RARE DUAL Chinese and U.S Citizenship, PLEASE HELP.

[baobao1314]

I'm planning to travel to China in two months, please tell me how I should proceed. 

 

I was born in China to a CHINESE father, who currently STILL resides in China. My parent's divorced, my mother moved to the U.S, I stayed in China. My mother is U.S Citizen, when I was 8 years old, I moved to the U.S with her under a CHINESE passport, with Hukou and everything. 

 

Under American law, I'm naturally a citizen. Which is why I have an american passport, and a Chinese one. I also have a green card for when I first entered because my mom said I could choose if I want to be Chinese or American. SO, I have a valid green card, a valid Chinese passport, and a valid U.S passport. 

 

I did a lot of research, and apparently there are very few rare circumstances where a child like me born to two different national parents can be dual citizen, under Jus Sangunis (right of blood) I am a Chinese citizen, because my father still resides in China. Under U.S Law, I'm also a citizen, because of my mother. I never applied for american citizenship because I naturally am one, so technically I didn't renounce my chinese citizenship. 

 

So now I want to visit China, and I don't want to get a visa because I have a Chinese passport. Not to mention, the U.S is okay with dual citizenship, but China isn't. However, CHINA DOSENT HAVE THE RIGHT TO TAKE AWAY MY CITIZENSHIP under JUS SANGUNIS, nor under JUS SOIL because I was BORN in China. What should I do? 

 

 

 

[roddy]

Articles 3 & 9. Good luck. My understanding is that this generally has not been well-enforced, but that they're a lot more inquisitive now. Eg, this guy.

 

I'd imagine if you turn up at Beijing airport with a Chinese passport they're going to look to see what visa you had in the States. You won't have one. What happens then I don't know...

[Lu]

But OP has a greencard. Or does someone with a greencard still need a visa?

[roddy]

I'm assuming that's a US greencard. 

[baobao1314]

So when you have a green card, they don't check for visas.... 

 

Do you guys think I can 

 

1) go to China with a chinese passport, when you leave the country, and they see that you have a chinese passport, they don't check for anything else. they don't really care. 

2) arrive in China, show chinese passport. 

3) leave china with chinese pass port, american green card 

4) arrive in u.s with american passport 

 

does this work?! technically, i don't see why not. 

 

if the chinese government somehow finds out at beijing, am I going to get arrested. 

If I do get arrested, is the chinese government going to secretly kill me... =_= 

[skylee]

So the US allows a US citizen to hold both a US passport and a US green card legally? They are not mutually exclusive? This seems a bit odd.

[baobao1314]

I mean, it's not like they took my green card away... or said anything about it for that matter

[skylee]

And you are sure that your US green card is still valid?

[baobao1314]

It's not expired yet, so would the Chinese government even know that I'm an american citizen to begin with? If I don't tell them I have an american passport, how would they every know by just looking at my green card. 

[m000gle]

This potentially is a bit of an akward situation.

 

The articles and previous posters are clear and correct: China doesn't recognize dual nationality, for any Chinese national*.  My understanding of how this works in practice is that China doesn't recognize the non-Chinese nationality of said individual unless:
 

a) They have entered the P.R.C. on a foreign passport, with a valid Chinese visa; which implies

b) They have renounced their Chinese nationality, an act required for a Chinese-born individual, having obtained said nationality at birth, to apply for a Chinese visa.

 

* Non-Chinese nationals [including HKSAR and Macau SAR citizens travelling on non-P.R.C. passports (e.g. Canadian, British etc.)], who maintain dual/multi-nationality as an exception to the rules stated in the articles referenced in a previous post, will have only the nationality of the passport used to enter Mainland China recognized while in that portion of the P.R.C.

 

In your situation, I see two options:

 

1. Apply for a Chinese visa as a U.S. national, and enter China with your U.S. passport.

 

Assuming it is possible to obtain, you will avoid any/all ambiguity of nationality, while in China, and the consular representation it implies.  Should China still see you as one of its own, the embassy/consulate may require you to renounce your Chinese nationality before they accept your U.S. nationality, passport, and Chinese visa application.

 

2. Enter China as a Chinese national, using your P.R.C. passport.

 

This will not require a visa, but China will only recognize your P.R.C. nationality.  This isn't a problem until, on the off chance, it is: Should you encounter any legal trouble, while in China, you're considered a Chinese (not U.S.) national and will be treated as such; should you require consular representation, while in China, you're considered a Chinese (not U.S.) national and likely out of luck; should you encounter difficulty clearing exit control, when attempting to return home, you're still considered a Chinese (not U.S.) national and will be on your own to resolve the situation.

 

This option is, essentially, the list you provided in your second post.  It works; but you will be considered, by China, as exclusively a Chinese national from the time you enter to the time you exit the country.  As much as any difficulty could make for an interesting diplomatic incident, China would be under no obligation to recognize your U.S. nationality, nor would the U.S. embassy/consulate likely be interested in assisting you.

 

My strong recommendation is to utilize option #1.  Based on your original post's final paragraph, my guess is this won't be to your liking; but it is the option which is clearest cut and the one which is least likely to lead to problems going forward.

[ChTTay]

Based on m000gle's post above, I'd also go for option 1 if I were in your shoes.

Apart from that, all I can say is good luck!

[baobao1314]

The reason I don't want to do option 1 is because when you apply for visa, they will take away your old chinese passport. I do not believe I will get into any legal issues, I'm a student, and a girl, not going to go around and commit a crime. 

 

Will I have any problems entering the U.S with a U.S passport but no stamps from China? And what passport should I book the ticket with? 

 

What if I just pretend I don't have an American passport and enter the U.S using a green card?

[m000gle]

I can certainly understand not wanting to lose your Chinese nationality and passport.  Even were you only keeping it for nostalgia, the emotional attachment is strong.

 

The problem with the attitude of "I do not believe I will get into any trouble", however, is that it completely ignores the very real possibility of unforseen circumstances:

• A lost Chinese passport, for example, could be an absolute nightmare as an (unrecognized) dual-national, potentially non-resident, and potentially without a hukou.
  
• An unresolved civil (i.e. non-criminal) dispute might make it impossible to leave the country.
  
• Accidentally posting something online which runs afoul of the "relevant laws and regulations" might have similar effect.
  
• Even a false accusation against you could make it impossible to returning home, until resolved.
  

While these are admittedly highly unlikely to occur, there are any number of situations that you could encounter where the ambiguous nationality, or the (legally justified) outright refusal of Chinese authorities to recognize your U.S. nationality, could be very problematic for you.

 

This isn't a problem, for you, until it is.

 

Entering the P.R.C as a Chinese national, even while holding dual-nationality, effectively forgoes your non-Chinese nationality while on Chinese soil.  Entering the P.R.C. as a non-Chinese national forgoes your Chinese nationality, with the renunciation a visa requirement and said renunciation being permanent.  The two are mutually exclusive.

[roddy]

The hukou is actually quite an important issue - one of the reasons that people want dual citizenship is so they get access to beneficial housing and education policies, based on their hukou. China objects.

 

Will I have any problems entering the U.S with a U.S passport but no stamps from China?

Just show them the Chinese passport, I guess - they don't care if you have dual citizenship

And what passport should I book the ticket with? 

The one you want the airline to tell China about.

 

There must be more info about this on forums for American-born Chinese / Chinese living in the US? I doubt we're the best source of knowledge. 

[edelweis]

So this is the first time you go back to China since you were eight?

How old are you now?

[陳德聰]

Perhaps I am a bit confused about things, but why would you choose option #1 and then bring your Chinese passport with you through customs at Beijing? If you go with option #1, acquiring a visa for your US Passport... Why would you even bring your Chinese one to have it taken away? If you don't have it, they can't take it. They maybe will tell you it is no longer valid or something, but I am confused about what the negative repercussions of this are. You are struggling to use your Chinese passport for anything as we speak anyway, aren't you?

 

In situations like this I am tempted to just advise people to go with the clearly riskier option, because if you choose that and things go wrong, and it's China, so the probability is quite high of things going wrong, you will learn some kind of lesson about how you just can't have everything you want all the time. You don't get to be a dual Chinese and American citizen, it just doesn't happen, so trying to find loopholes is kind of silly, isn't it? Another option might be "don't travel to China at all and keep your pseudo-Chinese-citizenship forever" but that is probably not as palatable.

[baobao1314]

You have to turn in your old passport if you apply for visa as a former Chinese citizen. Or else they don't give you the Visa.... you have to PHYSICALLY bring your chinese passport to the consulate and give it to them to CUT it, then they will give you the visa, and your cut up passport. I researched this and asked people who have gone through this process. This is standard procedure in U.S Chinese consulate. 

 

Also, as I've stated before, the right to be dual chinese-u.s citizen is mine. 

My father is chinese, my mother is american. 

 

The chinese government SHOULDN'T make me choose between my parents. It's not about getting everything I want as you rudely stated. It's also not about finding loopholes. It's about basic human right. It's about Jus Sanguinis and Jus Soli. 

 

I will be getting in touch with the chinese consulate/ lawyers for this matter, as well as my father in China. 

 

Thanks for the help guys. 

 

Especially M000gle who's been very patient with me in the process. 

 

I was given the third option of traveling via third state as well. Through Hong Kong, or Thailand. Where I go to this place with my U.S passport, transfer flights with my Chinese, because neither requires Visa for both countries. While this is certainly possible, I've been wanting to go to Thailand for some time now anyways, I do not think this is a long term possibility. 

 

If anyone has traveled with a chinese and an american passport before, please let me know how did that go!!!! thanks!!!

[Shelley]

I know nothing about visa or passport issues, BUT from a purely sensible standpoint why not just leave your Chinese passport safe in a drawer at home, travel to china as an American citizen using your US passport and getting the correct visas, stamps etc.

 

You then have the security of knowing you still physically have your Chinese passport and you travel under the umbrella of the United States of America and all the help, safety and benefits you will get from that.

 

If any thing at all goes wrong you can just wave your US passport and get taken to the nearest consulate, embassy etc and get the help you need.

 

I look like a north African because my father was Egyptian and my mother British, she always said I would find things difficult if I went my fathers home country as I look like I should be wearing the appropriate clothing and not western clothes. Needless to say I never went. This was nearly 40 years ago, so I guess things might have changed but I hope you see the point I am trying to make.

 

What ever choice you make I hope you have a wonderful time in china.

[eion_padraig]

The chinese government SHOULDN'T make me choose between my parents. It's not about getting everything I want as you rudely stated. It's also not about finding loopholes. It's about basic human right. It's about Jus Sanguinis and Jus Soli. 

 

 

It doesn't sound like you appreciate how much trouble you could find yourself in by doing traveling this way. As you enter countries you sign legal documents saying that what you've disclosed is true. By signing false statements you in effect become a criminal.

Perhaps you haven't been paying much attention to things in China these days, but the Chinese government basically does what it wants regardless of the general sentiment of the average Chinese citizens. Challenging the Chinese government's authority is a sure way to run into trouble in China. This might seem fair, but it is the reality of living in China.

 

By the way, there are other countries, such as Japan, that don't allow dual citizenship (I believe in the case of Japan you have to decide when you are 21 years old).

I'm a bit sensitive to this as you say you are a student, and I worry about young people making decisions that could adversely impact their futures. I think you are possibly making a very bad decision.

 

Good luck with making this decision.

[imron]

Entering the P.R.C. as a non-Chinese national forgoes your Chinese nationality

Perhaps in theory, but in practice they treat you more or less as a Chinese national anyway.  There have been numerous cases in the last few years where this has happened to Chinese-born Australians and they've been denied or only given very superficial consular access.

 

The chinese government SHOULDN'T make me choose between my parents

The Chinese government isn't making you choose between your parents, but it will almost certainly see you as Chinese regardless of whether you have a US passport or not.  This isn't about your parents.  It is about you.