What have you done with Chinese language ?

[kouch]

Here in France, we keep hearing that "with Chinese, all doors are open".

I decided to study Chinese because I was convinced that being able to speak it will open up many opportunies to me.

Four years later, I am still not fluent and I am pretty sure I cannot do anything with the level I have right now. So I applied for the CSC government scholarship and I got it by the grace of God. I like China but to be honest, I don't think I would have gone back there for that long unless my level was already good enough or if a good job opportunity was given to me. Basically, I am going back there only because I want to reach the level that would open the doors for me.

 

But are they really going to open ? I am now doing my first year of master degree (Foreign Languages English-Chinese, Intercultural and International Management, Business Development specialization). I need now to narrow my focus to guide myself towards a school that matches the things I want.

I have never been interested in becoming a translator, a interpretor, or a teacher. I am more interested in doing a job where Chinese is a real asset. But I am just lost, is there really a strong demand for people talking Chinese now ? In which sectors ? In which countries ? 
 

So I am asking you, what have you done with Chinese language ? 
Did the doors open for you ?
 

Thank you

 

[Geiko]

This is a recurring question, you might find these threads relevant:

 

Career development using Mandarin Language skills

How to use Chinese to benefit my career?

Is Chinese an asset for you in your work outside China?

 

In Spain you can also hear that Chinese is the language of the future, when people know I speak it and don't use it to find a better job, they look at me as if I was silly or something. "But you could work anywhere!" "Doing what?" And then they all stare at me blankly, because nobody knows what those "fantastic jobs" are. One of my teachers even said in a newspaper interview that those who spoke Chinese would have no problem in finding a job. They picked that sentence and used it for the article title (Here) . But the people I know who speak it either work as teachers of Chinese or as translators (combined with other languages, living solely on zh>es would be almost impossible). 

[Zbigniew]

I hope you don't mind my being a bit of a renegade by asking this, but is there anything intrinsically special to you about China, its language or its people that propelled you into seeking a career on the back of your knowledge of the language? I ask simply because it sounds almost as if learning Chinese is nothing more than a means to an end for you, and that end is the very basic one of earning a living.

 

Maybe you'd be more successful in finding the job you want if you decide what line of work you want a job in and aim initially to get qualifications and experience in that line of work. Your Chinese may be no use to you at all for many of the positions you apply for, but for some it may give you the edge you need to land the job. Having said that, I think jobs for native French speakers  (and speakers of lots of other languages) requiring a good knowedge of Chinese but not requiring the employee to function in some capacity as an interpreter/translator are going to be very thin on the ground.

 

[edelweis]

10 hours ago, kouch said:

Here in France, we keep hearing that "with Chinese, all doors are open".

 

There's a lot of hype surrounding the Chinese language, mostly from people who don't have the slightest notion about the Chinese language or China.

 

10 hours ago, kouch said:

I have never been interested in becoming a translator, a interpretor, or a teacher. I am more interested in doing a job where Chinese is a real asset.

 

I have no first hand experience in using Chinese as a professional asset, but I did think about it a lot. Here are some avenues to explore:

 

It seems that more and more Chinese people come to France on holidays or to study.

You might want to look into the tourism sector, international commerce, luxury commerce, online commerce etc.

For instance, with some marketing training, maybe you could do some marketing analysis targeting Chinese speakers.

Or conversely, sell Chinese goods/China trips to French speakers.

 

If you're interested in IT, you could study NLP (Natural language processing) / TAL (traitement automatique des langues) ou LI (linguistique informatique) and try to get a position either at a university or in a company that publishes automatic translation software or other language related software.

 

With some journalism training, maybe you could become a journalist for CCTV (the French language channel) although I guess there's not so many openings. Or become a correspondent for French media.

 

In any case, my feeling is that for most positions outside of self employment or basic level positions (tour guide) you need to get some additional training beyond pure language training in order to use Chinese as a professional asset.

[yueni]

I think most jobs and/or careers these days come at the intersection of what people are good at/passionate about/experienced in. People aren't just hired because they speak Chinese. People are hired because they speak Chinese in addition to being an expert in mechanical engineering, or their knowledge of international accounting practices, or whatever it is you are interested in doing.

 

For me right now, I am working in the video gaming industry, and using Chinese as an asset, but I wasn't hired solely because of Chinese. It was a factor, but not the only one. As I have now assisted in the hiring process of a couple new people, I can tell you truthfully that people are hired because of a multitude of factors, not just one. For instance, for me, personally, my boss told me that I was hired because I met all their criteria, which was the following:

 

1. Translation & localization experience

2. Passionate about video games (and extensive gaming experience)

3. Native English speaker

4. Fluent in Chinese

5. Knowledge of how to use CAT (computer-assisted translation) tools

 

If I had lacked any of the five criteria, I wouldn't have been hired for the position I currently hold. Chinese is still a real asset for me. I do interact with Chinese people on a daily basis, developers, operations teams, marketing teams, customer service teams, etc. You say you are not doing translation work or teaching, so what other things do you know? Do you have business experience? Technical know-how? What other conditions do you meet, and can they be combined with your language abilities to help you fill a niche? That's your sweet spot, career-wise.

[davoosh]

I have had a similar kind of dilemma. I started learning when I was quite young, mostly due to personal interest in the language and culture, but I was spurred on by the hype about getting a great job, etc. I even spent a year in China, and reached a decent level. Shortly afterwards, I realised I didn't particularly want to be a translator/interpreter, so I've ended up in a completely different field. Sometimes this frustrates me, as I would love to maintain or improve my Chinese, but as I have no exams, classes or people around to speak it with, I usually just don't bother. I also don't particularly want to go out of the way to make new friends as I find the best friendships come naturally (which isn't a problem within China) and my schedule is unreliable.

 

In addition to what others have mentioned, academia could possibly be an option (i.e. PhD and onwards), although you would need to start thinking about research specialization and speak to some university supervisors to see if they would be happy/recommend you undertaking such a study.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Shelley]

I remember a similar discussion some time ago and we arrived at the conclusion that the "China Bubble" had burst. Maybe in the 80s having a high level of Chinese would open doors for you but only those doors that led to translating, teaching, real-time interpreting and similar. Some companies wanted a Chinese speaking member of staff to ensure things were as they were meant to be and cut the costs of hiring a translator.

 

Nowadays there so many Chinese people with a high level of English, French, German etc that that the cost and trouble of hiring a foreigner is not needed. This is because of many Chinese students going abroad to study and quite a lot of expat Chinese people returning home after many years in another country and bringing their language skills with them.

There are still opportunities to be found but they may not be so easy to find and they might be in a completely different field than expected.

 

I have always been learning Chinese simply because I am passionate about the language and the culture. I have never expected to "use" my chinese and so I just enjoy studying at my own pace and having the time to explore the world of Chinese and China.

 

Personally I wouldn't hang all my hopes on knowing Chinese, rather think of it as that something extra you might be able to bring to a job or career. I also think that the best work opportunities come along when least expected so keep your eyes peeled and take that opportunity when it comes. I didn't even know that the job I have spent the last 40 years of my life doing existed when I was a teenager and was being asked what I wanted to do when I left school. I fell in to it and have never looked back. It doesn't involve Chinese but electronics which was not even on the horizon when I went to school.

 

So keep an open mind, don't rely on using your Chinese for a career, but don't give up hope.

 

[耳耳语语]

I just got a position at the French Institute in Beijing (like others said :  half because I had some knowledge  about China and the langage, half because of my other experiences and competences).

 

According to french newspapers, some french companies are searching for salesmen, experts or managers who understand chinese langage and culture,in order to work with chinese people, be it in France or in China. (The examples are Areva and PSA, but hard to tell if it's a larger tendency).

http://www.lexpress.fr/emploi/apprendre-le-chinois-l-atout-emploi-qui-fait-la-difference_1073692.html

http://www.lefigaro.fr/emploi/2012/10/22/09005-20121022ARTFIG00394-apprendre-le-chinois-pour-booster-sa-carriere.php

 

And here is a list of sectors of foreign companies that are recruiting in China : http://www.dragonflygroup.com/en/executive-search-recruitment

 

[Mati1]

1 hour ago, Shelley said:

It doesn't involve Chinese but electronics which was not even on the horizon when I went to school.

I wouldn't be surprised if most electronic components are made in China nowadays.

 

When was the last time you had to look at a badly written / incomprehensible manual of a Chinese product? Maybe if they employed human translators ...

[happy_hyaena]

2 hours ago, Shelley said:

Nowadays there so many Chinese people with a high level of English, French, German etc that that the cost and trouble of hiring a foreigner is not needed. This is because of many Chinese students going abroad to study and quite a lot of expat Chinese people returning home after many years in another country and bringing their language skills with them.

There are still opportunities to be found but they may not be so easy to find and they might be in a completely different field than expected.

 

This! There are so many Chinese people everywhere. I would say that Chinese people outnumber Westerners in many African countries, by a pretty big margin. After I came back to my home country (Sweden) after having studied in China for a semester, I was surprised by just how many Chinese people there were that I had previously not noticed. You rarely hear about them though, since they usually do well. (In some places they do get a bad rep for buying up property everywhere, or flaunting their wealth in student towns...)

 

So I would never recommend someone to take "Chinese Studies" as their major, unless they were seriously interested in going some kind of Sinology route. You need to combine Chinese with a degree/some skills that will put you in a position where you can actually make use the language/cultural knowledge.

[kouch]

Thank you guys for your help, it's been very informative.

 

@Zbigniew Thank you for your help. Asian culture has always been interesting to me and learning Chinese was in a corner of my mind long before I actually started studying it. Unfortunately here in France, and I guess it's still the case in many countries, there were not many schools where you could learn it as a second or third languages. 

 

When I finished highschool and had to find what I could study I naturally headed into languages because this was what I was the best at and probably what I liked the most. Reading other topics @Geiko recommanded to read, I was able to see that in some countries like the USA, Chinese might not be a useful asset because there is now plenty of native Chinese speakers with a great command of English on the work market. I would say it's not really the case in France. 

 

However, it is the case with Spanish which was my third language at school. Many of us are able to speak it really well at the end of high school and there are also many native speakers on the market. I also did not really have any interest for the Hispanic culture. For all those reasons, I decided not to keep studying Spanish in university. I ended up finding a university allowing beginners in Chinese and jumped on the example. For the record, I remember during the first year, there were around 8 classes of English-Spanish students, and only 2 of English-Chinese students. Now, I have never seen Chinese as the end otherwise I would have specialized in translation but it's true I have always hoped that this would be an incredible asset for my career. My major is I think something that is not really well-spread in the world as it's multisciplinary (English, Chinese, Law, Economics, Marketing, Communication) and unless you decide to specialize in translation, English and Chinese are more considered like skills that would open up opportunities for you if you are able to master them. As for me, my specialization is International Business Development so my goal is of course to find a job in this field and hopefully speaking Chinese will be an asset. Sorry I don't know if all of that was clear.

 

 

@yueni Thanks ! The best case scenario would be that something like that happen to me. I am bot quite sure what I am specialized in now, i just started my master so hopefully by the end of it I'll be more specialized in something.

 

@耳耳语语 Merci ! Since you are French maybe you will be able to tell me, do you think there is still a demand for French people speaking Chinese ? I have found there are no so many people able to speak it here and not so many native speakers with a great command of French and English in addition to Chinese, what dou you think ?

[Zbigniew]

1 hour ago, Mati1 said:

Maybe if they employed human translators ...

 I know of at least one manual for a fairly popular product where the translation was done by the fourteen year old daughter of one of the bosses. Her middle school English was deemed to be easily good enough for the purpose.

[耳耳语语]

8 hours ago, kouch said:

@耳耳语语 Merci ! Since you are French maybe you will be able to tell me, do you think there is still a demand for French people speaking Chinese ? I have found there are no so many people able to speak it here and not so many native speakers with a great command of French and English in addition to Chinese, what dou you think ?

 

From what I can infer or guess :

 

Yes, I think there will still be a demand. For example the french gov would like by 2020 to : double the number of chinese tourists coming to France, and also to help double the number of french companies exporting worldwide in general.

 

But yes, you will meet competition. I live in Paris region, where are concentrated the majority of french chinese communities, and when I passed the HSK5, 90% of the applicants where french people of chinese origins, children or grandchildren of immigrants (but their active putonghua is far from always perfect, for sometimes their parents speak only in dialect... and anyway they had much less chinese lessons and exposure than they could have in China !). Also the shops popular with chinese tourists (Galeries Lafayette, Printemps) are full of vendors with chinese origins. The fact of having a "chinese face" could be seen as an advantage in this kind of situation, to attract or reassure chinese clients.

 

But as you focus on International business, note that it's not only the level of language that counts, but also your acquiered capacity to make negociations with chinese people from RPC, and your professionnal network there.

[Lu]

On 02/09/2017 at 10:03 AM, yueni said:

People are hired because they speak Chinese in addition to being an expert in mechanical engineering, or their knowledge of international accounting practices, or whatever it is you are interested in doing.

This.

 

That said, knowing Chinese has opened all kinds of doors to me. In most cases it was because I walked through them as an interpreter or translator, but they still went interesting places.

[happy_hyaena]

In pretty much 90%+ of the cases where I meet a Chinese person, I've been able to make a pretty instant connection with them just by talking Chinese to them, showing interest in their lives in China, and so on. I haven't necessarily always tried to turn every one of thsoe connections into some kind of best friend, but I've made some great friends with the ones I've wanted to. That's an ability that I think might be hard to put some monetary value to, but who knows. Being able to instantly hit it off with a huge percentage of people is very motivating to me at least.

[ouyangjun]

I'll give you my experience.  Chinese has helped me open doors to a great extent in my career, but the Chinese is not the back bone of my career success.  I graduated with an engineering degree then went back for my MBA.  My company sent me to China on what was supposed to be a 3 year expat contract in my late 20's.  When I moved to China I didn't know how to say a single word in Chinese.  Over the years I focused on the language and eventually got to a point that most consider fluent.  

 

The key thing that Chinese did for me was differentiate me from all of the other professionals in China and abroad.  The key thing a company needs in a role like mine is someone who is going to be performing at the highest levels and delivering results for the company.  With Chinese I was able to put myself into a small pool of people who have the professional skill-sets (which is the prerequisite) and Chinese (which is not normally mandatory, but for sure nice to have and a point of differentiation ).  In my opinion this is the real value....  bringing that little something extra to the table with the Chinese language, which then can open up doors and set you apart from the others.  It's now 9 years after my initial move, I'm still in China and things worked out really well.  When I started my career in China speaking Chinese started out as a way for me to connect with my team.  The more I've progressed to higher levels it has changed.  I'm now in charge of the China operations and I find the most useful aspect of my Chinese is when dealing with the government.  I have to interface with them quite a lot and being able to speak Chinese allows me to connect with them in a more meaningful way.  Not to mention they always remember me and know who I am because not many foreigners are meeting with the Chinese government and speaking in Chinese. (Keep in mind that all of this Chinese wouldn't matter if I wasn't performing in my job requirements).

 

Based on my experience it is not the Chinese language that is most important, instead it is your core skill that you are offering to your potential employer.  If your core skill is good enough to meet the job requirements, then Chinese can be the differentiating factor that sets you part from the others.  So the question comes down to what you really want to be doing, how you can gain those skills, and then applying the Chinese language aspect to that in order to make you stand out from the rest.  

 

In regards to your question on what regions/sectors.  I would say that any company doing business in China (especially based in China) in most any field.  Manufacturing and supply chain have always been big in China, but medical, software and tech is growing at a rapid pace.  

[abcdefg]

Quote

What have you done with Chinese language ?

 

One day in class after I read a long passage of text out loud, my teacher grabbed her ears, rolled her eyes, shook her head, and asked me sourly "What have you just done to the Chinese language?" Not quite the same thing.

[DavyJonesLocker]

For me I would say that the ability to communicate is the largest advantage, it allows you to build relationships with people. 

 

I work for a state owned company and my level of chinese is not the major factor. It's helpful indeed. but essentially its the professional knowledge that is the deciding factor

[Kelby]

I'm probably just echoing what others are saying here, but hirability absolutely depends on non-language skills. I'm an ESL teacher by trade (not by training though; my BA is in Political Science) and I would not have gotten hired at the Chinese international school I work at were or not for paying my dues and getting a couple years of on the job experience. 

 

My Chinese language skills have had a direct impact on my earnings though. 

 

With an HSK 4 credential (which I think everyone here will tell you is fairly easy to receive with regular study), I make a good 20% more than colleagues with equal experience. However, that money's not just a boon thrown at me for having language skills. The extra money requires surprise meetings with disgruntled parents, presentstions at Parent Teacher Association meetings, and other such extra tasks throughout the semester. I've been promised another two pay increases for getting my HSK's 5 and 6. I can't speak to whether this is standard at all schools, but at least my current employer values the test certificates enough to link it to my salary. 

 

I don't think this would be the case if I were teaching back home though. 

[DavyJonesLocker]

one other factor to bear in mind is that your HSK level can be included in your Work visa application under the new guidelines. HSK 5 and 6 are treated the same so worth aiming for 5 anyway