Chinese paper dictionary sought (please read description)

[atitarev]

Hi all,

I would highly appreciate advice on a good bilingual two-way dictionary (Chinese - English) matching these criteria. Sorry for being fussy. There are a lot of dictionaries out there and I have a couple too but I am looking for a better one.

If it's a good character dictionary, it's OK if it's a one-way Chinese-English dictionary.

1) Main entries and examples are in simplified with traditional characters provided for the main entries. There are a lot of dictionaries matching this.

2) Stroke order provided for each character in the main entry. I can't find any of those.

3) Pinyin is given not only for the main entries but for the examples as well. More than half of the dictionaries provide pinyin only for the mainn entries, or give very few examples.

4) ABC dictionaries are sorted alphabetically by words, I prefer those that concentrate on characters with words given under the character entry, not like ABC.

5) Radical, stroke number and pinyin lookup

6) It can be larger than pocket size with a reasonable number of characters/words but I don't want a huge volume, something that can fit in a case.

Second-hand is also OK as long as fits my description, is not out-of-date and I like it. Maybe I could buy it off you if you send me some scanned pages, post here.

Here's an equivalent Japanese dictionary (this one is a one-way Japanese-English but absolutely great to learn characters) - I have one:

The Kodansha Kanji Learner's Dictionary

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/4770023359/002-9325451-7715221?v=glance

I am looking for a similar, if it exists for Chinese, with stroke orders, character info, pinyin for each example, maybe a similar size.

[fenlan]

Get the Wenlin electronic version of the ABCD dictionary, and it contains all these things.

[atitarev]

Thanks, Fenlan. I already have Wenlin, NJStar, HanConv, CQuickTrans. Yes, Wenlin is a really good product for learning Chinese characters but I need a book as well.

I've got a very basic Chinese dictionary with just over 1,000 characters with stroke orders. It shows about 5 characters per page (I think it's called "Learning Chinese characters"). Looking for something more advanced and comprehensive, please.

[nipponman]

Pinyin is given not only for the main entries but for the examples as well. More than half of the dictionaries provide pinyin only for the mainn entries, or give very few examples.

Atitarev, this is only a friendly suggestion but I think you might be better off if you don't rely on pinyin any more. And my personal dictionary suggestion is" A concise Chinese-English English Chinese Dictionary" Second edition. It has everything but #2, including the radical lookup.

[atitarev]

Atitarev' date=' this is only a friendly suggestion but I think you might be better off if you don't rely on pinyin any more. And my personal dictionary suggestion is" A concise Chinese-English English Chinese Dictionary" Second edition. It has everything but #2, including the radical lookup.[/quote']

Yes, I understand what you mean but many examples, if without pinyin will be just a bunch of characters for me, if I know only part of them. To actually read an example and understand I would need to spend some time time looking up all characters, I usually don't do this when I am translating a passage concentrating only on the actual characters I am after, not on the examples but if the examples are complete in an entry - character/pinyin/translation, then, IMHO they are really useful for learners.

Thanks for the suggested dictionary - I found this one when was looking for a suitable dictionary. If I don't get any with stroke orders, I'll probably choose this one. Does it have examples and are the examples with pinyin?

[logos]

I perused through amazon's site for a volume that best matches your criteria.

I came across "Cheng & Tsui Chinese Character Dictionary: A Guide to the 2,000 Most Frequently-Used Characters (Paperback)"

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0887273149/qid=1125362166/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_1/104-8480596-0973526?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I'm not sure if you have encountered this book before, but it doesn't look too bad, but it only contains simplified characters unfortunately.

I'm currently using the Oxford Starter Chinese Dictionary, and like the one above, only contains simplified characters unfortunately. But, it does provide many example uses of most words (pinyin & characters), and important points where special attention should be given.

I'll keep looking, as I am too interested to see if there are any outstanding volumes hidden out there somewhere.

Before submitting this post, I expanded my search on Chinese Dictionary reviews beyond Amazon, and large booksellers, and I think this site may be helpful. It is a review of Chinese Dictionaries by YellowBridge, which provides several good example dictionaries worth looking into.

"Selecting the right Chinese-English dictionary is a lot harder than, say, buying a Spanish-English dictionary, which you can do with your eyes closed. After a broad survey of all the major dictionaries available in the market, we have to conclude that the "must have", hands-down winner has not been published yet. This is because, in our humble opinion, the ideal dictionary for modern student of Chinese would have the following attributes:"

(continued here) http://www.yellowbridge.com/language/dictionaries.html

It is interesting to note that their requirements of an 'ideal dictionary', are somewhat similar to what you are looking for.

I hope I helped at least a bit.

[geek_frappa]

here's one i call skylee's dictionary. :o)

朗文中文高級新辭典（第二版) (ISBN 9620051521)

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/39-electronic-dictionaries1&page=1&pp=10&highlight=skylee%27s+dictionary

[markalexander100]

Why do you need stroke order? I think you'd be much better in the long run learning the rules, after which you can work it out yourself. It takes about five minutes to learn them.

[atitarev]

Thanks to all who posted. I take a closer a look at dictionaries and links.

Stroke order: at some stage the need for it disappears and for the same components is not necessary but sometimes the way components are put together requires you to change the stroke order. If you learn on your own and you don't have a teacher, it's always good to double-check if you do this correctly, rather than relying on your intuition and knowledge. Well, that would make a dictionary perfect but if you can't have you can't have it.

I looked at Yellowbridge page, the dictionaries they suggest are OK but missing pinyin in examples.

It seems Cheng & Tsui Chinese Character Dictionary is definitely worth looking at.

I subscribed to this thread.

[atitarev]

here's one i call skylee's dictionary. :o)

朗文中文高級新辭典（第二版) (ISBN 9620051521)

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/39-electronic-dictionaries1&page=1&pp=10&highlight=skylee%27s+dictionary

Not sure I could use this one, thanks, anyway. Does it have English?

To Logos:

There are 2 good Cheng and Tsui dictionaries: one you mentioned and another one:

I'd like to have a closer look at them soon.

1) Cheng and Tsui Chinese Character Dictionary (A Guide to the 2,000 Most Frequently-Used Characters)

2) Cheng and Tsui Chinese Pinyin English Dictionary for Learners (S/T)

[nipponman]

I'll probably choose this one. Does it have examples and are the examples with pinyin?

Yup, it is a very good dictionary. I have had it for a year now, and haven't turned to another since... I had (still have) a really weird dictionary that was english to chinese only, but was only simplified, and didn't have many examples.

nipponman