Coronavirus - those in China, and general discussion

[Jan Finster]

7 minutes ago, Flickserve said:

This is a really bad place to be in. High chance of transmission of infection. Lots of water droplets.

 

Yeah, this is what I meant. Panic on the one hand and on the other hand doing totally irrational things like sitting like hens on sauna benches.... ?

[DavyJonesLocker]

I do wonder if this is nature's way of sorting out the population explosion .

 

Grim but it can't be denied we have a huge problem facing us. 

[Jan Finster]

I only now remembered that many places in China do not have heating in the winter. I was wondering if the rate of infection and/or death rate is different in provinces with versus without heating?

[Shelley]

2 hours ago, DavyJonesLocker said:

I do wonder if this is nature's way of sorting out the population explosion .

I don't know if it would make a big enough impact. The numbers need to be cut by at least a 1/3 to make a difference.

This is my personal soap box. I have not had any children becuase i believe the world has too many people and not enough trees. Trite maybe but it sums it up.

2 minutes ago, Jan Finster said:

different in provinces with versus without heating?

They say the warmer temperatures will kill it off, but I don't know about that, Italy is not that cold or Tenerife where there have been cases.

[dtcamero]

some people are thinking that the warmer weather in sub-saharan african countries is why there has not already been an epidemic there yet

[Brassneck]

2 hours ago, Shelley said:

They say the warmer temperatures will kill it off, but I don't know about that, Italy is not that cold or Tenerife where there have been cases.

 

Think Northern Italy is not that warm in winter. The Tenerife case was imported I think. Hopefully warmer weather will help but who knows!

[carlo]

Temperatures in Lodi today (Italy's red zone) are between 3 and 10 degrees C. In Singapore (102 confirmed cases?) it's 32 degrees C.

[Jan Finster]

As the situation in China appears to gradually get better and the situation outside China appears to get worse, I wonder in what way China will scrutinize foreigners traveling to China in the upcoming months. 

 

Currently the German foreign ministry warns:

"At the moment, you have to expect a 14-day quarantine period after entering China. This can be done at home or in a hotel. The decision about quarantine measures is made by different authorities at different levels and can also differ within a city. Therefore, contact your property manager or your hotel before entering the country and inquire about the provisions that apply to you. Beijing officially has a 14-day quarantine period for travelers."

 

(translated by googletranslator; highlights in bold by me; source:https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/de/ReiseUndSicherheit/chinasicherheit/200466)

 

If they keep this quaratine, then going there on a 10 day business trip would be a non-starter. I wonder if they will ask you to provide a recent negative test results or if they would ask you to wear a mask 24/7 if you were Italian or German? Surely, the last thing they want is for foreigners to re-introduce the infection after it has run its course in China. 

[Ruben von Zwack]

Quote

If they keep this quaratine, then going there on a 10 day business trip would be a non-starter.

On a similar note, at my company, all China-related projects were cancelled. Not by us, but by our clients. It's pretty substantial.

[Jan Finster]

14 minutes ago, Ruben von Zwack said:

all China-related projects were cancelled.

Until when? End of 2020? 2021? Indefinitely?

[Ruben von Zwack]

All that were scheduled for 2020. I'm sure there will be new ones at a later point.

[Jan Finster]

 

All of late January and February the official German response was: "we monitor it closely and we are well prepared".  

It is all good to instill confidence and not create a panic,  but even now as we have only about 200 cases in Germany, it becomes clear how utterly unprepared Germany is. Even human doctors complain they have no protective gowns, not enough face masks and not enough disinfection to protect themselves and their staff. I wonder what Germany's preparation was all about all these weeks...?

Pointing the finger at China and not doing your job even though you had ample time to prepare...

[Ruben von Zwack]

I think those who should coordinate preparation are too busy with "more important" ? ? causes, like, who will be the new CDU chair, who will get what ministry, and what the latest poll says about approvance rates for this or that particular party. 

[Lu]

Here in the Netherlands I am getting the impression that the institute that should be in charge of the outbreak response is a bit annoyed that the outbreak is distracting them from their work. Forgetting that such outbreaks are their work.

And so I find myself one of those citizens, who question their government institutions and thus make things more difficult for everyone.

[889]

"Temperatures in Lodi today (Italy's red zone) are between 3 and 10 degrees C. In Singapore (102 confirmed cases?) it's 32 degrees C."

 

And everyone in Singapore is freezing somewhere in a/c comfort. Remember,  places where people gather close together -- restaurants, churches, mass transit etc -- seem to breed contagion, and those places are downright freezing in Singapore.

 

[Jan Finster]

I wonder why the death rate in South Korea is so much lower than in China (outside Hubei) or Italy (?) 

[Shelley]

5 minutes ago, Jan Finster said:

I wonder why the death rate in South Korea

The death rate that is reported.

There is a big problem all over the world with reporting data, either because of ignorance or deliberate cover up. 

Some people will have been reported to have died of pneumonia rather than the coronavirus that caused it.

[Lu]

Death rate = number of dead : number of confirmed cases

Some possible explanations:

- Perhaps South Korea tests more people who cough and thus gets more confirmed cases, while more people who cough in China stay home without getting tested

- Perhaps care for the sick is better in South Korea than in China

- Perhaps in South Korea, more of the infected are people who are otherwise in decent health and thus have a bigger chance of recovery

No idea about Italy.

[Ruben von Zwack]

Quote

I wonder why the death rate in South Korea is so much lower than in China (outside Hubei) or Italy (?) 

The WHO guy adressed this. He said, people in Italy came in way too late, in the "severe" stage. Apparently, they weren't aware of the risk and only saw a doctor when their respiratory problems had already gotten really bad. While in other places, where people were more aware, they went to see a doctor in the light stage, or sometimes even without any symptoms at all.

This is super informative, if you manage it through. I split listening up into several mornings:
https://youtu.be/-o0q1XMRKYM

[ChTTay]

On 3/4/2020 at 3:38 AM, Jan Finster said:

Beijing officially has a 14-day quarantine period for travelers

Foreigners coming from abroad currently don’t need to quarantine (either at home or in a hotel) unless they come from a “severely affected country”. Teachers must quarantine regardless.
 

Don’t need to but ... probably still advisable to have a voluntary period of quarantine at home anyway.