洋人丹 Posted February 26, 2015 at 05:43 AM Report Share Posted February 26, 2015 at 05:43 AM @moon24 I don't want to scare you, but I'm going to be honest. One year is absolutely not enough for a masters if you are taking classes in Chinese. I've seen many people who try to do a masters with minimal language training and they end up frustrated, fall behind, can't understand a lot, and have trouble writing papers. I'm not saying it's not possible, but I would take some time to think about it. If you go in with minimal language training and can barely understand your classes or are really struggling trying to do homework, understand material etc., what benefits does the masters give you? At the same time, I've known people who have HSK 6 and still have trouble (proving that test grades aren't everything). I'll be honest about myself. I want to do a masters in classical literature. I did years of language study, have started learning Japanese and French (both useful in the research I want to do), and read a ton of pre-modern literature, stuff on literary history and the history of literary criticism. I still feel like I'm not prepared. I have an intense fear of being unprepared/failure, so some of what I'm saying above is probably affected by that. Things might be very different for you. I'm sorry if I've scared you with the above. Someone else might be able to give you a better idea of things, but in my opinion one year of language study is not near enough for a masters (in any language). Again, don't only listen to my opinion. Other people here can give much better advice than me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moon24 Posted February 26, 2015 at 04:59 PM Report Share Posted February 26, 2015 at 04:59 PM @洋人丹 thank your for your answer, what you say it's really helpful right now because maybe I could apply only for a language course and then see if I feel prepared for a master, so I will definitely think about everything. Or maybe I could look for a master taught in english but I read those are more expensive, anyway thanks for your honest answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourdgrace Posted February 27, 2015 at 03:29 PM Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 at 03:29 PM how do i fill the duration of major study? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shuoshuo Posted February 28, 2015 at 05:59 AM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 05:59 AM @moon24 - you can apply for masters with 1 year Chinese language preparation. 1 year is enough to be at the same level as someone who has learned Chinese for 2 years, as long as you work hard. That said, even those who have done 1, 2 or even 3 years of Chinese language will most likely struggle with any degree taught in Chinese. Just find good Chinese friends who will help you all the way, attend all your classes so the teachers will know that you are trying your best, and you will do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
英泰inte Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:24 AM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:24 AM @fourdgrace Set the date from early September to early July (that's what I did) if you're applying to a degree with the one year of Chinese, don't include the year of Chinese language study into your degree program. (for example: 09/2015- 7/2016 chinese study, then 09/2016 - 07/2019 astronomy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fourdgrace Posted February 28, 2015 at 07:05 AM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 07:05 AM @英泰inte but if I want to take 2 years of Chinese, it should be 09/2015-07/2017 right? and then degree is 09/2017-07/2020. and i'm confused to where I should send in my application? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
洋人丹 Posted February 28, 2015 at 11:53 AM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 11:53 AM @shuoshuo That's why I wouldn't suggest it personally. If you are struggling throughout the whole degree, it doesn't seem like you are going to get much out of it, or at least not near as much as you would get doing it in your own language (or language you are comfortable learning in). If you struggle with the material, can't understand lectures, and you can barely write a coherent thesis, what did you get out of your masters? I'm not trying to sound like I'm attacking what you said, but I'm just very hesitant to recommend anyone go from no Chinese to doing a masters instructed in the language in 1-2 years. @fourdgrace You are correct on the times and dates. Where you send your application completely depends on how you want to apply. You can apply either 1) through the Chinese embassy in your home country (if you are European this might be different? Someone else might be able to clarify). 2) directly to the school(s) that you want to go to (assuming you have them). BUT if you apply to the school, make sure you look on their website about how to do it, because many schools go about the process differently. ALSO if you are set on a certain school, ask about admissions letters/pre-admissions letters. These will help your chances of getting into the school you want. Some schools will reply to e-mails, but for many, calling them is the only way to get an answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted February 28, 2015 at 03:05 PM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 03:05 PM My program is taught mostly in Chinese, alongside Chinese grad students. I agree with 洋人丹, be careful when applying. The only problem I had was writing papers. This was a serious problem though. Let's just say that I had many 缺考 during my first year because I told some of my professors that my Chinese was not good enough to write a paper. It's ok, I took the same courses again. Even at the very beginning I did not have any problems doing simple stuff like preparing PPTs (they are called PPTs in China). If you are not strong enough, you might want to give up. Don't forget that you have to be ready to give up if it turns out to be too difficult. If you think it would be too embarrassing for you to drop out once you start, I suggest you not to apply in the first place. There are many positive things. There is no way I would have learned this much Chinese in this little time on my own. The program has also helped me a lot in my research, I have had some great ideas, met amazing people. I have learned the kind of Chinese I wanted to learn, I like the Chinese my professors and classmates speak more than that spoken by a typical Chinese language teacher. They know how to explain everything to me as well. I might not have been involved in as many research projects as other master's degree students have been, but I don't think I have wasted my time. About programs taught in English, before you apply, think about it: why is this program in English? I have met some people studying things like optical engineering and I swear it looks like all the people there speak reasonable English. The reason seems to be that it would be a waste of time for an engineer to learn fluent Chinese first, so they are trying to do the program in English in order to attract foreign talent. Be careful, not all places are ready to teach such a program. Then, there are some other programs taught in English, hm, I would rather not comment on it, they exist in order to attract foreigners, not foreign talent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moon24 Posted February 28, 2015 at 03:50 PM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 03:50 PM Thank you all for talking about your experiences, I think I wanto to give it a try (taking the chinese course for one or two years before) Now I have the same doubt that fourdgrace, because I want to apply through the embassy in my country, but then some universities ask for an award letter and that confuses me because I don't know if it is better to apply directly to the universities or to the embassy. Also does the acceptance letter count when you are applying or it has to be the pre admission letter only? Is it possible to apply to more than 3 universities? and when I'm applying to a university, it's fine if in my application I have another university as my first choice? I know I have a lot of doubts but I'm really confused about how to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZhangKaiRong Posted February 28, 2015 at 04:50 PM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 04:50 PM @洋人丹 [quote]If you struggle with the material, can't understand lectures, and you can barely write a coherent thesis, what did you get out of your masters?[/quote] A piece of paper. Two/three years of carefree life. Some dubious "knowledge". Which is the case with any other Master's, not just in China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:04 PM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:04 PM Barely write a coherent thesis means: 1. a thesis that makes zero contribution to the field; 2. a thesis that looks like a 5 y.o. wrote it I have seen some theses that look like a Wikipedia article, do you want to write one? In China or elsewhere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZhangKaiRong Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:34 PM Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 at 06:34 PM Nope, thanks, I'm not into hard sciences, which is the only field where researches can have some real added value IMO (and this is why this research field is financially more viable). If you study economics/business/law, you actually don't have to contribute to anything - these should be all practical fields, where you can do things instead of writing a paper on some dull stuffs. Art - in addition to social sciences - is a tough nut, if you're good at one particular field, you should invest some time in yourself and be a good researcher, because otherwise it's hard to make a living. But be realistic: in China, 99% of the students sit another two years at one of the Master's programme because this way he/she can have a couple of hundreds RMB more as a starting salary. You can hardly find anybody who would like to actually contribute to any fields of study. There are always exceptions, of course, but this is a general problem with postgraduate programmes in China. In a country where plagiarism is booming, you can't really expect decent researches. And it is not much better with non-Chinese students: most of the 外国研究生 I met in China told me they just wanted to spend some more years studying "low-cost" and think about what to do with their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
洋人丹 Posted March 1, 2015 at 02:42 AM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 02:42 AM I just typed up a huge reply to go after ZKR's points, but this isn't the thread for it. If a mod wants to okay discussion, I will reply, but otherwise we should probably just keep it to the application process. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted March 1, 2015 at 04:41 AM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 04:41 AM Saying that a thesis looks like a Wikipedia article is not a compliment. Writing a paper means writing down your thoughts. The aim of a program should be to enable the student to discover something, not to produce the paper where these discoveries are outlined. However, a thesis that looks like a Wikipedia article can be a sign that the student did not discover anything. Most Europeans can't even speak Mandarin, if we were to follow what most people are doing we won't even be learning the language. People applying, make sure you know whether or not your program was created for people who want this just wanted to spend some more years studying "low-cost" and think about what to do with their lives. I am not saying it will be a bad decision to apply to such programs. I do think it is important to know what you are getting yourself into. No judgments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted March 1, 2015 at 05:13 AM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 05:13 AM Now I have the same doubt that fourdgrace, because I want to apply through the embassy in my country, but then some universities ask for an award letter and that confuses me because I don't know if it is better to apply directly to the universities or to the embassy. Also does the acceptance letter count when you are applying or it has to be the pre admission letter only? Is it possible to apply to more than 3 universities? and when I'm applying to a university, it's fine if in my application I have another university as my first choice? I know I have a lot of doubts but I'm really confused about how to do it. If you are applying for a language program, you have to apply through the embassy. Chinese universities do not offer any scholarships to language students. If you really want to go to BLCU (or any other school) talk to them and get an acceptance letter. Then include this acceptance letter in the application material you submit to the embassy. Don't forget to write a study plan where you say things like: "I have already been accepted into this language program, I hope you would be able to support my studies there." You can only list three universities when applying through your embassy. They might decide to send you to a university not on the list. That's why it's better to include an acceptance letter (to make sure you won't end up in a city you don't want to live in), obviously you should put this uni as your first choice. If you are getting extremely anxious, maybe you can try getting acceptance letters from all three universities and then you can use all three of them when applying through the embassy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shuoshuo Posted March 1, 2015 at 11:20 AM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 11:20 AM moon24 - DO NOT apply for a language programme. Apply for a masters degree WITH the Chinese language year. That way, after your language year, you automatically continue on to the masters programme. If you apply for a language scholarship, you will have to re-apply for a masters after, and that is not guaranteed. On the CSC, you are allowed to extend your language year once, which means you can do a total of 2 years language study. If you are applying through your embassy, you only need to send them your degree certificates, transcripts, physical examination form and other documents mentioned on the form. You do not need an acceptance letter or a pre-admissions letter. You can ask your embassy to help you communicate with the universities that you want to be enrolled into. If they refuse (some embassies are more nicer than others), you can apply for a pre-admissions notice. As you are applying for masters, I suggest applying directly to universities as well as through the embassy if possible. Unless either one method can guarantee you a spot. In some countries, the bilateral scholarships are supported by the government so they may provide extra allowances, fund plane tickets, help cover emergency expenses e.g. if you have to return home asap or if you are sick in China but the health insurance doesn't cover certain conditions, etc. but many bilateral scholarships require you to sign an agreement (usually involves you making a promise to return home after you graduate). While CSC scholarships from the unis do not offer anything extra, but there's no catch after you graduate. Understand the differences between direct application vs. embassy application for your country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moon24 Posted March 1, 2015 at 03:41 PM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 03:41 PM thank you for your answers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voyager2014 Posted March 1, 2015 at 06:53 PM Report Share Posted March 1, 2015 at 06:53 PM Thanks a lot you all for sharing your experiences. They are really valuable to this year's new applicants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted March 2, 2015 at 05:18 AM Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 at 05:18 AM moon24 - DO NOT apply for a language programme. Apply for a masters degree WITH the Chinese language year. That way, after your language year, you automatically continue on to the masters programme. If you apply for a language scholarship, you will have to re-apply for a masters after, and that is not guaranteed. No, you can't automatically continue to a master's program. If you apply for a master's degree with one year language preparation, you have to pass the HSK before you are officially admitted to the master's. Many people have managed to do it, but then again many people have managed to re-apply for a master's after applying for a language course only first (like me). Nothing is 100% guaranteed. It will be slightly cheaper to apply for a master's + language preparation, of course, but I am not sure if moon24 will be able to find a suitable master's program now. Not to mention the chances of him/her being able to convince a good program to admit him. A good program might even want applicants to contact a prospective 导师 before applying. I'm not sure if someone who is a beginner will be able to do this. Moon24 can end up wasting money on a rejected master's degree application. (Maybe a degree mill won't read your research proposal. If you just want to spend more time in China and you don't care about your studies, ignore my advice!) but many bilateral scholarships require you to sign an agreement (usually involves you making a promise to return home after you graduate) Depends on which country, I have never heard about anything similar. It's better to talk to people from your country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angelina Posted March 2, 2015 at 05:33 AM Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 at 05:33 AM If you are applying through your embassy, you only need to send them your degree certificates, transcripts, physical examination form and other documents mentioned on the form. You do not need an acceptance letter or a pre-admissions letter. (Only relevant for language students) An acceptance letter is not necessary. However, if you have already got one from the university, you HAVE to include it in the application material you submit through your embassy. Basically, you have two options: 1. Apply through your embassy without contacting any Chinese universities. You choose three universities in your application and you pray they don't send you somewhere else. (I went to BLCU without one, so don't worry moon24) or 2. Apply through your embassy and include an acceptance letter from a Chinese university (or three acceptance letters if have them). You contact up to three Chinese universities first. If you have only one acceptance letter, you put that university as your first choice when applying through your embassy. If you have three acceptance letters you choose those three universities when applying through your embassy in any order you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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