Keats and LTL Language School Online

[Jan Finster]

On 7/2/2022 at 3:35 PM, suMMit said:

I don't really want  grammar explanations. If it's a bit and in Chinese, that's OK. Mostly I just want to practice speaking, using the things I've learned lately. Something that gets me talking and a bit of correction. Grammar points I feel are easier just to read on my own for free. 

 

To be fair then you do not really need a Chinese teacher, but just someone happy to chat (e.g. tandem partner).

[PerpetualChange]

One thing I will say - the quality of tutor on Preply seems very hit or miss. 

Met with one for the first time in almost a year a few days ago, and while there initially prepared materials, it quickly devolved into conversation and "I think you don't need materials, let's just chat". I, perhaps foolishly, bought 5 more weeks of lessons, so we'll see if it improves. The the LTL staff actually have education backgrounds, that would be a good start. 

 

 

 

[suMMit]

On 7/3/2022 at 12:33 AM, Jan Finster said:

To be fair then you do not really need a Chinese teacher, but just someone happy to chat (e.g. tandem partner).

Well thats incorrect imo. I never said I wanted a "chat". I follow a textbook, but I don't need the teacher to "explain" what is already explained in the textbook. A good language teacher(for speaking at least) imo does not lecture you on grammar. A good language teacher facilitates you to USE certain grammar/vocab or whatever you're working on while speaking. They point out some things you can improve, encourage you and put you in spots where you need to use the language. I guess for language, I want a teacher who's more like a coach. But hey, I'm sure there are many who like a good grammar lecture. And personally, at an intermediate level, I refuse to pay a native Chinese speaker to speak English with me, simple as that.

 

A teacher telling you to read a dialog out loud and then translating key words into English for you(sometimes wrongly or not entirely correctly), and then explaining the grammar point to you in English... That is not my idea of a good language lesson. 

 

**Edit to say my opinion is related only to taking lessons to improve speaking skills and pronunciation. I don't hire a teacher to learn characters, reading, writing(other than homework), vocabulary, or extended grammar lectures. I find it better to work on these aspects on my own.

[suMMit]

On 7/3/2022 at 12:49 AM, PerpetualChange said:

One thing I will say - the quality of tutor on Preply seems very hit or miss. 

In my personal opinion, 95% of Chinese teachers(on any platform) I've had lessons with suck. 99% of them are friendly and nice, but they do not know how to facilitate language learning. And most of them put in very little/no time into preparing anything for a lesson.

[abcdefg]

On 7/2/2022 at 11:52 AM, suMMit said:

A good language teacher facilitates you to USE certain grammar/vocab or whatever you're working on while speaking. They point out some things you can improve, encourage you and put you in spots where you need to use the language. I guess for language, I want a teacher who's more like a coach.

 

I'm in this camp and have been for a long time. 

 

Tennis coach will soon discover my backhand is weak when I have to run cross court to reach the ball even though it's solid when I'm standing more or less still. So guess what he or she does to help me improve that weakness? Sets up multiple situations in which I am forced to work through those shots that are not strong for me. Obvious ones first, then subtle ones. Progressive levels of difficulty. Drills them until they become second nature for me and the weakness is gradually improved, eventually corrected. 

 

Quote

99% of them are friendly and nice, but they do not know how to facilitate language learning.

 

I'm willing to pay a pro who knows how to set up situations that facilitate the learning process. Over the years, I've  become less tolerant of bumbling, if well-intentioned, attempts. 

[PerpetualChange]

If things aren't moving at a good pace by the second lesson it's time to pull the plug.@suMMit that's a great observation and I really need to take it into advisement to be less of a softy. I let a very nice tutor give disappoiting lessons for months before I finally pulled the plug. Going forward I think I will institute a 2 strikes rule. Because the first lesson is always more about getting to know you and appraisal. If things aren't moving at a good clip by the second lesson then it's time to pull the plug. 

 

At least preply let you transfer credits, not sure about the other platforms.

[suMMit]

I thought I would update my review as I recently re-started LTL classes after a long break. I basically studied HSK 4 on my own(along with Zero to Hero) and after finishing the books, I decided to try and "consolidate"(if that's possible) with some LTL Flexi classes. I burned through the first small subscription very quickly and was happy with the classes so I bought 100 credits, as it's a much better deal that way. Since April I've taken one class a day (around 65 classes) of Hsk 4 and 4+. I will be moving on to the Hsk 5 Flexi classes soon.

 

In my past reviews I was pretty on the fence, I'm more positive this time around. What I realized for me, is having consistent lessons, at least a few times a week, is very beneficial. Even more important than whether a particular teacher is "perfect" or not. I still get a lot out of it. So here's my updated Pros and Cons:

 

Pros:

-Extremely easy (no trying to find a teacher on italki, no matching schedules, no deciding what they should teach me)

-Good value, especially if credits bought in quantity

-All the material is laid out on a pdf, all I need to do is book it and download the pdf and audio file and preview it

-Can book the units in whatever order I want (ie. I can skip the Spring Festival lesson for now and do it in January)

-I can easily repeat lessons that we're really useful or difficult, can go back or forward to an earlier/later hsk level to practice a particular point/topic

-The material is solid, structured, with well chosen vocab is recycled and also modern(ie lessons on apps, online shopping, shared bikes, covid etc)

-The material is different from the Hsk Standard Course, so they can compliment each other

-Lot's of different teachers (different accents, approaches, can repeat the same lesson with a different teacher)

-Many of the teachers are very good, all are friendly

-Teachers are familiar with the material

-Very smooth interface

-24/7 lessons

-Usually end up being the only student (good value), but when another joins it can also be more fun/social

-Can download an annotated pdf with all the notes after the class

-Connection is almost always good

-If a teacher is sick or has something come up, they will usually find another teacher

-The "Free speaking" and "Speaking with the natives" discussion classes are useful practice, with a clear topic to discuss but not tied to some grammar point

-Free week of face to face classes in BJ, SH, (or wherever they have schools) if you rate 100 classes

 

Cons:

-Not all the teachers use my ideal methodology, some are a bit "talky" for me. (I still learn though and it's still practice no matter)

-Can't chose which teacher will take your class (though if you really don't like one, you can cancel it before your credit is taken)

-Sometimes the lesson content is over-ambitious and too much for a single lesson (in those cases I can take it again)

-Sometimes another student in the class could be at a very different ability

 

Maybe the biggest Pro for me is that I'm forced to focus on Chinese for a full hour with no distractions, and have interaction. Not to mention an hour of previewing the material and then reviewing it afterwards. And repeat that several times a week. WITHOUT too much "Admin".  I'm definitely more positive this time around and I'm going to do all of Hsk 5 and 5+  Flexi classes.

 

 

 

 

[language_lover]

I got back in Flexi classes recently also. I feel the overall package has improved. Actually started to learn Korean and Japanese on the side because the subscription caters all languages which is helpful.

 

The biggest con though remains you cannot select a teacher. I've played with iTalki and Preply too, and had a very mixed bag there. The same will be true on any platform.

 

I'd always rather study at an official language school with actual teachers but that comes down to personal preference.

[zhouhaochen]

On 7/2/2023 at 7:11 PM, suMMit said:

I'm more positive this time around

thanks

 

On 9/10/2024 at 7:29 AM, language_lover said:

I got back in Flexi classes recently also.

and thanks also

 

One thing I would like to mention is that LTL Online Chinese Classes and LTL Flexi Classes are not the same.

LTL Online Classes are fixed time "traditional" online 1on1 Mandarin classes, where students study at a fixed time, always with the same teacher.

 

LTL Flexi Classes are a special scheduling system where students can study group or 1on1  Mandarin classes 24/7, do not need to follow any kind of schedule, cancel classes easily, schedule new ones at any time and follow the Flexi Classes curriculum.

 

There are also fixed time group classes, which are administered through the Flexi Classes system, where a student can book group classes at fixed times and always with the same teacher following a course. It is possible to also cancel classes and re-book them as with normal Flexi Classes, but these might not be with the same teacher (which can be good as it is good to get used to different accents and styles of teaching).