How to allocate my time in the first few months of independent Chinese study

[andyfastow]

Right now I am studying Chinese independently as if it were my full time job. I've been at it for just over a month now and can probably continue on a full time basis for another 2-4 months this year (though not necessarily consecutive months). The rest of the year I can study part-time, although towards the end of the year my time available for Chinese will really start to become limited.

 

About halfway through March I started tracking how I spend my study time. Based on three and a half weeks worth of this data, I've discovered the following:

 

20% of my time is spent with tutors or language exchange partners (in the case of LE I obviously don't count the English half towards this time)

 

20% of my time is spent reading or watching stuff in English that is about learning Chinese (this forum, blogs like Hacking Chinese, YouTube channels like Steve Kauffman, Moses McCormick, Luca, etc)

 

20% of my time is spent snipping audio from tutoring sessions, making Anki decks, and doing homework from tutors (mostly written translations in pinyin of simple sentences from English to Chinese and constructing sentences that include certain required words).

 

15% of my time is spent drilling vocab with SRS software

 

15% of my time is spent doing listening drills (Chinese pod, audio from tutors/LE, tone recognition drills because I still stuck at this, etc)

 

10% of my time is spent doing the FSI course.

 

My goal is to reach a basic conversational level by the end of the year (or earlier if possible). I don't really care about reading and writing for now.

 

My current level is still very low. I can make it through some short and simple conversations on a very narrow range of topics with tutors when they speak slowly and frequently repeat things for me. Out "in the wild" here on the mean streets of Taipei I can really only make it through the most simple and predictable of daily interactions. (No I don't have a membership card, I'd like a bag for this please, etc). Anything beyond the most predictable of interactions trip me up very quickly.

 

What I'm wondering is, given my goals and current level, how should I best allocate my time at this point? Looking at the percentages above, does anything there seem too low or too high to you? Anything that is missing completely and should be there? I have never learned a foreign language before and I find myself constantly second guessing my approach. All suggestions are appreciated, thank you.

[icebear]

A thorough read of this post is worth your time when considering what you might add to your study agenda. Not sure if that level of tutoring is feasible on your budget, but it would probably be the most time-efficient way of improving your Chinese. Note that a great deal of discipline is needed to ensure an almost constant Chinese environment.

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/43939-independent-chinese-study-review/

 

Over time posts like the above and my own experiences have led me to believe that its better to overwhelm yourself and see what sticks rather than get lost in the details of a tricky word/grammar point. With that in mind, I'd suggest limiting yourself to no more than 1 hour of English per day (written, spoken, etc) and ensuring the remainder of your day is in Chinese near your level - be it with language exchange, multiple textbook series, audio/video, or otherwise.

 

I don't think time spent reading in English about study techniques should count towards your Chinese study time, either.

 

Also, 20% on administrative tasks related to Chinese seems high - is there something better you could be doing than all that audio snipping, deck management, etc? Why not use Pleco for automated Chinese decks? Is snipping audio providing that much utility later on, or would just listen through for a second or third time to the whole track be as useful? My feeling is that many Chinese learners gradually habitualize practices that are seen as "good", such as extensive SRS management, stories for each character learned, archive all old materials studied in some systematic fashion, etc - although eventually those seemingly good habits become a massive task unto themselves, and probably counterproductive. That isn't to say you should drop all these, but remain vigilant about reducing their cut into your real study time.

[andyfastow]

Thanks for your reply Icebear. I've become concerned about the amount of time I'm spending snipping audio too, but I figure there is at least some (maybe quite a bit of) utility in that as I'm listening to the recordings and writing out the pinyin for the card I want to make. I've recently started using pleco for single words and anki for phrases only as this speeds up the process a bit. I've also lumped my Chinese homework in to that category but I think I'll start tracking that seperately so I can get a more accurate idea of where my time is going. They really are quite different activities.

 

I've read Tamu's thread all the way through a couple of times and it inspired me to crank up my tutoring time to where it is now. I don't really want to pay for much more tutoring but I've met a couple of LE partners who are willing to spend most or sometimes even all our time on Chinese (with explanations in English). I'm trying to move more towards LE partners with a low level in English because it keeps the conversation from just going back to English to explain things I don't understand and I also find the lower someone's English ability the less they are able to understand me, which I think is probably a better gauge of how my pronunciation is. The two professional tutors I spend the most time with can understand way more of what I say than a typical person I might meet randomly in Taipei.

 

I think that in a nutshell, this is the issue I'm really grappling with right now:

 

Over time posts like the above and my own experiences have led me to believe that its better to overwhelm yourself and see what sticks rather than get lost in the details of a tricky word/grammar point.

 

 

 

I don't know that I'm getting lost in the details of words or grammar points, and I have noticed a strong improvement on vocab that I flashcard so I'm definitely getting something out of my non-tutoring activities. I'm just not sure I'm getting more out of it then the tutoring and LE. I really don't know. Either way though, I think you are right about cutting down English significantly. I've been pretty undisciplined about that so far.

[Adam_CLO]

When starting to learn Chinese, I would put more time towards options that focus on listening. Chinese is so different from European languages that your brain needs more time to adjust to the sounds and patterns. Ideally you want input that is slightly above your current level. If it's too difficult, your brain shuts off.

 

Since you have the luxury of being in Taiwan, I would make use of that. When I first got here, I spent a lot of time on CDs and programs that taught me words and phrases that I never used or heard being used outdoors. So I later changed my approach to listening to what others around me were saying. Most of it was gibberish to me, but occasionally I would hear a word or expression get used again and again. I'd then ask someone what that meant. This way I started to learn frequently used expressions first, then built off that.

 

Over time I found myself in situations where someone would ask me something and I'd instinctively reply with a phrase that I didn't even knew I knew but was correct, since my brain had heard it used so often.

 

Hope that helps.

[icebear]

I don't know that I'm getting lost in the details of words or grammar points, and I have noticed a strong improvement on vocab that I flashcard so I'm definitely getting something out of my non-tutoring activities. I'm just not sure I'm getting more out of it then the tutoring and LE. I really don't know.

 

 Hi andy - I certainly don't mean to diminish study time not spent with a tutor. SRS is useful, as is cracking open a book and going through material on your own. My comment was more in reference to the OCD phenomenon that captures many Chinese learners at some point (myself included!) were X minutes are spent managing a gargantuan Anki deck, snipping audio files to no end, or simple discussing best learning techniques on forums or blogs. Of course each of those activities can be useful, but need to be clearly seen as a supplement to study rather than study themselves. 

 

Just to throw out a hypothetical - I'd guess that for every X minutes spent on SRS, you should try to spend at least 10x with a tutor and/or simply reading a text book. What most success stories here reveal is that its those that really embrace the mundane or difficult slog through "real studying" that go far, while many get hung up on some artificial measure of progress (Anki stats). I myself have been there.

 

Either way though, I think you are right about cutting down English significantly. I've been pretty undisciplined about that so far.

 

Pretty much all of us are guilty of it. If you're studying full time, I'd seriously consider how worthwhile it is to spend any time on English-language websites, etc. All of this is a big distraction in the end from a priceless experience - a fully immersive environment that most students cannot or will not submit themselves to. You might think about doing your budgeting backwards - deciding how much time you are allowed to read/speak/listen in English per day and controlling it strictly.

[hedwards]

Since you're in Taipei, I'd recommend focusing more on speaking/listening than reading/writing. I wouldn't completely neglect the reading and writing, but I'd focus more on the auditory aspect of the language because getting written materials is a lot easier outside of Chinese speaking areas.

 

The HSK list is probably a good place to start as far as vocab goes. AFAICT, the highest level that test goes is roughly equivalent to a CEFR of B2. But, the vocab you learn is likely to be high value, especially at the lower levels.

 

SRS is great, but I'd recommend using that mainly to fill in moments when you're waiting for things. I'm not sure about the RoC, but I remember in the PRC that I spent a lot of time waiting for things as the schedules were quite flexible.

 

I'd recommend getting a good reference book on Grammar and picking one or two points out to work on at a given time. Work on them when you speak to people and when you're comfortable with them, go back to the book and find some more. The best analogy I've seen is that you start on a small ice berg where you can easily slip off if you move much in any direction. But, as you learn more words and more grammar, the ice berg gets larger and less slippery and it takes more effort to fall off.

 

I'd also recommend ditching the whole notion of "studying." Conduct as much of your business in Chinese as you can, and you should find that it gradually comes.