Textbook Series to Switch to After NPCR 2?

[withcoffee]

I have been learning Chinese for 5 months or so now on my own, and have finished both NPCR 1 and NPCR 2. I have added many of the characters to Memrise and know them all with good recall. Right now, I am spending two weeks going back through the audio files to improve my listening comprehension, as well as moving through the written dialogues again to see if there are any characters I have forgotten. 

 

I have gotten tired of NPCR, because there are lots of vocabulary words that seem far too specific for the level I am at, and my friends at university have said that NPCR 3 and 4 are even worse in this regard. What would you all recommend for a textbook series for me to switch to, having now finished NPCR 1 and 2? I would love a new series for those reasons and more -- I just think it would be new and fun. 

 

Thanks a lot!

[Shelley]

I am a fan of NPCR but I explored the idea of using Integrated Chinese and have the first version of book 1. Not sure how it compares at higher levels but if I had to stop using NPCR I would use IC.

There is also lots of extra help and materials on line, have a look here http://ic.cheng-tsui.com/

 

There are podcasts, extend lesson materials and more. When you buy the book you can log on and open up the extras on the website.

 

I am on book 2 of NPCR and am thinking of adding another textbook at level 3 just to give me more options and to help round out my learning and I am seriously considering using IC.

[Publius]

My dad never learned English, because according to my mom, he's always starting from the ABC.

Life's too short.  Stop shopping for textbooks/apps/methods.  Get yourself up to the intermediate level as fast as you can, then just switch to native materials.  That is, if you don't want to take up "learning Chinese" as a hobby.  Good luck.

[Shelley]

I agree with your basic point Publius but I wonder if intermediate level in Chinese is good enough to "go native" as it were. English at intermediate level would probably be enough to start with native level English materials I think.

 

 As a general question I wonder how these things equate?

[Flickserve]

6 hours ago, Publius said:

Stop shopping for textbooks/apps/methods. 

 

OP thinks it will be fun to change to a new series. Enjoying is important. Don't see any problem putting a fresh perspective on a fairly beginner stage. Going through the material should be faster.

[vellocet]

Yeah, NPCR has a bad habit of teaching highly specific, useless words.  

[roddy]

Quote

My dad never learned English, because according to my mom, he's always starting from the ABC

Similarly there are plenty of people flailing around because they decided to not bother with textbooks too early. You can get away with that if you have a competent and disciplined approach to language learning, but how many of us do?

[withcoffee]

@Publius I see what you are saying, but I think enjoyment is a key part of any hobby/task/goal. Plus, it takes a lot of time to go through an entire textbook (along with audio files, reading, and Memrise/Anki new vocabulary), and an entire textbook series takes even more time. If getting to the intermediate level were quick or easy, then sure, doing any method and not worrying about fun or results would be fine. But this is a long journey, and a key part of getting to where I want to be -- at least in my opinion -- is having fun while doing it. If half of the new vocabulary I am learning is as specific as Shaoxing Opera, while I only know around 750 words in total, I feel not only discouraged and annoyed, but also that I am wasting my time. That's my reasoning for wanting a more practical -- pun intended -- Chinese textbook. 

 

I might just stick with NPCR until Book 3 or 4, then jump into native content, though, if for no other reason than that there seems to be no other great substitute.

[happy_hyaena]

8 hours ago, roddy said:

Similarly there are plenty of people flailing around because they decided to not bother with textbooks too early. You can get away with that if you have a competent and disciplined approach to language learning, but how many of us do?

 

I definitly regret not sticking to a proper textbook from the start, due to bad memories from boring textbooks from my Spanish class back in high school. I tried to make use of various apps and services, some really good, but following a proper textbook after having set up goals and a schedule for lessons/week, would have allowed me to properly track and manage my Chinese learning, and given me a better focus than what I used to have. 

 

On 9/3/2017 at 7:26 PM, withcoffee said:

I have gotten tired of NPCR, because there are lots of vocabulary words that seem far too specific for the level I am at, and my friends at university have said that NPCR 3 and 4 are even worse in this regard. What would you all recommend for a textbook series for me to switch to, having now finished NPCR 1 and 2? I would love a new series for those reasons and more -- I just think it would be new and fun. 

 

In addition to the vocab they're teaching you, make sure to work on memorising the HSK word lists. HSK1-4 terms are absolutely essential. After that you can choose to purposedly studying the HSK 5 word list and then later the HSK 6 world list, or you can trust that your next textbook material will naturally introduce words on them anyway.

[Shelley]

13 hours ago, withcoffee said:

there seems to be no other great substitute

Did you have a look at Integrated Chinese?

 

I am planning on sticking with NPCR but as I say I might add IC at level 3 just for some more variety.

 

I think staying with NPCR is a good plan as you have already familiarised yourself with the format and as you say you have already invested time and effort in it.

 

And yes, enjoyment is a very important part of learning, studies have shown that you learn more when you are enjoying it. I only learn Chinese for pleasure so the whole thing needs to pleasurable.

 

There are a couple of things you might want to add to your routine, one is Pleco, this is a dictionary engine and a Flashcard utility This a very useful addition and a must for any chinese language student IMHO. Have a look here https://www.pleco.com/

The other is an app called HelloChinese, this is very good for practising speaking and listening, also reading and writing. The main app is free there are addons that are paid for but not absolutely necessary to make the app useful. Have a look here http://www.hellochinese.cc/

 

Hope your studies go well and remember Chinese Forums is also a great resource and any questions etc just ask

 

 

[Publius]

@withcoffeeYeah, I see. 第二十二课 你看过越剧没有

These textbooks inevitably will try to introduce you to some elements of the "traditional culture", 京剧, 苏绣, 武术, etc., whether you like it or not. I can even imagine they try to lure you with some trivia, such as, do you know all male roles are played by female actresses in Shaoxing opera?

Just bear with them. If you're really not interested in this kind of vocabulary, go suspend the cards in your Anki deck. Nobody will blame you.

As you said, this is a long journey -- maybe even longer than you realize. At the end, what textbook you used really doesn't matter. And to be honest, I'm kind of tire of hearing people say "such and such a word is useless". If your end goal is to function at a near-native level, it certainly won't hurt that you know Yue is an ancient name for the Yangtze Delta region, for instance.

If it gets too boring, try supplementing your study with some fun stuff, but don't ditch the textbook just yet. A textbook is designed to teach you the grammar and vocabulary in an order that the authors see fit. Switching to a new one invariably means you have to start all over again. And low level repeat, in my opinion, is the main reason why many people failed.

[vellocet]

It's more the fact that such words are useless for the beginner to intermediate, and even advanced learners use them rarely.  I think cognitive load would be better spent learning common words that the speaker can use in his daily language.  Chinese is already difficult enough without spending valuable brain time memorizing non-useful vocabulary.  

 

I think we overestimate how many people achieve the heights of near-native fluency.  A lot of people peter out way before that.  It's the book's job to give as much Chinese as they can use.  Problem is, the book is written by an academic linguist who thinks that everyone will achieve fluency like she did.  This is a mistaken assumption IMO.  

[DavyJonesLocker]

NPCR 3 and 4 are good and still contain useful words. All the grammar is essential. 

One should remember that it is a series of written Chinese. When I studied these  a long time ago fellow students complained that they were not useful for daily language. 60% of the words are (up to book 4). However one should decided what their focus of their studies is. Do you solely want to communicate to the average Joe in Chinese or be able to also read Chinese books and text?

 

English too contains a vast amount of words which we never use in daily life. However should one enjoy reading English books and novels far more words need to be learnt. 

[Tomsima]

If you've already done NPCR 1 and 2, do 3 and 4. It might feel boring and samey at first, but you'll soon realise why the series is popular: it's well rounded, and 3 and 4 will fill in the gaps in your knowledge. If you switch textbooks you will most likely get bored quickly as you realise the new characters and stories cover areas you already covered in NPCR, and perhaps even may lose interest and your study rhythm.

 

As for random infrequently encountered words, I know I just got on and learnt them. Yes I was fooled into thinking all HSK 4 test takers were avid readers of 魯迅, but whenever a Chinese person found out I could tell them who 阿Q was (despite still never having read the story) they loved it and it really encouraged me to learn more random tidbits that serve as great conversation starters.

 

Also, ultimately Publius is sharing some hard truths, but truths nonetheless. My own personal opinion, not that it's for everyone, is that the studying process should of course be enjoyable, but know the harder you study the greater the rewards. I have trudged  through textbooks which have been boring but recommended, and although for a while the study process wasn't as fun as i would have liked it to be, the end result was…understanding much much more Chinese.

 

If you really must find a new textbook, see what you think of defrancis. Read out loud. Go on italki and talk to your teachers about what was in the book. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat.