Anyone interested in forming an online book reading group?

[gougou]

Sorry, fenlan, to change my mind as well, but I agree to what has been said, a whole book is quite a lot...

Is there no way in interesting you in an online short story reading group?

[fenlan]

Sorry, fenlan, to change my mind as well, but I agree to what has been said, a whole book is quite a lot...

Is there no way in interesting you in an online short story reading group?

The lack of ambition of people in this group shows that they will eventually master enough characters to read the newspapers, and no more. Some Chinese people pour over dictionaries, learn thousands of words, speak amazingly fluent English despite never having been abroad, but their foreign counterparts never match them. We are simply far lazier and less ambitious. I feel a justified change in the locus of world leadership coming on...

[beirne]

The lack of ambition of people in this group shows that they will eventually master enough characters to read the newspapers, and no more. Some Chinese people pour over dictionaries, learn thousands of words, speak amazingly fluent English despite never having been abroad, but their foreign counterparts never match them. We are simply far lazier and less ambitious. I feel a justified change in the locus of world leadership coming on...

I have stayed out of this discussion because I didn't want to be negative. I'm practicing reading on my own but am not really interested in trying to read an entire book, especially one I'M NOT INTERESTED IN. I think reading short stories is a pretty good idea, and not because I'm lazy. The groups should be more successful reading shorter works because you will be able to keep people involved. They will know that even if they aren't interested in the story it will be over soon and something better may be chosen next.

One can even make a case that reading short pieces will be better for vocabulary acquisition, because a variety of stories should have different selections of vocabulary based on the author's style.

Also, you shouldn't assume that the group members are lazy because they don't want to read your book. You don't know how much time they are spending studying when they are away from the forums. The forums are not the focus of most people's study, but rather a means to assist in their language learning.

[trevelyan]

The lack of ambition of people in this group shows that they will eventually master enough characters to read the newspapers, and no more. Some Chinese people pour over dictionaries, learn thousands of words, speak amazingly fluent English despite never having been abroad, but their foreign counterparts never match them. We are simply far lazier and less ambitious. I feel a justified change in the locus of world leadership coming on...

中国农民调查 is intentionally written at the same level of difficulty as a common newspaper. Its clear you haven't actually read much of it though, which makes it even more baffling why you want to spend a year reading the book in slow motion, and are hostile to people who care to read more diverse content at a faster pace.

As for the rest, you'll probably find the forums a more pleasant environment if you climb off your high horse and drop the working assumption that everyone here is either illiterate or stupid. If you were serious about wanting to improve your Chinese, you could have done a lot worse than asking for recommendations on intermediate-level readings from people who have already been there and done that. I was personally interested in the idea of a reading club because of the variety of reading material one would get from peer recommendations. Its hard to know what is good and worth reading otherwise.

If I feel anything now though, its a justified banning coming on.

[roddy]

That's absolute genius. You've gone from 'these people don't want to read a book' to 'these people are lazy and have no ambition' to 'the times they are a-changing . . .' This might have been insulting, if I hadn't been too busy laughing to feel annoyed.

There are any number of good reasons why for many people a series of short stories / articles is a better choice than an entire book. None of these stem from lack of ambition or laziness. They're detailed above, and will probably be detailed again below, so I won't repeat them. The issue is compounded when the book in question is relatively long and of only limited interest - but it would remain true for a best-selling novel.

I feel a justified banning coming on.

Members of this ilk often storm out before they need to get banned. However it's always an option for posters with a history of annoying people, or who show the forum's members no respect.

Roddy

[nipponman]

I haven't said much in this thread, (mostly because I've been busy) but I would like to say that I haven't read the book in question, I have never even heard of it. Maybe we should choose a different book? Instead of going to one extreme or the other, simpler book might be in order. If the book is boring, I personally don't wanna read it. But I've never come across anything boring in chinese(probably because I spend so much time trying to figure out what's going on.) So, how about a change in books?

nipponman

[fenlan]

I would in fact be willing to read any book, but not to set my sights lower and just read the odd article. I think it is true that Chinese people learning English are more hardworking and aim higher than the other way round. If Roddy and Trevelyan want to ban someone for saying so - go right ahead! I asked a question: would anyone be interested? The answer is either "yes" or "no". Instead there is a flood of messages from people saying they couldn't cope with a book - well then, they are in the "no" camp. I have actually read quite a chunk of the Peasant Survey, and my edition has a foreword by some university professor or other that is clearly written in a much higher style than the book itself (but is not included in the PDF someone in the group sent me). So, I was aware that the book was journalistic. But how many individual words or characters are there in such a book? Probably more than in the average newspaper article. There is not achievement by just reading odd newspaper articles and learning the odd word. I would have been just as happy had someone said, "let's read Ba Jin's Jia" or any other worthwhile book. But instead there is this pile of negativity from people who wouldn't want to be involved anyway. What are your motives, Roddy? What are your motives, Trevelyan? I will plough through a number of books I have lined up anyway.

[nipponman]

What are your motives, Roddy? What are your motives, Trevelyan?

I don't think there is a need to be all suspicious. I just think Trevelyan doesn't wanna read the book, and it seems that roddy has some foreknowledge on how to get a good site up and running and is trying to help you. THIS is what the group is all about. Before we can read the book we should decide which book it is we wanna read. Why not pick a book that everyone enjoys?

go right ahead!

P.s I think it is best to leave this alone, lest your wish come true.

[roddy]

If Roddy and Trevelyan want to ban someone for saying so - go right ahead!

Actually, I'm going to ban this account, and you can go back to using your other one which is still active, albeit pre-moderated. One account at a time, thanks

While researching this dual personality, I came across this quote

As interesting as SOME of your input into this string has been, the only thing you have managed to prove is a lack of patience with people who you obiously feel superior too.

As far as I can see you certainly haven't won anything apart from other peoples distaste.

. . . which I believe is still relevant today.

Will leave this open for a while for any further comments and then close it. I suggest discussion of a choice of book / other material goes into this already active topic.

Roddy

[nipponman]

and you can go back to using your other one which is still active, albeit pre-moderated.

I thought they were the same guy!

[chenpv]

I am supposed to be on my 10-days off for my GRE writing test, but since this is a good forum, so i think it's OK if i come and take a quick look at it before sleep.

While....... everyone seems to be in bad mood, though. Sorry to see this.

I dont want to criticise on both sides, but I think the most important is keeping harmonious and it would be a little better if you could take each other's stances into account. I thought fenlan was just eager to get his chinese improved and wanted to try taking a bigger step, without considering others' abilities and feelings. And the other people were trying to make a suggestion which they thought more appropriate, but might not be effective in fenlan's point of view.

For both sides: If someone is not supportive, its not a good idea to criticise too specifically. ( I personally dont like the saying: Good luck with 农民调查, because it sounds like '拆台' (pulling away the prop )in chinese.)

Since you guys want to do varieties of in-depth readings and all of you could get the resources, i personally recommend the text books for junior/senior middle school which is available (free, full text) at 人民教育出版社 , including text books for teaching and addtional reading. You guys can find all kinds of informations in those books ranging from modern chinese to classical chinese.

PS: Roddy, i dont think fenlan's all responsible for this, and maybe banning account is too much.

[nipponman]

ChenPv, your link doesn't work.

[hakkaboy]

Is anyone interested in the Wolf Totem book that the Chinese and Foreign Press are raving about? Penguin has bought up the English language rights.