will you try to eat dog if possible ?

[cdn_in_bj]

and yea I made some comments about possible ill effects of eating certain wild animals with the implication that someone who knows more than I should help fill in some details

Actually, I'd like it if we could discuss this some more.

Sivargas mentioned something about getting rabies from eating cats/dogs - is this true? Even if they are fully cooked?

[muyongshi]

I don't think so. The biggest danger comes from eating meat that comes from near the spinal cord as many brain related diseases can effect the meat around spinal areas.

[shibole]

Who actually eats fully cooked meat though?

Back to the "how dogs are viewed" issue, I asked my wife again about the pet dogs in Beijing and her perception (keep in mind this is just her subjective perception here) was something like "yea, in some of those big cities more people with lots of disposable income have, due to western influence, started keeping dogs as pets." She tells me that she believes "very very few" people in China would keep dogs as pets given no western influence.

To give you some idea where she is from, she's from a "small" town of a mere ~900,000 people (current) in Hubei and later went to college in Wuhan. She left China about 10 years ago.

I know at least one of my relatives in China would have liked to have a pet dog if she had had the ability to do so. So there's little doubt in my mind that, as usual, sweeping generalizations are false in this case. This one relative doesn't approve of eating dog meat.

Regardless of any of that, I think that if anyone has a pet, regardless of where they're from, if it gets trapped under an escalator or something they're not going to just go "oh screw it" and walk off. That doesn't make sense regardless of what the pet is. If it's a pet then it's a pet. If it's a farm animal to them instead, and it's worth say $10, the person is probably more likely to think of it in terms of a lost item and whether or not its worth retrieving given it's value. I don't think we should confuse the issue of how much people care about their pets with what kind of animals they keep as pets or tend to think of as pets. My guess is that Chinese or any other people love their pets as much as westerners do, but honestly some Americans at least seem to have started confusing animals with people to the point where I really have to wonder if they'd rather save their dog than their child.

(And yea, I'm bored so I'm going to type long messages like this that annoy certain people.)

[gougou]

I think that if anyone has a pet, regardless of where they're from, if it gets trapped under an escalator or something they're not going to just go "oh screw it" and walk off.

Barring pet fish, which seem to be regarded as disposables here.

As for eating dog, I don't see any difference to eating beef. Even in terms of taste, but that is probably due to the fact that I only had it in a stew.

[muyongshi]

Barring pet fish, which seem to be regarded as disposables here.

I only ever raised fish with the expectancy of them dying so I could flush them...

[roddy]

Did they?

[muyongshi]

Oh yeah and if they didn't I flushed them anyway

[cdn_in_bj]

Who actually eats fully cooked meat though?

I've had it a few times where it was stewed - I would think it'd be fully cooked in this case.

Back to the "how dogs are viewed" issue, I asked my wife again about the pet dogs in Beijing and her perception (keep in mind this is just her subjective perception here) was something like "yea, in some of those big cities more people with lots of disposable income have, due to western influence, started keeping dogs as pets." She tells me that she believes "very very few" people in China would keep dogs as pets given no western influence.

My observation is that people here in Beijing are dog crazy. It seems that everyone (yes I'm exaggerating) wants to own a dog. Anything from the small Pekingnese, pugs, and toy dogs to larger breeds such as golden retrievers, Siberian huskies, dalmations, and a breed of dog that I've only seen in China which resembles a lion. The obsession is also apparent in how well these dogs are groomed and even "dressed". I'll grant that this dog obsession seems to apply more to the middle to upper class, of which there are a lot of in this city.

As for dog ownership, dogs here even require a Beijing "hukou". And until recently there was ban on "large" dogs (such as golden retrievers) within the 4th ring road, but I believe that this rule has been lifted.

But I agree with your wife in that if we consider the Chinese population as a whole, the numbers would be relatively smaller. And I also agree that western influence does play a big part.

[cdn_in_bj]

Oh yeah and if they didn't I flushed them anyway

I keep fish as pets and I'm offended by your cruel actions!

[muyongshi]

I keep fish as pets and I'm offended by your cruel actions!

With therapy you will come to forgive me

[gougou]

I keep fish as pets and I'm offended by your cruel actions!

What, didn't you see Finding Nemo? All drains lead to the sea!

If that does not appease you, just imagine that muyongshi was only joking. There's a smiley, after all.

[cdn_in_bj]

With therapy you will come to forgive me

Ok. Let's go have sushi then.

[muyongshi]

Here you go...

Anyway back to the subject of all meats...I don't find eating any type of meat more repulsive than another, I just think there are ones that taste better and there are definitely health reasons to not eat certain animals.

[imron]

"yea, in some of those big cities more people with lots of disposable income have, due to western influence, started keeping dogs as pets." She tells me that she believes "very very few" people in China would keep dogs as pets given no western influence.

To give you some idea where she is from, she's from a "small" town of a mere ~900,000 people (current) in Hubei and later went to college in Wuhan. She left China about 10 years ago.

Times have changed (or at least they are changing). People in smaller cities and towns are starting to keep them as pets, and not just those with high disposable income. It's also becoming quite popular with older couples looking for companionship when their only child has either moved out, or spends most of their day away from home.

What often happens is something like this:

1) Teenage child sees cute little puppies for sale on the side of the road (nowadays it's not uncommon to see vendors selling puppies on street corners) and decides she wants to buy one without thinking about the commitment involved with raising a dog.

2) Takes puppy home. Parents are not particularly happy especially because a) the puppy isn't house-trained and B) the child spends most of their time at school maybe only returning on weekends and so they have to do all the cleaning up.

3) After becoming house trained, the parents gradually become more and more attached to the puppy, and by the time it's grown up, the parents dote on the dog more than the child does.

I know of two families this has happened to. Both were in a smaller town, and neither have a large disposable income.

[imron]

I don't find eating any type of meat more repulsive than another

Human meat?

[muyongshi]

I stand corrected! Big distinction in my mind between man and animal and even though man may be considered meat.....

[shibole]

I think people think of fish sort of like plants. They get pissed when an expensive one dies, but they don't interact with the fish or have a relationship with them. I don't know... maybe you guys like to chase them around the tank with your finger and the fish afterward like to snuggle against your finger and go to sleep or something but that hasn't been my experience.

Human meat?

Ok, here's an interesting one. The original Buddhist prohibition against monks eating human meat came about not because people were killing other people, roasting them, then donating it to the monks but because some poor woman wanted to donate food to some monks and, having none to give, had someone slice a chunk of flesh off of her leg or something (without killing her) and cook that for the monks. Naturally the Buddha, not wanting to be known as the guy who encourages people to slice off bits of their flesh to feed his monks, established a rule against eating human meat. At least that's the story in the pali cannon.

But you have to wonder with people being able to grow tissues in the laboratory these days if some crazy people will start growing synthetic human meat to eat. Certainly I'd be a little worried about what these people might do if, having developed a taste for human meat, they ran out of the synthetic meat and started going hunting for the more natural variety.... (Too bad halloween is over.)

[zozzen]

Zozzen!!!! First of all before you start dissing people you should learn how to write the English language..... You attack me for no reason at all.... It make penis hard and cool in Summer....You people are sheepeoples......(Followers) your to afraid to be an individual and take a stand in something you believe it. I am aware that not all Chinese eat dogs it is only those that do. ... Dumb Ass.... Do the research and you'll see that consuming dogs and cats aren't as healthy and as cultural as you may think it is. Your Gross Zozzen

Hi sivgas, calm down, calm down. No one has really attacked you. Your mission failed again only because you're not able to make an argument better or newer or more convincing than what's previously discussed, but you've already made a small step to make a better world. Hope you're not so anxious with anyone who finds you funny, or consult your psychiatric doctor.

Also thanks for proofreading my English. Your response seems to show me that you fully understood how i think of you, so i think it's okay for effective communication.

[sivargas]

Well Zozzen,

Whatever you think is fine with me! I did get carry away and for that I apologize.But I don't apologize for what I believe in. Too be pretty honest, I have made a difference and I am very proud of my contribution to protect defenseless animals who have been abused, and those who have been abandoned. I've collected donations for shelters, I have written letters to the Asian Governments/ Ambassadors informing them of the consequences of dog and cat consumption and signed petitions. I've even have spoken to several organizations regarding the information about our companion animals and they informed me that even though dog and cat consumption is still proliferating, there are far more people in these countries who believe that consuming dogs and cats in wrong and have made a difference by campaigning, trying to quell the consumption. When I attack the dog meat trades in these country, it is not that the consumption of dogs and cats that bothers me, (although it does disturb me because I value companion animals as family), but would like for those who do indulge to euthanize the animal in a more humane way.

I have witnessed the atrocities inflicted on the dogs and cats in Asia and let me tell you if you'd witness how they slaughter them, especially the puppies you'd, probably wouldn't like it. I am not saying that we in America are any different when it comes to bovines, equines, chickens, swines and even fur bearing animals, but believe me I have done my share of campaigning. For instance the horse slaughter issue. I managed with others in the United States and with Humane Society of the United States to shut down the horse slaughter plants in the U.S. by writing letters and getting others involved. It was successful. Right now dogs and cats are being slaughtered for their furs and are on our garments such as winter coats, gloves, hats and toys that carry cat and dog fur in them.

Right now the U.S. Government and EU have banned the sale of dog and cat fur product from entering the country. The U.S and EU have implemented a way of detecting the garments made of our companion animals, therefore deterring anything that has been making it's way into the countries. So you see, I do know what I am talking about. I hope you understand why I feel as strongly as I do when it comes to certain issues that pertains to animals all over the world.

I am truly sorry, for imposing my passion on you and too all the dog and cat eaters in the world and to those who seem to think there is nothing wrong with it. I know you all have issues and some of you have no idea what you are talking about. And that is o.k. But I will say what I have to say regardless of what you and others think. If you don't like it, it is your problem and it's something you need to work at. I will try to maintain a bias attitude and limit myself to those such as yourself who think this is a joke.

Just let me say what I strongly believe in and if you have nothing nice to say then don't say anything at all, as I will do the same.

Sincerely yours, Smooches

Ms. Sivargas

[shibole]

I was going to write a few paragraphs about this but I think I'll try to keep it really short since it's really off topic. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that people should be nicer to animals but honestly if you're going to spend your limited time campaigning shouldn't you start with campaigning for tortured/murdered humans first?