obligated to participate in the CET at the going CET rates, but after being assured that the program at HeiDa was no better or worse, I enrolled there and was quite happy with the classes, the administration, and the agreeable price.

You gain very little for paying as much as 10 times the normal rate by participating in these programs, if you have the money and want to do it, then by all means go ahead, but personally I feel that your money would be best spent by enrolling directly, and using the cash saved to leading a full a life as possible in China: go out a lot, take up several hobbies, travel to your heart's content; the less you rely on some program to instruct you and the more you directly engage the country will enable you to learn Chinese both better and more qiuckly.

[taobenli]

I did ACC's program in Fall 2000. I learned A LOT, if I had stayed just a few more months I would have been completely fluent (I couldn't stay because of the cost). So I didn't feel like I was just paying for the name. However, it was a little sad and lonely at times...there was so much homework every night that there wasn't time to explore Beijing as much as I would have liked to. Still, when I left the program and traveled around on my own, I felt fully able to function in any situation in China.

It's not quite true that we were isolated from all the other exchange students at CUEB. There were many Japanese students who lived on the same floor, and I made friends with several of them. It's just that your classes are filled with other American students. The quality of instruction is great: one hour lecture, one hour small-group discussion/drill, one hour conversation practice (with teacher and one other student), and one hour of one-on-one with the teacher.

Just my two cents...

[keskt]

Is anyone familar with IES? Their program is at Beijing Foriegn Studies University. I pretty much need to go through a "middleman" because I need the credit for my home college, and also this way I can take courses in addition to Chinese language.

[TSkillet]

I'd been told the Nanjing University/Johns Hopkins program was the best American program in China. But you also need to start with a high level of fluency to get in.

[Tsunku]

Been meaning to respond to this for awhile now ...

When I first came to China (over 2 years ago now), I was with an American program, SIT (School for International Training). Some American colleges, as others have pointed out, will only give credit for these types of programs, which are accredited through the American system. Showing up and taking Chinese classes at a local school is all fine and good, but sometimes college students have to worry about things like credits and graduation and stuff ;)

My experience with SIT was very positive. The program is expensive, but almost everyone on it got hefty scholarships from the Fullbright foundation, so the cost didn't end up being that much more than a semester at college would have been, and it included everything -- flights, accomodation, meals, travel, etc.

The SIT program takes students to Kunming, the city where I now live. Students study Chinese, participate in homestays, and also take classes (held in English) on Social issues, religion, and minority studies. The program takes a very anthropological approach, and doesn't just focus on language study, although students can choose an intensive language option if they like. One of the best parts of SIT were the amazing opportunities to travel and see things I'm sure I wouldn't have had a chance to see if I had went on my own. The directors have an amazing amount of contacts, and can basically put you in touch with people who are knowledgeable in just about any field.

I really don't regret doing the SIT program, and I feel like it was money well spent. Maybe some programs are just scams, where they take a lot of money and then basically give you the same experience as the foreign exchange students who are paying the local rates, but not all are like that. If you want to check out SIT, their website is www.sit.edu. Now that I live in Kunming regularly, I'm in touch with the new students who come every semester, and the directors are good friends of mine, so feel free to be in touch. SIT gets a thumbs up from me.