Coronavirus - those in China, and general discussion

[mungouk]

Updated China IATA travel advisory as of today, 13 July:

 

TL;DR — no longer specifies specific tests (PCR/RNA) for passengers on arrival, although does say "subject to screening". Addition of section on WeChat mini-program for Chinese nationals.

 

 

Quote

 

Published 13.07.2020

 

1. The mainland of China has decided to temporarily suspend the entry into the mainland of China by foreign nationals holding visas or residence permits still valid to the time of this announcement, effective from 00:00 local time, 28 March 2020. Entry by foreign nationals with APEC Business Travel Cards will be suspended as well.

• Policies including port visas, 24/72/144-hour visa-free transit policy, Hainan 30-day visa-free policy, 15-day visa-free policy specified for foreign cruise-group-tour through Shanghai Port, Guangdong 144-hour visa-free policy specified for foreign tour groups from Hong Kong or Macao SAR, and Guangxi 15-day visa-free policy specified for foreign tour groups of ASEAN countries will also be temporarily suspended. Entry with diplomatic, service, courtesy or C visas will not be affected.
• Foreign nationals coming to the mainland of China for necessary economic, trade, scientific or technological activities or out of emergency humanitarian needs may apply for visas at Chinese embassies or consulates.
• Entry by foreign nationals with visas issued after this announcement will not be affected.

 

2. Passengers arriving at Beijing (PEK), Guangzhou (CAN), Shanghai Hongqiao (SHA), Shanghai Pudong (PVG), Shenzhen (SZX) or Xiamen (XMN) are subject to medical screening and quarantine for 14 days.

 

3. Airline crew of foreign airlines:

• are not required to undergo nucleic acid test if they have a short stay after landing then depart immediately, and do not leave apron during the transition; OR
• shall receive nucleic acid test in the first port of entry if they need to enter the country to rest or continue to operate domestic routes. The test results will be confirmed by the local government in accordance with the requirements of epidemic prevention management. Only if the test results are negative, crews can continue the operations; OR
• are allowed to return to their home country for isolation treatment when agreed by the local joint control mechanism, if they are symptomatic, in close contact with infected persons or tested positive. Airlines and crews shall make all commitments to bear their responsibilities and also carry out strict protections.

 

4. A completed “Health Declaration Form" must be presented upon arrival. The form can be obtained before departure at http://health.customsapp.com/ .

 

5. Nationals of China (People's Rep.) arriving from Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, Czechia, Denmark, France, Germany, Iran, Ireland (Rep.), Israel, Italy, Korea (Rep.), Malaysia, Netherlands, Norway, Philippines, Portugal, Russian Fed., Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Thailand, Turkey, United Kingdom and USA must declare their health status for 14 days in the Wechat mimi program "FANG YI JIAN KANG MA GUO JI BAN". A green QR code generated from the program must be presented before departure.

 

 

[mungouk]

@pan.kasper, @abcdefg ... Do you have any news or plans?

 

Here in the UK I think it's starting to sink in now — at least in some quarters — that this virus isn't going away soon, and that things are going to carry on being weird until we can get immunised by a tested vaccine.

 

Personally I'm still trying to get my head around the idea of going into enforced quarantine for 2 weeks so that I can do my job in the right timezone...

[889]

For international travel, I think the only hope till next Spring is that countries begin to recognise testing as a substitute for quarantine.

 

Greece Considers Opening to American Tourists by End of July

 

In Hong Kong, they've now tested tens of thousands of people arriving from overseas before they go into mandatory quarantine. As a result, they have very good statistics showing how worthwhile the quarantine is in catching infections that are missed through testing, though they haven't released the numbers. But offhand, I can't recall reports of more than a tiny handful who developed infection during quarantine after initially testing negative.

 

Of course testing will not catch every possible case. That's not a reasonable goal. To repeat what HK's Health Director has said, "Our target is not to achieve zero infection, but to control the [number of cases] to the level that our health care system can accommodate."

 

Nonetheless, there's been so much fear generated worldwide over the virus, that implementing a live-with-it strategy may be politically difficult. And closed borders are a convenient political way of saying the bogeyman lies outside the borders, not within.

[Flickserve]

1 hour ago, 889 said:

that implementing a live-with-it strategy may be politically difficult.

 

I'm not sure of this.

 

People realise that there are so many infections across the world, an elimination policy now is really impractical. It was possible before but certain countries have decided to let the virus pass through.

 

That doesn't mean abandoning what is done now. It means accepting that we have to live with the virus popping up its head periodically. Life will never be the same again.

 

Air travel will be severely curtailed long term. 

[889]

I agree that a learn-to-live-with-it strategy is the right approach, but in Asia/Australasia in particular there seems to be a lower-the-floodgates mentality, and that makes me very pessimistic about any re-openings in the region in foreseeable time. Maybe Bali because it's so dependent on tourism, but with Australia banning outbound tourism, there's little point in Bali re-opening. N America and Europe seem a lot more flexible.

[Shelley]

24 minutes ago, Flickserve said:

Life will never be the same again.

I think a vaccine will return life to normal as we remember it. Still a new normal but a more relaxed new normal.

[Flickserve]

17 minutes ago, Shelley said:

a vaccine will return life to normal as we remember it. Still a new normal but a more relaxed new normal.

 

The common cold is a coronavirus. We don't have vaccines for it because it mutates very quickly. I suspect covid 19 will also mutate quickly.

 

Perhaps a vaccine covid 19 will be more commercially viable. That's the hope.

[ChTTay]

Schools here in Beijing have started the application process to get some overseas teachers back. I don’t know too much about it but I’ve heard it’s a long process with lots of steps. Unless things change drastically here I don’t imagine those applying would actually make it for the start of the semester (which might be online anyway). 

[889]

Are schools offering extra inducements ($) to get teachers to go through all the hoops and come to China, especially given the risk that Autumn might see a repeat of lockdowns and closures? I would have thought that recruiting teaching staff would be extraordinarily difficult these days, absent really big inducements ($$$).

[ChTTay]

8 hours ago, 889 said:

Are schools offering extra inducements ($) to get teachers to go through all the hoops and come to China, especially given the risk that Autumn might see a repeat of lockdowns and closures?

Nah, more like come back or lose your job. 

[889]

That's interesting. Of course some will have personal situations drawing them back to China, but I would have thought the rest would just face reality and move on.

 

 

[Flickserve]

Alternatively, jobs in English speaking countries might be hard to come by now so a decent paying job teaching English lockdown or no lockdown is a fair inducement.

 

The China method of controlling disease outbreaks may be regarded as draconian but safer than the perceived lack of social distancing, social considerations and chaotic policies compared to some other countries. 

[mungouk]

1 hour ago, Flickserve said:

jobs in English speaking countries might be hard to come by now

 

Exactly. I can only speak for the UK, but the outlook here is pretty bleak right now, especially with Brexit happening on top of COVID, and what's predicted to be the biggest recession in 300 years. Thousands of job losses are being announced almost every day.

 

My sector (university education) is not as badly exposed as, say, retail or hospitality, but projections are already saying up to 13 public universities (out of around 150) could go bust this year.  

 

If even half of that turns out to happen then that particular job market is going to be brutal for a year at least.

 

So returning via quarantine to China, which is doing a far better job at managing the virus than the UK, and sitting all this out while getting decent pay is looking surprisingly reasonable right now.  

 

 

[ChTTay]

Many schools will likely absorb some of the costs of returning (visas and paperwork etc) and a minority at the top end might even pay for flights. Unless you’re already in China already AND in the job market then it’s unlikely you’d get financial incentive. Even then I’ve seen some crazy job advertisements for a 1 semester contract. Who would go for that I’m not sure. 
 

If you’re already contracted then there won’t be anything extra. As above, if you want your job (and salary) then come back. 

[abcdefg]

On 7/13/2020 at 3:49 PM, mungouk said:

@abcdefg ... Do you have any news or plans?

 

我放弃了。Don't think I will ever be able to move back. And it will be a long time before I'm even allowed a quick visit. 

 

Still trying to figure out a way to get important things from my Kunming apartment boxed up and sent to me here in Texas. 

[mungouk]

Really sorry to hear that @abcdefg... And moving out of your home is stressful enough when you're there on the ground, never mind doing it from the other side of the world.

 

Stay safe in Texas.  Here's to happier times when can roam free again.

 

 

[ChTTay]

14 hours ago, abcdefg said:

Still trying to figure out a way to get important things from my Kunming apartment boxed up and sent to me here in Texas. 

There are Moving/removal companies that will do everything for you. This can including storing things if necessary. You would just need to arrange someone to let them in. Depending on how much stuff you have it can be fairly ok price wise (from what I’ve heard). I guess the issue might be doing it from Kunming. I am not sure if these companies are concentrated on the East coast more. 

[889]

Not surprisingly, though, sending household goods back to the U.S. can be more of a hassle because of the U.S. customs paperwork. You really need a mover who knows how to fill out the forms right.

[889]

U.S. Weighs Sweeping Travel Ban on Chinese Communist Party Members

 

"The presidential proclamation, still in draft form, could also authorize the United States government to revoke the visas of party members and their families who are already in the country, leading to their expulsion."

 

In fact, the U.S. has, with some exceptions, long barred Communist Party members as immigrants:

 

"Any immigrant who is or has been a member of or affiliated with the Communist or any other totalitarian party (or subdivision or affiliate thereof), domestic or foreign, is inadmissible."

 

[ChTTay]

Some movement with visas for returnees as seen here. 
 

The same sort of info from colleagues and colleagues of friends as well.