Loan words you don't like in Chinese

[tooironic]

逻辑、幽默、浪漫

 

There are those who would argue that this is evidence that the Chinese are illogical, have no sense of humour and don't know what romance is. Complete rubbish IMO but I've heard it argued.

 

Well, it's all very interesting, but not exactly what I was going for in this topic.

[MPhillips]

Of course there's 風流 for romantic & 滑稽 for humorous.

[Lu]

And 道理 for many uses of logic. I learned 滑稽 rather late and when I did I wondered what Chinese needed 幽默 for if they already have a word for it.

Kenny: thanks for that information, that's surprising, 是时候 sounds so translated to me.

[Demonic_Duck]

What does the “是” in “是时候” stand for, though? Is it “to be”, or is it “correct”?

[tooironic]

@Lu, MPhillips Indeed...

 

Logic -> 逻辑 -> but what about 道理?

Humour -> 幽默 -> but what about 滑稽?

Romantic -> 浪漫 -> but what about 风流?

 

Those are some interesting terms that hadn't occurred to me. I'll have to think on this.

[Kenny同志]

 

 

Duck:

In 是時候, 是 means be and 時候 the time.

 

Lu:

You are welcome.

 

是時候 is rarely used as a stand-alone expression though. Usually we say （現在）是時候了, 現在（還）不是時候, or 現在正是時候.

[anonymoose]

I was told that 幽默 means humorous, as in someone who (deliberately) tells funny jokes, whereas 滑稽 mean more like comical, as in someone who (possibly unintentially) acts in a funny way. Or to put it another way, you laught with someone who is 幽默, whereas you laugh at someone who is 滑稽.

[ilande]

@tooironic

 

I don't see how it makes sense to judge how logical chinese is by looking at loan words. The meaning of the individual characters in most lone words are of little interest, and only the phonetical component is used. Sure 浪漫 sounds nothing like "roman" (if you pronounce it in standard Chinese), but you can't look at the characters and conclude what the Chinese think roman means.

[Sydney Matt]

On the topic of 猫 for modem, after I first arrived in China, I wanted to buy a modem, but had no idea of the word. So, I looked it up in the dictionary and found 调制解调器, thinking "what a long word for modem", as I said it in a running out of breath way to the sales assistant, who chuckled. Much later, I learnt "猫"! Guess it was as if I were to say "modulator demodulator" instead of simply "modem" in English. So perhaps a loan word I do like. But 冰淇淋 has to be one of the messiest, kind-of-but-not-totally loan words.

[陳德聰]

Drives me nuts when people try to present the use of loan words as evidence of prior lack of concept. Aristotle didn't speak English, but we don't go around saying English speakers didn't know what logic was before we "borrowed" (I'm aware we inherited it) the word from Greek...

[Guest realmayo]

I wouldn't discount it so easily. I agree, you shouldn't infer too much from the absence of a certain concept-word. English doesn't do schadenfreude, but English speakers certainly do.

 

What's more interesting is that a need to introduce such a concept-word was felt at a point in time.

 

So: it seems reasonable to think: the type of scientific method/deductive logic/education that Chinese people wanted to import from the West: that was new and needed new vocabulary e.g. 'logic'. The word that was previously used was too bound up with the pre-existing scientific methods, namely, memorise lots of Tang poems.

 

So it's interesting that there was no need felt to put a word to a concept.

 

Romance: in modern times it means soppy movies and roses and heart-shaped balloons, shared by couples who like each other, voluntarily. Not much place for that in China 40 years ago. The concept existed but its practise, not so much. Hence the lack of word?

[li3wei1]

could 大厦and the Russian dacha be related? Not sure which came first

[MPhillips]

For the original meaning of "romance" (a tale of knightly chivalry & derring-do), I think 傳奇 works well.

[Kenny同志]

liwei wrote: could 大厦and the Russian dacha be related?

 

I am afraid not. Take a look at this: http://www.cncorpus.org/ACindex.aspx

[li3wei1]

liwei wrote: could 大厦and the Russian dacha be related?

 

I am afraid not. Take a look at this: http://www.cncorpus.org/ACindex.aspx

 

Okay, so it's been around in Chinese for a while. but could the Russians have got it from the Chinese? 大厦 isn't a nonsense word like 麦克风, so it didn't look like something that had come into Chinese as a loan word.

[Kenny同志]

but could the Russians have got it from the Chinese? 

 

I think it's likely.

 

大厦 isn't a nonsense word like 麦克风, so it didn't look like something that had come into Chinese as a loan word.

 

I concur. : )

[Demonic_Duck]

Wiki has "dacha" as coming from "dat'", meaning to give. Also, dachas generally aren't very 大.