Coronavirus - those in China, and general discussion

[BanjoSlice]

2 hours ago, ChTTay said:

We start online teaching from the 10th. Not sure how it will go

Is the end date unchanged as of now or will that be extended too?

[BanjoSlice]

2 hours ago, ChTTay said:

I think it definitely depends on those individual countries.

For instance the US has placed a restriction on all aliens that have been in China. Also, most flight providers in the US have cancelled their flights with no possible date of resuming the flights which is worrying.

 

On an unrelated note, can I catch the virus if I am in the same space with someone for a long time(maybe 30 minutes) who may have it even if they put on a mask(but not very well)?

Edited February 1, 2020 at 03:34 PM by Lance
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[Jan Finster]

5 hours ago, Lance said:

can I catch the virus if I am in the same space with someone for a long time(maybe 30 minutes) who may have it even if they put on a mask(but not very well)?

 

Potentially by touching contaminated surfaces. Also, the surgical masks are not really sitting very tight. So, if I sat next to someone with symptoms wearing such a mask, I would feel very uncomfortable.

On the plane in flight, you are probably fairly safe since the cabin completely exchanges its air every two to three minutes (20 to 30 air changes per hour). 

[Shelley]

The 2 people who are known to have it in the UK are chinese, one student and a relative. Some sign of masks appearing here, but things seem pretty normal.

Shops full of people and supplies, all seems fine.

[mungouk]

@Shelley — which part of England are you in?  

 

 

[Shelley]

I am down south, Southampton. Our university has approx 3000 chinese students. The two I mentioned are further north, University of York.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51337400

 

Where are you at the moment?

[mungouk]

I'm temporarily in North Wales, not very far from Arrowe Park on the Wirral where the recently-repatriated people are in quarantine. (Near Liverpool.)

 

Up until 5 weeks ago I was living in Beijing, and I had been hoping to head to Zhejiang soon, but circumstances have changed somewhat. 

 

 

[Flickserve]

1 hour ago, mungouk said:

I'm temporarily in North Wales, not very far from Arrowe Park on the Wirral where the recently-repatriated people are in quarantine. (Near Liverpool.)

If it’s more than ten feet away from a person with coronavirus, you are Ok.

[Flickserve]

It will be interesting to see how the disease spreads in north China. 
 

I heard Wuhan doesn’t have central heating unlike northern China. We know the coronavirus activity goes down as outside temperatures rise but if home temperatures are already consistently high, spread in places like Beijing will more limited. 

[StChris]

Just a couple of things from my 朋友圈:

 

A good message for those feeling bored at home, to put things into perspective: "你所谓无聊的“家”，是我们想回却回不去的地方“：

 

 

 

This is some sort of doll house that a friend made all by themselves (entirely from basic materials, not from a set). It's amazing the creativity that boredom can bring out of people. I think it's pretty impressive. It really made me 刮目相看:

 

[mungouk]

9 hours ago, Flickserve said:

If it’s more than ten feet away from a person with coronavirus, you are Ok.

 

Yes, of course.  I was just answering Shelley's question.

 

 

[889]

Is the 10-feet rule correct? Recall that during the SARS epidemic, people living in flats up to seven floors away from the original victim's flat were also infected. This was the Amoy Gardens case in Hong Kong, where the virus was transmitted through an improperly maintained drainage system connecting the flats. (The lesson: Pour enough water in all your drains to keep the gas traps fiiled.)

[mungouk]

24 minutes ago, 889 said:

people living in flats up to seven floors away from the original victim's flat were also infected.

 

Shared door-handles, lift-call buttons etc...

 

IIRC there was also a hotel in HK where a SARS-infected doctor managed to spread it to several others in adjacent rooms. 

[889]

No, in the Amoy Gardens case it was pretty clearly determined that there was transmission through the drainage system, because the gas traps in some drains had dried out since the particular drains were rarely used.

 

"The vertical spread of SARS in Block E was attributed to a combination of dried-up U-traps, contaminated sewage, and updraft in the lightwell, that facilitated droplet spread."

 

"The Community Outbreak in Amoy Gardens" (can't get the link working)

 

Hong Kong flats usually contain floor drains in the bathroom and kitchen which are never used, so the gas trap dries out.

 

 

[dtcamero]

53 minutes ago, 889 said:

Hong Kong flats usually contain floor drains in the bathroom and kitchen which are never used, so the gas trap dries out.

 

so the virus-laden droplets of water vapor floated through the drain’s gas trap, up the lightwell, and into the upstairs neighbor’s apartment?

that seems kind of incredible for a virus that supposedly is only 1/5th the contagiousness of measles.

[roddy]

"Only"? Measles is about as contagious as they get. 

 

There's diagrams and everything about Amoy Gardens here. Basically, the bathrooms all had a direct line into the sewer (which you'd think would smell bad enough to prompt action, but never mind). 

Quote

The bathroom floor drains with dried-up U-traps provided a pathway through which residents came into contact with small droplets containing viruses from the contaminated sewage. These droplets entered the bathroom floor drain through negative pressure generated by exhaust fans when the bathroom was being used with the door closed. Water vapour generated during a shower, and the moist conditions of the bathroom, could also have facilitated the formation of water droplets.

 

[889]

But absolutely true. And apparently almost forgotten today.

 

"The index patient (first case of the outbreak) was a 33 year old man who lived in Shenzhen and visited his brother in Amoy Gardens regularly. He had chronic renal disease, which was being treated at the Prince of Wales Hospital. He developed SARS symptoms on 14 March 2003. On 14 March and 19 March, he visited his brother who owned a flat in block E of Amoy Gardens. He had diarrhoea at that time and he used the toilet there. His brother, his sister in law, and two nurses who attended to him at Prince of Wales Hospital subsequently developed SARS. As of 15 April 2003, there were a total of 321 SARS cases in Amoy Gardens. There was an obvious concentration of cases in block E, accounting for 41% of the cumulative total. A thorough investigation into the cause of the outbreak was carried out by the Department of Health in collaboration with eight other government agencies. The investigation revealed that environmental factors played an important part in this outbreak. The defect was found in the sewage system at Amoy Gardens.

 

^"Each block at Amoy Gardens has eight vertical soil stacks each collecting effluent from the same unit of all floors. The soil stack is connected with the water closets, the basins, the bath tubs, and the bathroom floor drains. Each of these sanitary fixtures is fitted with a U shaped water trap (U trap) to prevent foul smell and insects in the soil stack from entering the toilets. For this preventive mechanism to function properly, the water traps must be sufficiently filled with water. However, as most households had the habit of cleaning the bathroom floor by mopping instead of flushing it with water, the U traps connected to most floor drains would probably have been dry and would not have been functioning properly."

 

https://jech.bmj.com/content/57/9/652

[feihong]

故事FM just put out a story narrated (in Chinese) by a doctor in Wuhan: http://storyfm.cn/episodes/e320-wuhan-doctor-after-work-i-have-to-help-the-department-to-grab-supplies/

 

Unfortunately, unlike the previous Wuhan episode, this particular narrator’s accent is quite strong. I can’t quite understand everything he’s saying, and on top of that he uses way more medical terms.

[Tomsima]

Update from over here: Wanda in Yichang is tentatively scheduled to be reopening for business on the 14th Feb. All 小區 in Yichang have now been sealed individually. A family friend said they are not being allowed out of their complex at all, even for food: seems like everyones thinking is to stick it out one more week and hope we'll get over the supposed peak of infection. Its like everyone here is holding their breath, hoping the water level will drop. One family across town from us was hosting three families over new years, they are currently 10 people surviving on rice, greens and sweet potato

 

[Jim]

We've got check points at the village entrance now taking your temp and making you sign in, as have other villages nearby in Shunyi and Changping. Went out to pick up some veg from a local grower just over the county line, roads pretty empty and there'd been a snowfall last night so quite an unusual feeling.